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Author Topic: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___  (Read 313067 times)

Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #255 on: June 03, 2012, 01:51:29 pm »

http://maximilian-aurea.deviantart.com/art/Datastream-303258045


First I would like to say that it was amazing, and if this isn't the only thing like this you've done, why haven't you tried to get it published!?

The rhythm and flow is superb, two or three sentences a paragraph with similar patterns throughout makes it more like listening to music than reading. 

The ideals of imperfection, yet accepting that, resonate with me slightly in that I am accepting of past mistakes, but I differ in that I berate myself for not attempting to improve in this current state. Overall though, the message is simple and sublime.

Vocabulary and rhythm are pretty much the same to me as far as their usage goes, so for vocabulary the only comment I have is that a better word than analysis could have been used on the second-to-last paragraph, it interrupts the flow slightly.  That may be just me though.



I was going to say something about the fact that I can't accept my work as "good enough" yet, even though people looking at my serious projects have told me that I'm at a professional level, but I had the post ready in the morning and forgot to send it, thusly it ended up irrelevant  :P



If anyone else has anything that hasn't been criticized at all, tell me and I will do so.

Thanks for the feedback! :D  You're right, that 'analysis' sort of kills the ethereal feel, makes me jump back into reality. I write those motivational poems mainly for a Survivors of Abuse private community I help administrate, being one of the primary contributors for daily and sometimes hourly poems and songs meant to inspire our members as well as a counselor. That one in particular was voicing my feelings on May 20th of this year, particularly in how I finally feel ready to take on the world but don't want to do it alone.

Yeah, I've written dozens and dozens of these, but many of them are so ridiculously dense to read. I write as therapy, to help ease my anxiety and emotional issues. The fact that I have something to show and share is just a 'waste' product of such therapeutic practices. First and foremost, all of my writing is for my own emotional advancement, internal harmony, and sanity. There was a time where I'd burn all of my poetry and stories a-la quasi-pagan ritual, and in 2008 someone robbed me and took the bag that had 8 years of actually recorded writing in it. I just happened to have my entire writing binder, my poetry notebooks, everything, as I was on my way back from the Literary Club in my school. :(

To be quite honest, I've stopped caring about the overall quality of my poetry, heh. Today I challenge myself more with form and rhythm, trying to simplify my work and incorporate rhyme as well. I absolutely despise rhyming and am trying to get myself into the habit.

Here's an example of my -ridiculously- dense, ultra-confusing work full of innuendos and inferences most people (who don't read Lovecraft :P) wouldn't ever understand. I realized after writing this piece that I absolutely LOVE it, but that most people outside of my writing circle wouldn't have a god damn clue what's going on. We're all writers or RPers, Warhammer and Lovecraft fans, and as such, used to the ultra-dense or overly-vivid or downright macabre/confusing flow. They're used to my quasi-'religious' philosophical rantings, this just happens to be one of the few of those I actually bothered to record.

http://maximilian-aurea.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d3cq72u

If you want, you can go through the other crap on my DeviantArt. Its mostly shitty old romance poems people asked me to put up, but whatever.
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Supermikhail

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #256 on: June 04, 2012, 06:31:30 am »

Okay, here's how I sent off my story for the writing sample, but I don't think I should leave it like this. Too cliffhanger-y
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Would like some advice as to ending or continuing
Okay, I thought I'd come back as a guy who is easily bored.

Well, first sentence and I'm bored - case proven. ::) Starting with, I can't visualize a camera lens lodged precariously in the cloth under an arm. Okay, that may be a failure of imagination on my part. But then, as I go further, I fail to see how the first paragraph could lead to anything awesome and meaningful for me - especially since you say yourself that the bit lacks a satisfactory conclusion.

Maybe if you promise to me that it's gonna get awesome eventually I'll ignore the beginning.
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Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #257 on: June 04, 2012, 08:16:50 am »

Yeah, the beginning of mine also sucks absolute balls. I should just cut out the camera part. The actual story starts at the introduction of the girl. Its pretty simple really. Symbol of innocence clashes with symbol of oppression, symbol of oppression massacres innocents, symbol of innocence faces oppressors, oppressors hesitate, commanding officer Hitler McDouchebag murders symbol of innocence, even oppressor's men are faced with guilt, McDouchebag walks away like an apathetic boss, the end.

EDIT:

I'm noticing a trend here with crappy camera-related intros.
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AlStar

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #258 on: June 04, 2012, 09:40:51 am »

Okay, here's how I sent off my story for the writing sample, but I don't think I should leave it like this. Too cliffhanger-y

...
story
...

