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Author Topic: American Election Megathread - It's Over  (Read 763649 times)

GlyphGryph

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1425 on: February 01, 2012, 03:40:50 pm »

So, potentially... potentially the Citizens United decision might turn out to be a GOOD thing? :P
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RedKing

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1426 on: February 01, 2012, 04:28:18 pm »

So in other words, if you allow people to fling enough shit, eventually they'll drown in it?

Exxxxxcellent.

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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1427 on: February 01, 2012, 05:03:52 pm »

I think that if Obama was smart he would just close down his PAC entirely at this point.  He will have plenty of money through conventional sources.  The optics of having one guy getting bankrolled by millionaires and the other guy bankrolled by the middle class would be priceless.
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Taniec

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1428 on: February 02, 2012, 02:38:17 am »

Thread too long; didn't read.

Ron Paul is growing on me. Why?

He follows the Austrian School of economic thought, which at the moment, I agree with most in regards to monetary and fiscal policy. To note, I have a background in Economics and I feel the Austrian School does the best at explaining why business cycles happen...and at the simplest level...because of over expansion of credit. Instead, the Keynesians believe in the notion of "shit happens", partially due to animal spirit influence on market forces. I have a difficult time believing modern Keynesians still believe that, but Keyne himself attributed business cycles to spirits. But still, a lot of economists and financial people like to say recessions are just "natural" but they don't know the cause, and frankly I don't believe it. An action has to trigger a boom or a bust, just like getting punched in the face will give me a bruise.

That alone makes me like him over any other GOP candidate. Gingrich is nuts. Man is just nuts and nuts. Romney has no backbone and is just plain awkward. Says he won't release his tax information....one month later....he releases his tax records. Cant wait to see what he'll do with our nuclear and military secrets when dealing with foreign leaders. Nukes for all!

I seriously don't even feel like voting because this presidential race has THE WORST bunch of runners I have ever seen/read about. The GOP...my god. I feel like it's American Idol mixed with some kind of sick MTV reality show. And to note, my views lean more toward the right and I voted for Obama last time.

Then again, there are a lot of people who contributed to this thread who are much more intelligent when it comes to politics and such and I could be full of crap. To be honest, I hate how our presidential election has turned into an entertainment event. The youtube debates, Obama literally skyping with potential voters, the whole debacle. Bleh. If they would just do their jobs and stop all this BS, then I wouldn't be so cynical about the entire process.

EDIT: I just read he is opposed to the federal reserve system. And you know....it is kind of helpful. I don't know what to think anymore!!!  :-X ::) ??? :o :-* :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
« Last Edit: February 02, 2012, 02:47:37 am by Taniec »
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Luke_Prowler

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1429 on: February 02, 2012, 02:46:09 am »

What's wrong with Obama talking to voters? I thought on of the problems people had with politicians was them not talking directly
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Capntastic

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1430 on: February 02, 2012, 02:47:51 am »

You know that like, presidents all the way back through the ages used to like, go town to town and talk to constituents?  This is where we get the term stump speech.  If you're going to dismiss 'skyping with people' out of hand as tawdry entertainment, then I really don't know what to say.
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Taniec

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1431 on: February 02, 2012, 02:50:21 am »

Sorry. I should have clarified that him talking to people whether through technological or physical means is great, but I don't enjoy the fact that Obama can't do it without CNN in his face. I guess that's a pretty weird view point.
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G-Flex

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1432 on: February 02, 2012, 02:51:10 am »

Thread too long; didn't read.

Ron Paul is growing on me. Why?

Because you're not a fan of living in a country as much as living in a loosely-organized collection of fiefdoms controlled by robber barons who can freely violate your constitutional rights on a whim with no federal oversight?

Quote
Instead, the Keynesians believe in the notion of "shit happens", partially due to animal spirit influence on market forces. I have a difficult time believing modern Keynesians still believe that, but Keyne himself attributed business cycles to spirits.

If you really think any modern economist thinks like that, then your "background in Economics" is surprisingly limited and alien. In fact, I'd like to see some kind of source that any mainstream school of economics believes in the influence of "spirits".

Quote
But still, a lot of economists and financial people like to say recessions are just "natural" but they don't know the cause, and frankly I don't believe it. An action has to trigger a boom or a bust, just like getting punched in the face will give me a bruise.

Then you sound like you'd prefer a method of studying economics that is at least halfway empirical or scientific, as opposed to the austrian school, which rejects such methods.
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Capntastic

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1433 on: February 02, 2012, 02:56:28 am »

I'm going to drop a quote by Murray Rothbard, one of the big dudes in the Austrian school of economics, just so people who aren't "in the know" can get an idea of what Taniec is implicitly supporting:

"Supposedly "humanitarian" child labor laws have systematically forcibly prevented children from entering the labor force, thereby privileging their adult competitors."

His worldview only makes sense if you see literally every human interaction as a competition, without empathy of any sort.  It is unethical to allow children, who are demonstrably not rational actors, the 'right' to 'enter the labor force'. 
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Glowcat

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1434 on: February 02, 2012, 03:01:08 am »

If you really think any modern economist thinks like that, then your "background in Economics" is surprisingly limited and alien. In fact, I'd like to see some kind of source that any mainstream school of economics believes in the influence of "spirits".

I'm not sure about alien. I've heard his view once or twice in libertarian echo chambers, and they're very much earthlings. /silly
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Taniec

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1435 on: February 02, 2012, 03:08:33 am »

Yikes, my college education must have failed me.

1. The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money by Keynes discusses the idea of animal spirits in correlation with consumer confidence. He discusses that trust and confidence in the market is affected by outside animal influences. It isn't a MAJOR part of the book, however it is mentioned. He mentions that people like to act out of action, rather than "do the math" to determine benefits or probabilities.

2. To be fair, just because the Austrian School isn't known for being as mathematically heavy as other schools of thought (Many Austrians flat out reject empirical evidence), doesn't mean that math is thrown right out the window for all of those in line with Austrian thought. I'm not smart enough to win a nobel prize or develop my own sophisticated model, but of all the schools of thought that try to explain inflation, recessions, views on monetary and fiscal policy, the Austrian view makes the most sense to me. That is subject to change.

3. I prefer a utopian paradise, in which sexual orgies are the norm and my seed can be spread freely. Alas...such a day may never come.
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Capntastic

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1436 on: February 02, 2012, 03:10:01 am »

animal spirits

Many Austrians flat out reject empirical evidence

I think we've established we don't need to discredit this line of thought any more.
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G-Flex

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1437 on: February 02, 2012, 03:13:39 am »

1. The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money by Keynes discusses the idea of animal spirits in correlation with consumer confidence. He discusses that trust and confidence in the market is affected by outside animal influences. It isn't a MAJOR part of the book, however it is mentioned. He mentions that people like to act out of action, rather than "do the math" to determine benefits or probabilities.

You're ridiculously confused about what "animal spirit" even means in this case. It's not about outside influences. It's not about literal "spirits". It's about emotional and impulse decision-making. It has absolutely nothing to do with "outside animal influences" or literal spirits of any kind. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_spirits_%28Keynes%29

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3. I prefer a utopian paradise, in which sexual orgies are the norm and my seed can be spread freely. Alas...such a day may never come.

oh my god where did this even come from
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jester

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1438 on: February 02, 2012, 03:17:09 am »

Economics is voodoo anyway, whats wrong with blaming things on animal spirits?
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #1439 on: February 02, 2012, 03:19:02 am »

Hella ninja'd...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
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