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Author Topic: Starbound - We have lift off.  (Read 997209 times)

Flying Dice

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4125 on: December 06, 2013, 07:05:01 pm »

The issue is, Terraria was a linear grindfest, and nobody seemed to mind that. If the fact that you can jump planets is what's causing people to dismiss this as non sandboxy, then starbound may as well literally be terraria 2.0, as that was the big THING that was differentiating it.

I think planets could use a bit more variation, and they could work on making every planet worthwhile on some level, so you have more of a reason to hang around and actually dig around a little to find goodies, because I definitely agree it's ab ummer to run over the top of the planet, raid all the structures, and teleport out, but it's not like there isn't treasure underground, there's just a lot more of it above ground.

If treasure scaled with depth, I feel like it would do a lot more to encourage hanging out on particular planets for more then a surface tour.

Actually, Terraria only gained that after the Hardmode update. Prior to that it was possible to tackle things pretty much however you wanted, and sequence-break easily with a touch of creative thought. There was only one real locked-in bit of progression, and that was hellstone mining. Hardmode Terraria is exactly what I was hoping Starbound wouldn't be like; the only things that redeemed Terraria at all for that were the decent construction system, fucking about in multiplayer, and the fact that you could get an inveditor instead of repeating grind.

One of the biggest places where Starbound is lacking is construction; there's literally no reason to build when:

1. You can't craft or scan->print the vast majority of the interesting blocks, your only choice is to build in cobblestone or strip-mine a bunch of facilities.
2. The moment you make it to the next tier, your homeworld becomes irrelevant and you'll never visit it again.
3. You don't need to spend more time on any world than it takes to dig down and get a few hundred of the ore for that tier.


A large chunk of the problems would be solved if there were no sectors, and if there weren't any hardcoded locks on progression. It'd be great if you could conceivably take a brand new character onto a level 35 deathworld and scrape out enough ore to make a really cool sword, etc. A big help to that would be dismantling the shit AP/Armor system in favor of a HP-based system, and changing the tiers from straight upgrades into different types of specializations. Also, craftable ranged weapons.
2.
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The Darkling Wolf

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4126 on: December 06, 2013, 07:05:02 pm »

Just made a hunting knife.

Spoiler: Come at me bitch (click to show/hide)
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etgfrog

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4127 on: December 06, 2013, 07:07:35 pm »

Yeah, it's a fundamental problem, not a superficial one. No amount of work will make a linear grindfest into a freeform sandbox. A good linear grindfest, maybe, but if I wanted one of those there are plenty of other, better candidates.

Oh, and tier 3+ are meaningless. The armor and weapons for each successive tier are just +1 armor/AP.
The problem is that the scaling goes way too quick, a 5 level difference in equipment means your doing half damage to enemies and taking 8.5 times as much damage, it should be twice as much damage but I'll see after the next patch.

To be fair...I think they should add randomly generated armor that appears from npcs and zone bosses. That would mitigate some of the grinding aspect of the game.
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Elephant Parade

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4128 on: December 06, 2013, 07:08:42 pm »

-snip-
A large chunk of the problems would be solved if there were no sectors, and if there weren't any hardcoded locks on progression. It'd be great if you could conceivably take a brand new character onto a level 35 deathworld and scrape out enough ore to make a really cool sword, etc. A big help to that would be dismantling the shit AP/Armor system in favor of a HP-based system, and changing the tiers from straight upgrades into different types of specializations. Also, craftable ranged weapons.
2.

I think that the reason for the AP/Armour system is so that it seems different than Terraria. Not that it needs it, in my opinion. It's not like having a few systems be similar would be the end of the world.
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azurelao

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4129 on: December 06, 2013, 07:25:14 pm »

Does anyone have coordinates for a Gamma sector gun seller?

In return, coordinates: http://pastebin.com/1t61k2eu
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timferius

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4130 on: December 06, 2013, 07:29:28 pm »

Looks like they're redoing the leveling/armour curve. I'm trying to find the details on their forum but I can't seem to find the post he references in the patch notes.
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SharpKris

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4131 on: December 06, 2013, 07:46:57 pm »

Does anyone have coordinates for a Gamma sector gun seller?

In return, coordinates: http://pastebin.com/1t61k2eu

this is fantastic
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Knight of Fools

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4132 on: December 06, 2013, 07:47:31 pm »

I sure hope so. That's one of the most frustrating parts of the game. It's like every enemy's a mini boss fight.


In other news, I threw together a quick video of a humorous way to raid a village.
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Flying Dice

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4133 on: December 06, 2013, 07:53:00 pm »

-snip-
A large chunk of the problems would be solved if there were no sectors, and if there weren't any hardcoded locks on progression. It'd be great if you could conceivably take a brand new character onto a level 35 deathworld and scrape out enough ore to make a really cool sword, etc. A big help to that would be dismantling the shit AP/Armor system in favor of a HP-based system, and changing the tiers from straight upgrades into different types of specializations. Also, craftable ranged weapons.
2.

