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Author Topic: Were too start, programing  (Read 2074 times)

Jaylow

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Were too start, programing
« on: January 20, 2012, 12:55:18 pm »

Hi i am starting to  get very interested in programing and would like to  make a nice game  one day..

i have a book C++ for dummies from 2000.. and i was wondering if this book is out of date
the software on the CD is for sure out of date

anyway i have no idea were to start, what languages i should use to program in
what compiler i need to use
so i was wondering if any of you could guide me in the right direction
where to start, some basic documentation about programing in general

i am really new at this, i know HTML/css  but well  that is nothing like  C++/python

i followed a tutorial roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php/Complete_Roguelike_Tutorial,_using_python%2Blibtcod,_part_1
and i can  type over the code, and understand a bit what is what, but in general i really don't have a clue how it works
and where to place code and all that



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Il Palazzo

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2012, 01:04:55 pm »

I have to say I don't know much about programming, apart from C64's BASIC language. Still, here's my twopence:

If your connection is good enough to watch some videos(I hear you live in a cabin or something), then take a look at one of these:
http://academicearth.org/subjects/computer-science
Complete courses on programming from introductory ones to I_don't_know_what_they're_talking_about. They'll guide you to materials and course books worth looking up too.


Also, here's an online edition of "Programming in Lua", which, I'm told, is a pretty good language.
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Jaylow

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2012, 01:27:40 pm »

i sadly cant watch any streaming video's online because i life somewhat in the middle of a forest  have very bad connection / prepay internet
and i have half of the year no internet cause i cant effort it...

and thanks for the "Programming in Lua" book  will take a look at it and try it out

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MorleyDev

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2012, 02:41:44 pm »

iTunes U has some recordings of lectures on programming from a few universities that you may want to check out ^^
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Twiggie

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2012, 09:39:00 am »

try this. its an introductory course from MIT, so I'm guessing its pretty good.
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Ghills

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2012, 09:55:38 am »

Stanford has many free online courses for computers.  Here's their CS 101 course: http://www.cs101-class.org/

It sounds like you need some general programming knowledge and an easy to use language.  Python is slower than other languages, but it's an easy language to start with. I recommend downloading Dive Into Python and working through it, then just start trying to do things with Python until you get comfortable with programming: http://www.diveintopython.net/

Some ideas for programming challenges:
If you have Internet access, Google has programming challenges.  Also, Project Euler is good: http://projecteuler.net/

If you don't have Internet access, try thinking of something you'd really like to do on your computer and then program it.  Anything you'd like to see automated. I started using Python to make a save game editor for an obscure indie game I liked.  Anything you can think of.   What are you interested in doing with code?

If you want something more challenging, I'd try C#.  You can get 2 different IDEs for free (Visual Studio Express or Mono) and it's a nice compromise between speed and fussy low-level thinking.  Also, it works well for websites so it's a marketable skill (Python kind of isn't).
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Muz

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2012, 07:38:21 am »

I'm going to plug my university's programming course too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hE7l6Adoiiw&feature=BFa&list=SP6B940F08B9773B9F&lf=list_related

While it's not MIT, it's still a good world-class course, and one of the more advanced ones in the uni, so you're not missing out. The lecturer has a good sense of humor, the course has a lot of interesting guest lectures as well. Even though I've transferred that whole course, I learned a lot from rewatching those courses, and I still enjoy them to TV.

Maybe watch the first hour of lecture and see if you like the intro. It starts off a bit slow (the 'Hello World' program is only at lecture 4), but as the lecturer says, it's a course on programming, not just a programming language. It'll teach you a few tricks and programming philosophy that many books don't highlight.


Also, yeah, I think Python is a good language to start off with. C(++) is is a little harder and most of the advantages of C aren't that great for most starting programmers.
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Il Palazzo

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2012, 07:48:40 am »

In case people missed the man saying so, he can't watch videos. Sure, there's sometimes transcripts, but these're not necessarily the best way of approaching the subject.
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Twiggie

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2012, 08:35:59 am »

how come everyone else is lucky enough to have proper english speaking lecturers who have advanced past the OHP stage? :(
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Muz

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2012, 10:41:42 pm »

In case people missed the man saying so, he can't watch videos. Sure, there's sometimes transcripts, but these're not necessarily the best way of approaching the subject.