Would like some advice as to ending or continuing

You've got some (it's/its) confusion. Don't do that.

For the starting sentence, I don't totally agree with Supermikhail, but you do need to tighten it up a bit. I'd write it like so - "Corwin climbed the battlement, careful of the camera lens lodged precariously in a cloth under his arm."

You went rather insane on the commas here: "Anyway though, the Big Magazine hired me to go out and capture pictures of the wild frontier, especially, if I could, get one of such a beast as we’re watching for tonight. And since I had business out here, I might as well take the special night equipment too.” 
My suggested revision: "Anyway, the Big Magazine hired me to go out and capture pictures of the wild frontier; especially shots of beasts like the one we're watching for tonight. Since I had business out here, I figured I might as well take the night equipment too."

Overall, I think you've got some decent dialoging skills, in that Corwin and Willis sound natural speaking with eachother. Unfortunately, I think most of the impact of that is undone by the fact that, for the most part, they aren't really talking about anything. We learn a lot about the camera, a little about the background of both men, a tiny bit about the location. Ideally, I think we'd want to learn a lot more about the 'wild frontier' where the story is set, since it sounds a lot more exciting then setting up a camera.

I think that the ending is actually pretty good. Yes, it's cliffhanger-y, but if you've got to end on a couple lines of dialog, you picked some good ones for that purpose.

WillowLuman

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #259 on: June 04, 2012, 12:50:37 pm »

Thanks for reading!

I've always had a bit of a problem with run-on sentences. I guess it comes from paranoia of being too terse in a boring way, but again it looks like I could certainly stand to be more terse.

For the camera, I was imagining a gigantic early camera, with a huge, hand-ground lense. I suppose that I really should visualize better, as reading through again it sounds confusing. A bit more exposition as to the frontier would also be good, too.

For the dialogue, I was trying to create a sense of making conversation to stave off nervousness. A few lines hinting about being scared of the dragon would probably be a good idea.
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Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #260 on: June 04, 2012, 12:56:44 pm »

Cliff-hangery is a hit or miss. You -want- a good cliff-hanger... Not too early, not too late, and it must be tasteful. An inefficient cliffhanger leaves a sour taste or a confusion conclusion; you wan't to shoot for your typical dramatic build-up a-la novela/movie/tv series where they leave your mouth watering for details and your mind going insane with wonder at what happens next.
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fqllve

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #261 on: June 05, 2012, 07:55:53 am »

To Wish Upon a Fallen Star‘

I hate to be a pedant, but the semicolon use in this is totally scattershot. For example in this sentence
Quote
Several Molotov cocktails can be seen jutting out from overcoats and jacket pockets, while others grasp makeshift clubs made of varying lengths of pipe; the protesters’ grips tightening at the approach of armored troops, assault weapons in hand.
'the protesters' grips. . .' is imperfective and occurring simultaneously along with the preceding clause, which generally renders it dependent. Actually you run into this error a lot, which I would guess means you weren't particularly comfortable in the simple present. But really, it works the same way as the imperfective does in the past. 'He opened the door, wondering where he had been all night.' In these sentences you can substitute in a while (although in a the present tense you'd have to make the verb perfective: 'while the protesters' grips tightened. . .'), which further proves the clause is subordinate.

In another sentence
Quote
Zooming in on the blockaded intersection, the camera focuses on a lone GDF officer; the customary black uniform marked by a gray armband containing a single black star.
The second clause is actually non-finite. To finitize it you'd have to add a was before the verb. The same is true of the next sentence, which also has a non-finite dependent clause.

In this sentence
Quote
While the deafening onslaught of military-grade heavy weaponry clears a bloody path through the chaotic mass, the wall of armored steel marches further across a sea of red and black; weathered asphalt below their feet, littered with spent shells.
the second clause ('the wall of armored steel. . .') is actually independent and needs to be set off with a semicolon. However, the part following the semicolon is actually just a long noun phrase.

Quote
“Control lies within the absolution of innocence; bend a man to your will, break their mind, and enchain them within their own system, and they shall be yours to dominate.
I would actually use a colon for this sentence, because the second part logically follows from the first and is a clarification thereof. But that's more personal taste than anything.