I think that the reason for the AP/Armour system is so that it seems different than Terraria. Not that it needs it, in my opinion. It's not like having a few systems be similar would be the end of the world.

To be honest, that's a really shitty reason, especially when the AP/armor system itself is so shit. Even if they revamped it, it would still be shit. There's a reason why pretty much every game with progression using scaling HP (or the equivalent) as a base: it works. In Starbound as it stands, either you one-hit enemies that can't hurt you or are OHKOed by enemies you can't hurt (without cheesing with blocks). That is a direct result of the AP/Armor system. It's neither simple enough nor complex enough to function well.

I'd like to see something like this:

-HP scales based on level for monsters. Each mob type, when generated, includes a HP value from somewhere within the range for that level of normal mob. For example, a level 1 mob variant, when generated, may have a HP value somewhere in the range of 80-120HP. All of that "species" of mob would have the same HP value. Again, a level 50 mob would have, say, a HP value somewhere in the range of 800-1200HP (purely hypothetical).

-HP scales for players based on exploration and trade (can find items or buy items from traders to permanently increase HP up to a set cap); strength of items increased based on the level of the planet: a level 1 planet might give you items that boost HP by +2, while a level 25 planet could give ones that add +15 or something. You could work progression in here, by requiring certain things be accomplished to build HP beyond certain marks

-A similar scaling damage system for mobs and looted weapons.

-Crafted weapons which scale damage based on a player attribute, rather than the ore used, once you're past steel. So for example have a quest to improve spearcrafting, which increases the base damage of all player-crafted spears. Scatter a ton of these around the galaxy, both in the form of NPCs and in found lore. Make the ores past steel give different specialized attributes to their equipment, rather than flat progression. For example, let some mobs be generated with armor as a special trait, and have durasteel weapons have an armor-piercing effect. Have crafted Cerulium weapons get a random effect associated with ice or bubbles. Give Rubium weapons a damage bonus against large-sized mobs. Give the different armors different stats and set effects. Stuff like that.

-Again, get rid of sectors and intermix all the planets into a single zone. Let people access every ore at once after they get, say, a silver pick, provided they're good/lucky/thoughtful enough to do it.


It's so easy to make this better it isn't even funny. I honestly don't know what they were thinking.


e: Also, it took me two days to get from a new character to steel. It took me two hours to get from Aegisalt to Impervium to playing Smooth Criminal on a steel drum.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 08:01:40 pm by Flying Dice »
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hemmingjay

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4134 on: December 06, 2013, 08:03:31 pm »

Yeah, it's a fundamental problem, not a superficial one. No amount of work will make a linear grindfest into a freeform sandbox. A good linear grindfest, maybe, but if I wanted one of those there are plenty of other, better candidates.

Oh, and tier 3+ are meaningless. The armor and weapons for each successive tier are just +1 armor/AP.

Doesn't it turn into a freeform sandbox after you max out?
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fivex

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4135 on: December 06, 2013, 08:07:28 pm »


-HP scales for players based on exploration and trade (can find items or buy items from traders to permanently increase HP up to a set cap); strength of items increased based on the level of the planet: a level 1 planet might give you items that boost HP by +2, while a level 25 planet could give ones that add +15 or something. You could work progression in here, by requiring certain things be accomplished to build HP beyond certain marks
This seems to be the intention; you have an HP stat.
Also, do note that everything beyond aegisalt is a placeholder.
I do agree with most of your points, though
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Seriyu

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4136 on: December 06, 2013, 08:09:40 pm »

There is a balance fix incoming, will be interesting to see how well things work afterwords.

Flying Dice

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4137 on: December 06, 2013, 08:13:03 pm »

Yeah, it's a fundamental problem, not a superficial one. No amount of work will make a linear grindfest into a freeform sandbox. A good linear grindfest, maybe, but if I wanted one of those there are plenty of other, better candidates.

Oh, and tier 3+ are meaningless. The armor and weapons for each successive tier are just +1 armor/AP.

Doesn't it turn into a freeform sandbox after you max out?

Sort of, which is workable enough when it only takes a few hours to max out. I'm liking it more now that I have and I'm a bit more free to screw around, but there are still points where it grates.
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Twi

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4138 on: December 06, 2013, 08:20:12 pm »

I would like... for people to jot down the location of various goodies around different planets.  Just simple stuff, like the coordinates and the type of structure, penal colonies, airship mooring, Glitch bunkers, etc.


There's a thread on the official forums in Beta Discussion that's exactly that.

Also:

Floran make ship! Replace ugly techy sstuff with something more familiar. ((Stilll need more decorations, but meh!)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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LeoLeonardoIII

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Re: Starbound - We have lift off.
« Reply #4139 on: December 06, 2013, 08:23:07 pm »

The spikey vines make it go faster.
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