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Author Topic: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?  (Read 1877 times)

malvado

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This is a thing I've been thinking about for a while , in essence I really miss the Worldgen to make it possible to change how you play the game , such as :

*The type of above and underground farming you can do , if any. I honestly find it strange that Dwarves are not able to do so without modding the game a tad. It would have been nice to be able either give your race the ability to farm "logical" crops above-ground or at least give that option at embark.
*If it should be possible to manufacture weapons and armor (and other trinkets) sizes that are intended for trade with other non dwarven civilizations. Not sure if you would need a special workshop or if it should appear as an additional option when selecting what you are making. For me it seems a tad "ilogical" that Traders actually buy armor they will mostly not be able to use ever and sell armor that is not usable either.
*If you want Magic (whenever it's implemented) in your game.
*Possibility to define a couple of starting civilizations and pick their starting locations and let the game handle it from that point. Perhaps even give the civs some additional behaviour like : Aggresive / expansionist or pacifist etc.
*The existence of certain metals (mythical) , technological level (windmills? Steel? Catapults ? ).
*The presence of Hell or not. Likewise it's denizens and presence in the World should also be toggle-able no matter if Hell is there or not. (Some special zones might have to be changed a bit if hell is removed).

So what do you think? Should the game be easier to modify at Worldgen like this for example?
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Kilroy the Grand

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2012, 10:54:45 pm »

humans buy dwarven armor so they can equpt their children.
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Railick Stonemane

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2012, 12:37:09 am »

Humans buy dwarf armor to sell it to other dwarf fortresses that don't have the materials handy to make their own, why do you think they let you set out with just 7 people to a distant mountain, they expect goodies :P Your fortress isn't the only one humans are visiting.

But I agree it would be nice to be able to change more at world creation, though you can already change a lot more than you used to be able to do, it's heading in the direction you're talking about.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2012, 01:49:59 am »

This is a thing I've been thinking about for a while , in essence I really miss the Worldgen to make it possible to change how you play the game , such as :

*The type of above and underground farming you can do , if any. I honestly find it strange that Dwarves are not able to do so without modding the game a tad. It would have been nice to be able either give your race the ability to farm "logical" crops above-ground or at least give that option at embark.
*If it should be possible to manufacture weapons and armor (and other trinkets) sizes that are intended for trade with other non dwarven civilizations. Not sure if you would need a special workshop or if it should appear as an additional option when selecting what you are making. For me it seems a tad "ilogical" that Traders actually buy armor they will mostly not be able to use ever and sell armor that is not usable either.
*If you want Magic (whenever it's implemented) in your game.
*Possibility to define a couple of starting civilizations and pick their starting locations and let the game handle it from that point. Perhaps even give the civs some additional behaviour like : Aggresive / expansionist or pacifist etc.
*The existence of certain metals (mythical) , technological level (windmills? Steel? Catapults ? ).
*The presence of Hell or not. Likewise it's denizens and presence in the World should also be toggle-able no matter if Hell is there or not. (Some special zones might have to be changed a bit if hell is removed).

So what do you think? Should the game be easier to modify at Worldgen like this for example?

A lot of the things you mentioned are doable in advanced parameters. While not easy for someone who's not used it before, it's possible.

Also nonononononooo no magic in DF. This is Dorf Fortress, not generic elf retreat :|

Wirevix

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2012, 02:12:19 am »

I think you might have missed the part where a lot of Dwarf Fortress is based on common fantasy concepts and popular ideas about mythological things.  Granted, it goes a bit insane once you take control yourself, but it's always been built around easily-recognizable fantasy ideas.

Magic will eventually be part of that, and Toady's never pretended it won't.  It's part of the vision of a fantasy world that the game tries to generate. 

That being said, I always say the more options you have to turn things on or off to your liking, the better.  More customization is always superior in my eyes.
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malvado

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2012, 07:42:19 am »


A lot of the things you mentioned are doable in advanced parameters. While not easy for someone who's not used it before, it's possible.


Really? Which ones?
Been using the Advanced parameters for a year or so now and can't say I see any options in there to :
*Toggle on / off concrete types of metal.
*Toggle on / off what you are able to farm as a certain dwarven civ.
*Toggle on / off Dwarves ability to use magic (when it happens).
*Toggle on / off exotic weapon and armor types and sizes (Like Longswords , Bastard Swords and other items that are not normally made without modding the init file).
*Toggle on / off Hell
*Toggle on / off Demons
*Ability to define and set initial map position of a choosen civilization at start of World year 1.

I am aware that it is possible to set Demons to 0 , however this would remove demons completely instead of just removing either just hell and leave demons to appear from time to time in the world or remove both hell and demons if players don't enjoy that part of the game.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2012, 09:38:26 am »

Well you obviously can't toggle world gen features for things that aren't in the game yet, but you can change mineral scarcity, mess with cavern layers to remove HFS and this keeps demons too. Though why would you want to do that? Everyone enjoys HFS. Also, setting civ placements would create awkward situations, like Dwarves in plains, Humans in glaciers and Elves in mountains. Not to mention you can buy your seeds and whatever in the embark screen :P

Rex_Nex

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2012, 09:45:53 am »

-ignore, my cat managed to type this-
« Last Edit: January 09, 2012, 02:23:57 pm by Rex_Nex »
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malvado

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2012, 10:22:17 am »

Well you obviously can't toggle world gen features for things that aren't in the game yet, 1 but you can change mineral scarcity, 2 mess with cavern layers to remove HFS and this keeps demons too. Though why would you want to do that? Everyone enjoys HFS. 3 Also, setting civ placements would create awkward situations, like Dwarves in plains, Humans in glaciers and Elves in mountains. Not to mention you can buy your seeds and whatever in the embark screen :P

Again this doesnt really adress what I want, basically it should be easier to use the World Generator to shape the game towards how you play , let me adress the above ones :

1 : Changing mineral scarcity does not adress if you can have a certain metal or not (just avaibability generally worldwide). Being able to manually remove metals / stones at Worldgen (instead of modding) is what I'd like and it certainly would fit those that wants to play the game without "spoilerite" or any other metal for fantasy taste.

2 : Yes, you can mess with cavern layers , but what if you want to keep demons bur remove hell? Or wise versa?

3 : Allowing yourself to place a few selected starting civilization placements and point out "At the map" where they start is what I'm aiming at , the rest of them would go on using mainly the terrain they prefer to start out. Why? Because it fits nicely with the roleplaying elements and makes the world gen a bit more richer in my eyes.

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cameron

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2012, 02:10:50 pm »

Dwarves can collect and farm above ground crops already and I'm not sure why you perticularly think that tech level of a civ and what sort of things (plants) it can use and trade should be changed in world parametres as opposed to the raws where you can already change those things.

if you keep demons by removing hell where would the demons go? and you can already keep hell but remove demons in the advanced parametres

setting the activity styles of various civs would be nice but I would suspect this will end up in the raws and I don't really know why you have an aversion to things being there

magic seems like a thing that will be making an appearance in the world gen parametres when it is implemented and I'm not sure why anyone would turn off the ability to make different sized Armour anyway.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2012, 02:14:45 pm by cameron »
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Cruxador

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Re: Should the way you play the game be easier to modify at Worldgen?
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2012, 03:07:17 pm »

In answer to the OP's question, yes.
But do I want that more than other things? Eh, not really. It's just a question of Toady's design time, and where we'd rather see him spend it.
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