In fact, before the break there are only two sentences with a properly used semicolon.
Quote
A moment later, a single bullet pierces her skull; her body seems to fall endlessly, gliding downwards in slow-motion like the last leaf of Fall from a great oak tree.
Quote
There lies her shattered innocence; all that remains is the glow of her curious eyes, reflected in a great sea of crimson.
Afterwards there's a much better ratio, which seems to suggest you'd gotten a better handle on it, although I'd still say about half of them in the second section are unnecessary.

The story itself is well-told but a bit dry. There's really nothing to grasp onto, no real hook. The fancy prose doesn't really come out until the second section, we're not told what exactly these people are fighting for except the generic freedom, which it seems like every cause uses as a justification, and the GDF officer is such an avatar of indiscriminate tyranny it's hard to be interested in his actions. Without a reason to care about the protesters, beyond the brief mention of the girl which is too brief to elicit empathy, and without any curiosity for the officer's actions, which lack depth, it kind of just falls flat.

The writing itself is good, although it seems at times to be a bit self-conscious, however for me it's not good enough, or at least at the beginning not good enough, to hold the story. But that might just be my personal preference for elegant prose to give imagery rather than thematic context.

Anyway, sorry to come down so hard on your semicolon use. It was just such a catalogue of various errors that I thought it would be instructional for everyone for them to be pointed out.
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Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #262 on: June 05, 2012, 12:02:22 pm »

THANK YOU!

I've been trying to elicit a commentary on my haphazard(read: half-assed) use of the semicolon for years, but I don't know anyone who actually USES semicolons. I'm not quite sure how to properly use them, instead selecting to string them in wherever it feels 'right'. I use them in my poetry to mark a pause longer than a comma yet shorter than a hyphen - I'd assume I subconsciously carried that over to my actual prose.

You're right about the intro being garbage, I was never satisfied with it. The actual story was rushed: not so much a story, but a Facebook post(totally misused that technique, derp) on a random picture concerning the injustices of war. I didn't feel like putting it into historical context so I instead made up a pseudo-SS idea (Order of the Black Star? C'mon, that one's infamous.) based off of some Third Reich research I had been conducting at the time. Extremely limited in breadth due to its short length and an overall lack of time, I'm quite surprised it was so well-received. I write these short-stories, philosophical essays, and political rants in a space of 1-5 minutes and barely even know what the hell I'm writing. Its like when I compose music... I just experiment and make it up as I go, recording it so that I can later refine what I've come up with.

Except I rarely ever do. <_< Hahaha
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Ehndras, you are the prettiest man I have ever seen
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Willfor

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Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #264 on: June 05, 2012, 12:30:56 pm »

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You're never too old to enjoy flying body parts.  
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Ehndras, you are the prettiest man I have ever seen
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"I am a member of Earth. I enjoy to drink the water. In Earth we have an internal skeleton."

Supermikhail

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #265 on: June 05, 2012, 01:02:03 pm »

Ditto.

Although in those situations I usually use the thing that might be called the "m-dash", and I suspect it also might be a left-over\carry-over from my school days of Russian grammar. Could someone bother to tell me if I'm completely incorrect in that usage?
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Ehndras

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #266 on: June 05, 2012, 01:26:57 pm »

I have no idea what you mean, please use it in a sentence. :)
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You're never too old to enjoy flying body parts.  
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Ehndras, you are the prettiest man I have ever seen
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"I am a member of Earth. I enjoy to drink the water. In Earth we have an internal skeleton."

Supermikhail

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #267 on: June 05, 2012, 01:30:59 pm »

Well, first sentence and I'm bored - case proven. ::)
Sorta like that.

I mean there'd be an m-dash if it weren't for the Internet.
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Willfor

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #268 on: June 05, 2012, 01:47:54 pm »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dash

It's a strange and wonderful form of punctuation.
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In the wells of livestock vans with shells and garden sands /
Iron mixed with oxygen as per the laws of chemistry and chance /
A shape was roughly human, it was only roughly human /
Apparition eyes / Apparition eyes / Knock, apparition, knock / Eyes, apparition eyes /

Supermikhail

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Re: ___/The Writer's Apprenticeship\___
« Reply #269 on: June 05, 2012, 02:00:05 pm »

I doubly feel that the high school Russian lessons were a waste of time - I write mostly in English these days anyway (well, I did that again). And at English grammar we barely got through the uses of gerund and past participle.

Anyway, it doesn't really help (Hm...) ; (?) I still don't know what I should have used in that sentence; apparently not a dash; a semi-colon then?

The above sentence is right here my graduation test of the proper usage of the semi-colon.
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