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[Armeleon]

Most people describe DF as a 'Fantasy' game, but everyone should know by know that its a little bit removed from the regular fantasy genre.  So I started thinking, if I had to put Dwarf Fortress somewhere in our history, where would I put it? For me, Dwarf Fortress reminds me more of an Old West style game than King Arthur.  It has a settlement and migration feel to it, with a 'roughin' it' kind of a style.  Course, its a little different than playing Cowboys and Indians. I like to imagine all the little Dwarflets playing Dwarfmen and Gobbos as they grow up.

What's your opinion?

[raptorfangamer]

I see it as 7 midgest creating the most complex housing system for hobos, at which they are conscripted randomly because of an uncaring overlord which will assign war dogs to miserable and mood-y-fied midgets

that or medieval.

[MAurelius]

Well, I see your argument, but I'm sure there was a lot of "roughing it" in King Arthur's time. Really if I had a choice I think I'd prefer to live in the wild west. Sanitation, technology, and all were far advanced from late classical pre-medieval Britain, no matter how it may seem.

I have always thought of DF as less a game and more a fantasy world simulator. Sure, there isn't any magic, but all the tropes are there, elves, dwarves, goblins, kobolds. And now we're going to have werewolves and vampires, too, so that overplayed, soap opera-y genre can be included as well. If you were being uncharitable, you could call it fantasy-medieval Sim City. But more than that, a game you can WIN. DF cannot be "won". You just survive until something goes horribly wrong, by the inexperienced through oversight (oh crap, I didn't wall off the entrance to the caverns) and by the experienced through cheapness (oh crap, the forgotten beast that my legendary, spoilerite wearing badass army that took me 14 hours to build just took down in 2 seconds has a syndrome that slowly kills and infects everything).

I think in our current cultural background (I'm a US citizen but I'm sure this also applies pretty much everywhere) the most recent example of "colonization" is the American wild west, and we have kind of romanticized King Arthur times as being all about glorious battle, Roman Legions, mystical quests, magic, and hot faerie folk, but be aware that in the "real" King Arthur times colonization was happening all over the place. It was dirty, it was survival, it was squalor. Closer to DF than you might think.

[Mitchewawa]

Dwarf kids aren't allowed to play historical-depiction games or they'll need to produce more coffins.

And yeah, medieval all the way. Not swords-and-maidens medieval, more like live-in-filth-and-die medieval. Sort of like a peasantry simulator.

[Girlinhat]

My dwarven children seem to enjoy playing "Elf Chase".  The game plays when one child is chosen/volunteers, and the others chase that child down, and then mercilessly beat them to death with their bare fists.

The strangest part is, most volunteer for it...

Either way, I see it more bronze-age than anything.  We're going way back.

[Armeleon]

in the "real" King Arthur times colonization was happening all over the place. It was dirty, it was survival, it was squalor. Closer to DF than you might think.

I never though about it that way. So basically fantasy without the glamor? Twilight without the love story? Actually, closer to Conan than Twilight. Not that you couldn't get an edward and bella out of the game if you tried. It would just take a lot of work.  I've always tended to think the middle ages was two sqabbling nobles fighting from hundred year old castles. But i guess there was an underclass as well, constantly on the move.

But I like that. Dwarf fortress is Fantasy turned upside down. Instead of playing nobles controlling peasants, we're peasants controlling nobles. How satisfying.

[doublestrafe]

I don't understand how you could place Dwarf Fortress outside of the genre of fantasy. You're a fantastic race that can live on booze from birth and can perform superhuman feats of heroism on the field of battle. You're attacked by giant animated statues, rocs, dragons, minotaurs, horrific monsters spawned by darkness in the depths of the earth, and clowns--well, you know what I mean. You can't do magic but I'm pretty sure I saw it on the long term implementation list. In a few days there will be vampires. How on earth is this not fantasy?

[Girlinhat]

As said, he viewed "middle ages" as more of a king's playground.  Truth was, it was brutal.  "Dark Ages" isn't just a term of endearment.  There was plague, war, famine, drought, crime, overpopulation, all the makings of a great fort!

[Armeleon]

Exactly. But I still can't picture anything being as brutal as dwarf forterss. Not even the Dark Ages.  And just to be clear, I'm not saying DF isn't fantasy, I'm saying that its not traditional fantasy. Usually you don't have to worry about sanitation and soap-making in regular fantasy games. I had noticed that it had an old-west feel to it.. maybe you can take all the violence of the middle ages and mix it with the spirit of the old west.

and maybe, just maybe, there's one period in history that anyone can look at and say, "yep, that's dwarf fortress."

[Girlinhat]

Dwarf Fortress isn't "traditional" anything!

[Loud Whispers]

Does the far future in a post apocalyptic drunken world count?

[Alestom]

I see it as different Highland clans in the 11th century. They all have a chief (mayor) who doesnt really do anything, Relentless attacks from other clans (Wildlife from the region), the English (Goblins) and in some points the Irish (Filthy Hippy Elves), Live in the highlands (mountains), Actually had homes underground, relied on drink, were very......Cruel to enemies they captured and HAD SOME PRETTY IMPRESSIVE BEARDS.

[Armeleon]

Does the far future in a post apocalyptic drunken world count?

I think you mean 'post-December2012' but close enough! you just wait. DF 2012 might be on the computer, but DF 2013.. your backyard

[Loud Whispers]

Does the far future in a post apocalyptic drunken world count?

I think you mean 'post-December2012' but close enough! you just wait. DF 2012 might be on the computer, but DF 2013.. your backyard

Oh wow look at the new tile set Toady implemented... Almost looks life like...
*Is struck down by giant 3d &*

[Mitchewawa]

Fantasy doesn't always mean Tolkein Fantasy.

Who wants to be derivative of a Tolkien fantasy realm when you can dispense manual abortions via steel boot to the stomach?