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[Neonivek]

It was never alright for those other games to release a buggy unfinished version 1.0 either.

The fact that a lot of people release unfinished games is a bane. No one looked at Rome Total War 2 and went "well it is buggy and unfinished and many of its features don't work. But it is justified because they can keep developing it"

A game with "continuous development" sure is never a "finished product" so to speak... but then version 1.0 would simply be the version where if the game suddenly stopped all development they would be satisfied with what they did. It is the version where if they had to ship it out on dvd, that they would be fine with.

So tell me, with what Starbound has right now. Would you be satisfied with its current state? As in no content updates, no mods, nothing else added...

[Retropunch]

1.0 is seen on the whole as the release version. No semantic wranglings are going to get round it. It's called version 1 due to binary (you go from 0 to 1). Of course development doesn't finish at that, all sorts of games have tons of patches afterwards that add a lot of content in. but version 1 is THE RELEASE VERSION. There's no two ways about it.

More to the point, Tiy was saying this within the context of 1.0 being the release version. So regardless of if you think version 1.0 is the release version and the point Tiy was making was that he felt it would be ready.

[Neonivek]

Of which I am rightfully saying that if Tiy thinks what Starbound has is a "good release" he is sorely mistaken.

To release a incomplete game at version 1... is releasing a incomplete game as the full release.

Sure I can cough into a napkin and release that as version 1.0 to the greatest game of all time. Anything can be released as a 1.0... That doesn't mean it is justified.

[Scripten]

Well, we tried...

*sigh*

[Reverie]

Well, we tried...

*sigh*

What's wrong?

[Evilsx]

Well, we tried...

*sigh*

What's wrong?

No worry, just grab an cup of tea over there and rest with the rest of us that just gave up trying to talk about starbound then the background

[Neonivek]

Well, there was the alternative Starbound topic I tried to put up. I could always start that up again.

[Retropunch]

Well, there was the alternative Starbound topic I tried to put up. I could always start that up again.

Please don't. As with all threads, this will ebb and flow from development to gameplay talk. Just look at the Clockwork empires threat. Granted, it hasn't got as much attention as this, but this is obviously what people want to talk about in regards to starbound, and doing another 'You can only talk about this' threat just doesn't do anyone any good.

[Neonivek]

Well, there was the alternative Starbound topic I tried to put up. I could always start that up again.

Please don't. As with all threads, this will ebb and flow from development to gameplay talk. Just look at the Clockwork empires threat. Granted, it hasn't got as much attention as this, but this is obviously what people want to talk about in regards to starbound, and doing another 'You can only talk about this' threat just doesn't do anyone any good.

It was a "you can't talk about anything but the game itself" topic. It only closed down last time because of trolling.

[Scripten]

Well, we tried...

*sigh*

What's wrong?

Sorry, was supposed to be a joke. Intent conveyed through text and all that. Was hoping to be able to talk about the game for a page or two before we got back to the regularly scheduled programming.

@Neonivek: Not really necessary. Obviously a lot more people are concerned about the company stuff than the game design, which is fine. It's just difficult to get opinions on the parts of the game that interest me, namely the design-based blog posts.

[Sean Mirrsen]

A game with "continuous development" sure is never a "finished product" so to speak... but then version 1.0 would simply be the version where if the game suddenly stopped all development they would be satisfied with what they did. It is the version where if they had to ship it out on dvd, that they would be fine with.

So tell me, with what Starbound has right now. Would you be satisfied with its current state? As in no content updates, no mods, nothing else added...

An interesting question, considering that just leaving it as is wasn't even alluded to in this case. But, to answer the question: Satisfied with its current state? No. The same could be said for a whole lot of ready-released games, that are by many definitions "complete". I am also quite dissatisfied with the current state of Stardrive, I'm pretty unhappy at Terraria, I have a lot of bad things to say for most of the tactical battle mode of Sword of the Stars II, the strategic mode of Fallen Enchantress and the entirety of XCOM:Enemy Within, and don't get me started on Cortex Command. That's not to say that I wouldn't still play, and still have fun with what the game - all of those games - have to offer.

The reason why games in "constant development" almost never have a "version 1.0" is exactly because development never really stops.
But read that line of Tiy's again, and notice the "outside of Early Access" part that you missed. If there was no Early Access, the first version you'd get would be Version 1.0. Whether the development of the game stops or not, if it starts with a non-beta release, it will have to start with an 1.0. The game, as it is right now, is incomplete, but is playable enough to work as that initial release. Simple as that.

[Neonivek]

I understand what you mean Sean, I am just saying... that is where "Really Tiy really?" comes from.

Its still a dumb thing for Tiy to say either way.

Or rather "How is that any better Sean Mirrsen?"

[Greenbane]

This is why having a design plan/roadmap is important. Without goals or objectives, any version can be 1.0, and I feel every "early access" title should have a clear development plan, with a well-defined "finish line".

That way devs show responsibility, and people know what to expect.

Without well-defined phases and a final goal, terminology is meaningless: alpha means nothing, beta means nothing, release means nothing, and the whole process boils down to an undisciplined "we'll keep working on this until we get bored, lose motivation and/or have dug ourselves a hole and call it 1.0, regardless of the game's state at that point". It's exceedingly unprofessional.

[Neonivek]

But Starbound does have a "road map" so to speak.

If they hit version 1.0 and there is no, terraforming for example...

[Oneir]

Huh, I was going to say "Actually, they literally do have a roadmap" but it looks like they took that off their website. Some time after the Kickstarter, I guess?

As to the "Novakids start with guns" topic: might be interesting. If Novakids can't make melee weapons you either have a broken experience (guns are too weak/too strong) or a different experience and an incentive to be friends with people playing other races. I wonder what you could add/change to give the other races distinct niches?