Heh, I missed that. You can still stream videos, just leave Youtube on for half a day to download it while you do other stuff, as you won't really watch more than an hour a day. Unless you're paying for it by data use, where videos are a bad idea.

Not really a fan of learning programming from books, though. It's like learning a language from a book, you get the grammar and syntax and stuff, but not pronunciation, good habits, get corrected on bad habits, etc. I'm especially skeptical on the stuff like "C++ for dummies" because they normally just teach the language. I remember using a few of those Dummies book for technical stuff and it never helped as it just didn't go into enough depth. I can't really recommend classes either, as a lot of them are no different from books. University is good, as you have real programmers with experience pointing out common mistakes.


So, yeah, I'd say learn Python by yourself. Find examples and dissect them, preferably after trying to do what those examples try to do first. Some people recommend Haskell as a first language, but I never learned it myself.

I'd discourage C as a first language if you're learning it by yourself; C is a difficult language that's a bitch with a lot of things. You'll make a lot of mistakes, C won't tell you (and do a half-assed job at fixing them). You'll spend days/weeks debugging it, where an experienced programmer will be able to spot that you left out a semicolon or ampersand or used pointers all wrong. A lot of the more modern languages are more forgiving of mistakes and abstract out stuff, and have similar speed (just less control). C is more of a language that has nearly the control of Assembly, while not being as damn unreadable, which is why it's so popular.

And hey, don't give and don't take shortcuts. It takes only a few hours to program something and a few days to debug it. Or a day to write pseudocode, a few minutes to program, and a few hours to debug. Programming has a rather steep learning curve, but once you get your first language, the others are relatively easier.


how come everyone else is lucky enough to have proper english speaking lecturers who have advanced past the OHP stage? :(

Eh, not really. Lecturers are often chosen on their ability to research rather than teach. In fact, my relatives/friends who went to Harvard/MIT say that going to the best colleges doesn't mean you get the best teachers. You just get the ones who (really) know what they're talking about and those who can give you harder exams.

The really charismatic/dedicated lecturers usually teach first year subjects, where some people go in knowing nothing, and need really good teachers to pick it up and catch up with more experienced students.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 02:07:35 am by Muz »
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Valid_Dark

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2012, 04:25:16 am »

For learning c++ I tried ebooks and I tried online tuts, but none were really that amazing.  Then I found this book at my local bookstore, ”c++ programming : program design including data structures” by d.s. Malik, and it is beyond amazing and is by far the only thing I could feel good about recommending.

I'm on page 363 out of 1550 and started messing around with sdl,
I'm 3 days into sdl and am almost done with my first game.
(the book doesnt cover sdl, when I finish my game going back to c++)
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shadenight123

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2012, 10:55:32 am »

mmm since it seems relevant: to start using programs like maya/after effects/3ds? where should one go on starting? (saw that video of "Revenge" made as a parody of usher, the idea never left my head)
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Valid_Dark

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2012, 03:07:21 pm »

pick a program and start reading online tutorials online.  On my old computer I had some pretty good links to 3ds tutorials that I dont want to rediscover, so you're on your own
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eerr

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2012, 08:35:37 pm »

Buy a reference manual for your language, that lists relevant functions.
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Muz

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Re: Were too start, programing
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2012, 03:59:52 am »

mmm since it seems relevant: to start using programs like maya/after effects/3ds? where should one go on starting? (saw that video of "Revenge" made as a parody of usher, the idea never left my head)

Yeah, I tried to learn 3DS at one time. There are a lot of great tutorials. Just follow them. I don't recall where I got mine, but it might have been from the help file. Maya doesn't have much built-in help.

And with any kind of art, you have to practice it. A lot. As in thousands of hours of practice, like learning to play a musical instrument. Modeling, bones, animation, textures, all are even full time specializations for some people.

I'd say that 3D work isn't really worth the effort if you just want to make cartoons and stuff... good old pixel animation works a lot faster. It probably is worth it if you have the time to get over the learning curve and want to do a lot of animating (as opposed to drawing things that don't move), or something that looks photorealistic. But you might enjoy it whether or not you get something from it, just like lots of people enjoy learning the piano even if they never actually write songs.
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