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Author Topic: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)  (Read 960790 times)

LoSboccacc

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3435 on: October 13, 2012, 04:40:48 pm »

I hate enemy spawning as you go
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lastverb

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3436 on: October 13, 2012, 04:42:35 pm »

I can appreciate how the devs might've wanted to rebalance to make medkits more scarce, since in Enemy Unknown I seem to recall every soldier always having one.
They didn't need to. Without inventory system you wouldn't carry many of them anyway.
The game didn't turn out as bad as I thought it will. It's actually fun (but only for 1 playthrough for me), but there is a whole lot of irritating dumbed down mechanics.
Well, i'm waiting for proper apocalypse remake try. In my opinion it would be best of xcom series if they implemented all of planned features (factions etc.) and be a little more bug-free.
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Ivefan

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3437 on: October 13, 2012, 04:47:41 pm »

Well, i'm waiting for proper apocalypse remake try. In my opinion it would be best of xcom series if they implemented all of planned features (factions etc.) and be a little more bug-free.
That would be nice. Never played xcom 1&2 but I played apoc from time to time through the years(no, i dont really like turn based) and none of the other xcom clones has been as fun.
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Virtz

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3438 on: October 13, 2012, 05:16:28 pm »

And more than that, the point is their activities really happened in the world, they weren't randomly generated when the game decided to give you something to do. For example, in this game, I got a VIP mission. The first time it was a scientist escort. Then I reloaded and now it was a politician arrest. The mission wasn't the result of what the aliens were doing, but was simply randomly generated when x amount of days passed.

Didn't UFOEE missions work the same way? As far as I could tell, the success or failure of their missions had no impact on their campaign. In fact,the only difference between, say, Alien Research, Alien Harvest, and Alien Abduction is the points value for the Alien Score, which only affects your funding. It'd be really neat if destroying all their research ships resulting in them deploying troops less optimized for anti-human combat or something, but as it is the missions system is basically the game waiting a bit and then rolling a d10 to decide what to throw at you. Admittedly, the Alien Base thing was neat.

And you do, in fact, still get UFO landings from time to time- I just finished a mission where a large ship landed in the middle of nowhere and I raided it, just like I would've in the old xcom.
It still at least felt more emergent. What I really mean is that they flew around the globe and did stuff. You could see it happening all the time and intercept them from their missions. Here it seems to suddenly turn out there's abductions simultaneously happening in several different places and you can only go after one, even though it can be like 2 happening right next to the base and one on the other side of the world, yet it doesn't care that in the time it takes to get to that 3rd location, you could handle the other two with one squad (not to mention if you could send out multiple squads).

And in between saves, it's not consistent with what the missions are doing or what the rewards are. Like it's just asking you to reload in case you don't like the country/reward combination.

I guess it all comes down to the original just having a better illusion of the aliens doing something meaningful in the strategic layer.

Don't get me wrong, the original's proportions (and especially quantities) were questionable, but not anywhere near as fucking bad as this. "XCOM, you're our first and last line of defence! Here's your monthly allowance. You can make 3 medkits with this. Now fuck off.".

I admit, jet-fighters costing twice as much as soldiers is slightly sillier than jet-fighters costing ten times as much as soldiers. On the other hand, I can appreciate how the devs might've wanted to rebalance to make medkits more scarce, since in Enemy Unknown I seem to recall every soldier always having one.
It's like they went too far, though. In addition to the prices, they've limited the soldier inventory so that the trade-off to having a medkit is not having a grenade. And similar things apply to other equipment elements, where it actually gets even more nonsensical. "Do you want a nano-fiber vest with your regular armour, or a grenade? Can't have both!". They're just totally unrelated items and they cost a lot to produce at the start, yet a guy can only take one of them.
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GlyphGryph

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3439 on: October 13, 2012, 05:21:24 pm »

I found a download for Two Sides on moddb, but the website says it's been closed, C&D or otherwise.  Still, I remember playing it way back before I got my desktop and it overheated the laptop.  Cool game.

Yeah, it did shut down, sadly, but they never actually got a cease and desist letter. They just decided that with the reboots coming, there was too much risk and not enough point in continuing to work on their own project. (And I think they'd been having problems developing it by that point anyway)

For all those still complaining, play Xenonauts instead - it seems to be exactly the game you're looking for. This one is still awesome, though... and maybe a bit more fun, honestly.
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Man of Paper

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3440 on: October 13, 2012, 05:24:09 pm »

One thing I'll never understand is people who complain about a game being gamey. Especially a TBS. I mean, I get that you want more realism and a soother, more immersive feel, but it's still a game, and I think we need to go back to embracing that.
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Neonivek

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3441 on: October 13, 2012, 05:32:18 pm »

One thing I'll never understand is people who complain about a game being gamey. Especially a TBS. I mean, I get that you want more realism and a soother, more immersive feel, but it's still a game, and I think we need to go back to embracing that.

A game being too gamey means that the elements of gameplay fights against the elements of immersion, hurts the story, or just hurts the overall feel of the game.

In otherwords "Yeah it is fun, but it isn't fulfilling". That is the essence of being too gamey.

