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Author Topic: American Election Megathread - It's Over  (Read 767958 times)

SalmonGod

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6840 on: October 17, 2012, 03:31:25 am »

Nobody's ever said that the media is unbiased - just that the left is not the exclusive or even main beneficiary of media bias.
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Glowcat

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6841 on: October 17, 2012, 04:05:44 am »

Thing is, she openly withdrew some accusations after the debate, because those weren't correct. "Romney was correct in the main" But few will hear her retraction.

You had a moderator interfering with her own emotional opinion. She isn't a fact-checker with the transcripts in front of her.

Tell me again how the media is unbiased.

Whut? She didn't retract anything nor should she have. She corrected Romney by pointing out what the President actually said - something Romney seemed to think was a huge lie.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6842 on: October 17, 2012, 04:06:00 am »

I'm glad someone finally called Romney on at least SOME of his BS as well... even if it was, of all things, the moderator.
Best thing I've ever seen in an election ever.

Even better than the wacko going "HHHHHHRRRRRRRRRUUUUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!"

Thing is, she openly withdrew some accusations after the debate, because those weren't correct. "Romney was correct in the main" But few will hear her retraction.

You had a moderator interfering with her own emotional opinion. She isn't a fact-checker with the transcripts in front of her.

Tell me again how the media is unbiased.

Firstly... did you actually watch the video you linked?  The moderator knew exactly what was going on, and was correct and consistent during and after the debate.  What happened was, Romney's overall point was correct, in that the Obama administration didn't consistently portray the attacks as a terrorist attack until two weeks after they happened.  HOWEVER, what Romney actually said (that Obama didn't inform Americans that the attack was carried out by terrorists instead of rioters) was incorrect, because Obama referred to the attacks as an act of terror in a speech shortly after they happened.

Now, most people are going to take away that the moderator called Romney out on being wrong, because she did that first.  However, she both corrected Romney and then pointed out that he was right overall, which is consistent with the view she expresses after the debate.

Secondly, you can't take a single example of the way a single person acts, and generalize about the entire class that person belongs to.  ESPECIALLY if your evidence of how that person acts is a single minute of video ripped out of context.

Thirdly, if you use as evidence a video from a user that has GOP in the name and the republican elephant as its avatar, you don't get to throw the word unbiased around.

Fourthly, if your username is a made up word that begins with "troll", you should make a better effort to appear genuine, AKA not be confrontational and present shifty sources as argument enders.  Not saying you're a troll, just that you appear to be portraying yourself as one.
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10ebbor10

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6843 on: October 17, 2012, 06:53:24 am »

Would we be able to compress the carbon in CO2 emissions into bricks?
Carbon in bricks exists. It's called coal.

Or Diamonds, or graphene, or whatever...
Problem is you'll be investing more energy in storing it than you got from burning it.

I think we here in Ontario pretty much have this power thing figured out (for now, we need to build more reactors sooner or later though); we generate 50% of our power through nuclear, something like 20% through various renewable options and the rest through coal/gas. We are however in the process of adding more reactors (we bloody well better, or my degree will be pretty useless) and we always seem to have some new green energy plan in the works.

Sorry for the lack of sources, everything I found seemed outdated.
Yeah, fission is pretty much required to solve the energy problems on a usefull timescale. Problem is that the whole Nuclear panic thing is causing governements to close them, just to maintain a good reputation. Germany is doing so, for example, and building several Gigawatts of Coal plants to replace them.

Also, no love for geothermal? It tends to be ignored while talking about renewable power, but is a great powersource in those places were it's available.
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sluissa

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6844 on: October 17, 2012, 07:08:23 am »

I'm glad someone finally called Romney on at least SOME of his BS as well... even if it was, of all things, the moderator.
Best thing I've ever seen in an election ever.

Even better than the wacko going "HHHHHHRRRRRRRRRUUUUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!"

Thing is, she openly withdrew some accusations after the debate, because those weren't correct. "Romney was correct in the main" But few will hear her retraction.

You had a moderator interfering with her own emotional opinion. She isn't a fact-checker with the transcripts in front of her.

Tell me again how the media is unbiased.

Firstly... did you actually watch the video you linked?  The moderator knew exactly what was going on, and was correct and consistent during and after the debate.  What happened was, Romney's overall point was correct, in that the Obama administration didn't consistently portray the attacks as a terrorist attack until two weeks after they happened.  HOWEVER, what Romney actually said (that Obama didn't inform Americans that the attack was carried out by terrorists instead of rioters) was incorrect, because Obama referred to the attacks as an act of terror in a speech shortly after they happened.

Now, most people are going to take away that the moderator called Romney out on being wrong, because she did that first.  However, she both corrected Romney and then pointed out that he was right overall, which is consistent with the view she expresses after the debate.

Secondly, you can't take a single example of the way a single person acts, and generalize about the entire class that person belongs to.  ESPECIALLY if your evidence of how that person acts is a single minute of video ripped out of context.

Thirdly, if you use as evidence a video from a user that has GOP in the name and the republican elephant as its avatar, you don't get to throw the word unbiased around.

Fourthly, if your username is a made up word that begins with "troll", you should make a better effort to appear genuine, AKA not be confrontational and present shifty sources as argument enders.  Not saying you're a troll, just that you appear to be portraying yourself as one.

