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[C4lv1n]

I just started a new fort in a nice place (Cold, major river which I can easily modify to make an awesome moat, lots of trees to burn, plenty of grazing area) and I'm now working on getting magma for forges. I looked at the pump stack and magma piston articles but is there really any point?

Even if magma is 100z levels down couldn't I just build a stairway top to bottom? If moving up/down a z level takes the same time as regular horizontal movement then it won't be to much for my smiths to be working down there and then come up to eat/drink/sleep. Of course the bar stockpiles would have to be down there with them but I see no reason to even put food/drink stockpiles down there.

What do you guys think?

[Telgin]

I've never tested it, but I suspect that vertical movement is indeed as fast as horizontal movement.

I've also never used magma for forges before (gasp), but I suspect that it wouldn't be a big deal to just have the forges and smelters down there and just have the dwarves come up to eat and drink like every one else.

The possible complications to this would be that it would increase the time needed to haul materials down there / haul things up too.  Still probably not a huge deal, but having some smaller stockpiles of food, drink and raw materials near the forges would help productivity.  By how much?  Not sure, and unless you obsess over it probably not really enough to be game breaking.

[krenshala]

From an efficiency standpoint, you would want an entire living quarters block at your on-site magma smelting site so they don't need to travel top to bottom to work/eat/sleep/etc (haulers would move foodstuffs down/refuse and items up).

From a "can it be done" point of view, you are correct.

As for pump stacks and pistons ... we (and I mean collectively, since I haven't taken the time to get that ambitious in a fort yet) do them because we can and, of course, for !!science!!.

[bombzero]

i find it intensely irritating to have to wait for stuff to be moved down to mt forges/up to my fort.

[doublestrafe]

You can also dig out a giant vertical shaft (carefully, if you like your miners), designate it as a garbage dump, and dump your ores into it to make a quantum stockpile at the bottom.

Actually...can you get a catapult to fire charcoal and ore?

[C4lv1n]

You can also dig out a giant vertical shaft (carefully, if you like your miners), designate it as a garbage dump, and dump your ores into it to make a quantum stockpile at the bottom.

Actually...can you get a catapult to fire charcoal and ore?

Only if they are not marked as economic, so that makes more problems than it solves.

[BloodBeard]

A fun, slightly related fact: The speediest dwarves can run down stairs faster then a falling dwarf.

[Powder Miner]

A fun, slightly related fact: The speediest dwarves can run down stairs faster then a falling dwarf.

What would happen if it were possible for those dwarves to trip down the stairs?

[Poindexterity]

having done this myself, let me recommend against it.
HUUUUUUUUUGE pain in the ass.

you're better off moving your fort down there.
and who knows, while you're digging out down there, you might just find some candy.

[schismatise]

Most of my forts involve a giant 3x3 stairway top to bottom. I've built entire forts within ~30 levels of the magma sea, using the caverns for trees/plants/water, and i've built entire forts spanned across 100 z-levels, using above ground for trees/plants/water while still having magma smelting at the magma sea.

I'm pretty sure vertical and horizontal movement is the same. Diagonal movement on the x/y plane follows pythagorian law - moving diagonally up/right takes 1.4 times as long as moving either up or right. So in terms of efficiency, the ideal fort is technically a giant 3d sphere with up/down stairs on every square that isn't being used for a building or stockpile (walls are counter-productive of course).

Anyway, i think it's one of those things it's fun to experiment with, and find what you like. It's entirely feasable to have your haulers going up and down 100 z-levels, i only noticed a small increase in the number of required haulers for forts that were twice as high as the previous. Effective use of burrows and creating small living areas in several different sections of your fort makes such forts even more efficient. But magma pumps and pistons are fun too, and if done right, can be even more efficient still. Life (in dwarf fortress) is a cocophany of flavours, each more succulent than the last - why not sample them all?!

[Poindexterity]

Life (in dwarf fortress) is a cocophany of flavours, each more succulent than the last - why not sample them all?!

sigged

[Quantumtroll]

Sure, you *could* just put all your forges by the magma.  That works fine.  But if you pump it up, then you'll have access to magma throughout your fortress, providing an endless source of entertainment and creative expression.  It's just a fun thing to do

[Nan]

You can also dig out a giant vertical shaft (carefully, if you like your miners), designate it as a garbage dump, and dump your ores into it to make a quantum stockpile at the bottom.

This is too much work. The lazy way is to exploit the fact that once an object is falling, it will fall through staircases. So just have a perfectly vertical stairwell going down to the magma forges, and make sure there's an upstairs at the bottom to catch the stuff. Channel out the staircase at the level you want to dump stuff from, and dump all the stuff you want to, once it starts falling (thanks to the channel) it will keep falling and land at the bottom of the stairwell. Then replace the up/down stair you channeled out. Quick, easy and effective - and if your stairwell is 1x2 or larger, it remains functioning as a stairwell throughout.

[schismatise]

Life (in dwarf fortress) is a cocophany of flavours, each more succulent than the last - why not sample them all?!

sigged

stoked. also, i misspelt cacophany ><

[Raven Corp]

Why not just move the entire fortress down to the lava instead of worrying about stairways.