A great example of a gameplay element hurting the overall experience is Fatal Frame

Fatal Frame is a horror game where you fight ghosts with a Camera. A major complaint however is that whenever you take a picture of a ghost, the amount of points that shot was worth pops up. Thus hurting the horror element. Does this improve the gameplay? Yes, knowing how many points a shot is worth is part of the gameplay and improves it. Does it hurt the horror aspect? Very much so. However if the numbers were to disapear the overall improvement to the game would be greater then the lost gameplay.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 05:36:24 pm by Neonivek »
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Glowcat

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3442 on: October 13, 2012, 05:44:25 pm »

Criticizing the funding issues sort of implies the game makes sense in the first place.  I mean, all the aliens would have to do to defeat a country is drop a single Cryssalid into a populated area.  They wouldn't even have to kill everyone, they would have demonstrated their power so effectively and horribly that the rest of the world would probably just surrender.

Or, when they've found an xcom base, why only send one battleship?  Why not send the whole damn fleet?  And why bother with infantry, we know UFOs have weapons.  Glass that shit.  And, on that note, why don't the aliens send a UFO to guard the shot down UFOs, or lift off their landed intact UFOs and blast the skyranger.  Why do they bother starting with small craft and weak aliens, after they've already scouted stuff out?  They should use all their most powerful stuff first, before humanity can steal the weapons they're weaklings were carrying.

Hell, if most of the aliens are genetically engineered, and we know from humans that those with psychic powers don't require significantly more resources than the non-psychic, why do the aliens produce anything biological that ISN'T a psychic monstrosity?

From what I gathered of the alien plans...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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sluissa

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3443 on: October 13, 2012, 05:48:43 pm »

Criticizing the funding issues sort of implies the game makes sense in the first place.  I mean, all the aliens would have to do to defeat a country is drop a single Cryssalid into a populated area.  They wouldn't even have to kill everyone, they would have demonstrated their power so effectively and horribly that the rest of the world would probably just surrender.

Or, when they've found an xcom base, why only send one battleship?  Why not send the whole damn fleet?  And why bother with infantry, we know UFOs have weapons.  Glass that shit.  And, on that note, why don't the aliens send a UFO to guard the shot down UFOs, or lift off their landed intact UFOs and blast the skyranger.  Why do they bother starting with small craft and weak aliens, after they've already scouted stuff out?  They should use all their most powerful stuff first, before humanity can steal the weapons they're weaklings were carrying.

Hell, if most of the aliens are genetically engineered, and we know from humans that those with psychic powers don't require significantly more resources than the non-psychic, why do the aliens produce anything biological that ISN'T a psychic monstrosity?

From what I gathered of the alien plans...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Or in the original:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Ivefan

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3444 on: October 13, 2012, 05:57:39 pm »

Fatal Frame is a horror game where you fight ghosts with a Camera. A major complaint however is that whenever you take a picture of a ghost, the amount of points that shot was worth pops up. Thus hurting the horror element. Does this improve the gameplay? Yes, knowing how many points a shot is worth is part of the gameplay and improves it. Does it hurt the horror aspect? Very much so. However if the numbers were to disapear the overall improvement to the game would be greater then the lost gameplay.
Good example. Fatal frame is one of the very few games that i think is scary, But that camera annoyed me a lot.
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Robosaur

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3445 on: October 13, 2012, 06:08:15 pm »

Looking through the game config files, it looks like it should be possible to add Sectopods to Multiplayer mode. I'd test this out, but my friend is currently copying the files over so we can play a skirmish against each other so I don't want to mess around with the game files until it's over. Has anyone else tried this? What's it like controlling a sectopod?
actually fuck it, I want to put in an uber ethereal.
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Virtz

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3446 on: October 13, 2012, 06:17:03 pm »

For all those still complaining, play Xenonauts instead - it seems to be exactly the game you're looking for. This one is still awesome, though... and maybe a bit more fun, honestly.
I'm waiting for it to get to beta. They're only now getting a version with proper AI and I'd rather wait till it's fully playable.
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Leafsnail

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3447 on: October 13, 2012, 06:18:14 pm »

Surely if they were to make the game "realistic" you'd just carpet bomb the hell out of every mission (maybe with nonlethal stuff if you wanted to capture some aliens) then send in 1000 troops to make sure there are no survivors.  Quibbling over the relative cost of a super-advanced medkit seems pretty silly compared to the rather larger issue of why the response size is so small.
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The Scout

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3448 on: October 13, 2012, 06:30:15 pm »

Surely if they were to make the game "realistic" you'd just carpet bomb the hell out of every mission (maybe with nonlethal stuff if you wanted to capture some aliens) then send in 1000 troops to make sure there are no survivors.  Quibbling over the relative cost of a super-advanced medkit seems pretty silly compared to the rather larger issue of why the response size is so small.
That's not secretive. Every person in the world would know something is going down when entire cities disappear.
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shadow_archmagi

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Re: XCOM: Enemy Unknown (New by Firaxis)
« Reply #3449 on: October 13, 2012, 06:30:58 pm »

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Booyah! Now I join the 0.1% of people who've beaten Classic Iron Man!

Edit: Also, does anyone know what those other achievements are for? Disaster Averted, Saved to Savior, No Sweat, Rising Dragon, etc.

NOTE: Since as of an hour or two before your post, the Steam servers listed it as being 0%, it's possible that you were, in fact, the FIRST person to beat it on Classic Iron Man.
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