This. I'll even agree that the president spent a bit too much time talking about the tapes, but in the end, it's a stupid point to keep pushing. It doesn't MEAN anything substantial about the president or his policies and if you really were trying to convince people the president was doing a bad job, take a lesson from SalmonGod. He's(?) done more on this forum to make me see who the president really is than all the Republican BS fearmongering has done in the past 6 years. The president isn't perfect, he's lied, he's done some terrible things, and some decent things, and am I disappointed, yes. But that still doesn't change the fact that the policies he talks about sound better than the ones Romney has come out with... the few he has. I keep wanting to hear specifics from Romney, but any time he does bring out specific details of his plans, it just sounds so stupid, and so head in the clouds, and so... campaign promisey... that either, they're impossible or would lead to disaster.
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sluissa

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6845 on: October 17, 2012, 07:12:06 am »

Also, no love for geothermal? It tends to be ignored while talking about renewable power, but is a great powersource in those places were it's available.

My geology teacher explained to me once that good geothermal was generally impossible to pull off except in certain areas where the ground provided an easy method to harness it. Something about drilling deep enough to get to hot enough stuff was melting drill heads or something.

I don't know how much to trust him though. He was a part time teacher and his full time job was oil surveyor.

EDIT: Sorry, didn't mean to double post. Intended to edit it into the previous one.
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SalmonGod

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6846 on: October 17, 2012, 07:12:09 am »

He is correct :P
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In the land of twilight, under the moon
We dance for the idiots
As the end will come so soon
In the land of twilight

Maybe people should love for the sake of loving, and not with all of these optimization conditions.

sluissa

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6847 on: October 17, 2012, 07:21:12 am »

He is correct :P

Thank you. I was almost sure, then I started doubting myself and went back and stuck the (?) in.
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GlyphGryph

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6848 on: October 17, 2012, 07:22:43 am »

Thing is, she openly withdrew some accusations after the debate, because those weren't correct. "Romney was correct in the main" But few will hear her retraction.

You had a moderator interfering with her own emotional opinion. She isn't a fact-checker with the transcripts in front of her.

Tell me again how the media is unbiased.
Yeah.. that's not a retraction. That's repeating what she said in the debate hall. Its something any journalist worth their salt could have known, and you're going to have trouble convincing me, at least, that the moderator should allow bald-faced lies they know are lies. Go ahead, twist the truth, but you aren't allowed to just ignore realty.

That said, she did seem a bit more aggressive at cutting Romney off when overtime than she was Obama - I don't know if that's proof positive of a liberal bias (It could just be an incumbent bias, I don't remember the 2004 debates) but it's still an issue.
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SalmonGod

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6849 on: October 17, 2012, 07:26:39 am »

Also, as pointed out, it's well-known that I don't like Obama, enough that I refuse to vote for him.  I still feel I should say that I dislike stupid, desperate, republican arguments against Obama even more, including Trollheimer's.  It's incredibly annoying and pointless crap.  Do some real research and point out valid criticisms.  There are plenty.  I will also agree that he's done some good things as well.  It just happens that his failures to my political priorities (especially information freedom) outweigh everything else, in my opinion.
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In the land of twilight, under the moon
We dance for the idiots
As the end will come so soon
In the land of twilight

Maybe people should love for the sake of loving, and not with all of these optimization conditions.

GlyphGryph

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6850 on: October 17, 2012, 07:28:47 am »

Same boat, basically.
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Drunken

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6851 on: October 17, 2012, 07:58:14 am »

Romney: "Government doesn't create jobs"
Romney: "When I am in government I pledge to create 12 million jobs"

Err... right. The debate in the US is so messed up, in the last debate Obama said defensively "people accuse me of thinking the government creates jobs".

Of course the government creates jobs, one of them is titled president, and there are millions more. Is this kind of absurdity the result of a failed education system or is there some context I am missing where black is white and up is down?
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sluissa

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6852 on: October 17, 2012, 08:07:48 am »

There's also the fact that that 12 million number, as someone else on these boards I believe, has pointed out will only just barely keep up with expected population growth.

I don't see any way he could guarantee that number either without creating, out of thin air a ton of government jobs.

On the other hand, he could use his 230 million in assets to just hire 12 million people at slightly above minimum wage for about 2 hours.
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Leafsnail

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6853 on: October 17, 2012, 08:10:42 am »

This has to be seen to be believed.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/transcript-second-presidential-debate/

Quote
CROWLEY: Governor Romney, the question is about assault weapons, AK-47s.
ROMNEY: Yeah, I'm not in favor of new pieces of legislation on -- on guns and taking guns away or making certain guns illegal. We have
(AUDIO GAP)
OBAMA: because I do believe that if our young people have opportunity, then they're less likely to engage in these kind of violent acts.

What was actually said (all clearly audible):
Spoiler: They really cut a lot (click to show/hide)

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/10/17/us/politics/20121017-second-presidential-debate-obama-romney.html
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RedKing

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6854 on: October 17, 2012, 08:30:45 am »

I'm glad someone finally called Romney on at least SOME of his BS as well... even if it was, of all things, the moderator.
Best thing I've ever seen in an election ever.

Even better than the wacko going "HHHHHHRRRRRRRRRUUUUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!"

Thing is, she openly withdrew some accusations after the debate, because those weren't correct. "Romney was correct in the main" But few will hear her retraction.

You had a moderator interfering with her own emotional opinion. She isn't a fact-checker with the transcripts in front of her.

Tell me again how the media is unbiased.

Translation: "The refs are totally biased against us! There's no way that was a foul! Hey, that was intentional grounding! Are you fucking blind, ref??"

The GOP waaaambulance brigade is out in full force this morning. After all, they learned a long time ago that if you can't win the message, attack the medium itself. Next, they'll attack VHF broadcasts themselves, because being high-frequency, they're far beyond the blue-purple end of the visible spectrum, so they're obviously biased for Democrats.

Whereas talk radio is in the good conservative, sub-infrared portion of the spectrum.
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