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#1: Put the Alarm Siren in the Military Garrison, it fits and is one buildings less.

#1: Keep the Alarm Siren seperate, I want to have it near my other levers.

#2: I have traded with Gnomes, build Artificer and Weather Control Station.

#2: I have NOT traded with Gnomes, did not have the chance to build their buildings.

[GaxkangtheUnbound]

I think that there should be an option for more tools; meaning that stonecutter's workshop uses a 'chisel' that has a 5% chance to break with each task, and the same for the gem workshop. It would mean that you need wood to produce chisels before you can make everything with stone, and even then woodworking would be much less micromanagement-intensive. I think it would satisfy the parties who want stonecutter's to not make the carpenter's shop obsolete, and people who just want stonecutter's as it is.

[MiamiBryce]

Meph,

I read back several pages and didn't see any reference to this.  I finally got around to being able to play 1.5.1 since you released it:

Regular elf caravan came
They had blood steel.
I have war pets turned on and they didn't offer any for trade.

FYI I noticed in an older game it's not safe for regular elves to bring magma hounds in wooden cages.  Highly amusing, but not safe.

P.S.  Having cremating remains and grinding meat cause dwarves to be sick is a little silly.  I mean, i can see getting momentarily nauseated by the sight/smell of something...but they leave trails of vomit everywhere.

Thanks.

[bombzero]

@Meph, yeah i know, just concerned about how making blocks on repeat will work out in the long run, go for the block idea, i modded it in myself to test it, and it works out alright.
makes slightly more sense too, considering that making a stone item from a stack of blocks, is probably easier than making it from piles of boulders.

@current magic system: loving it, never been one for dealing with crossbows or other ranged weapons, i usually only have one ranged squad.
but the magic system allows me to create effective ranged units that are free of the frustrating vanilla bugs.


EDIT: simple trading option auto resets to NO in the GUI, just though id let you know.

[ItchyBeard]

About bins and blocks:
I personally see the stonecutter as a sort of upgraded mason. But currently the stonecutter works very well all alone. If I make blocks needed for many reactions in it, then people have to run the mason, and then the stonecutter next to it. For me, this makes sense. The stonecutter is of course no replacement for the mason, but almost for the carpenter. The three Bs. Beds, Bins, Barrels. They should be a bit harder to make then wooden ones. Not easier.

PS: @bombzero: Damn you are in a bad mood these last days. Three mason running "make blocks" on repeat is not tedious micromanagement.

I'm assuming this will increase stockpile micro a little (I'm assuming stonecutting will work on colored bricks for example).

If you do go down the blocks route, it might be a good idea to make the crafting job names more descriptive e.g. "Make stone bin from block", otherwise it's non-obvious when queuing jobs through the job manager what the requirements for a job is. I don't mind the change to blocks overall - blocks are a lot easier to transport from place to place than stone. It would be nice to have some rapid block producing jobs though (e.g. a 'batch of ten blocks' type of deal on the stone grinder maybe?)

My current fort has upwards of 800barrels/bins in year 6 with 4 full-time stonecutters/masons and a constant supply of stone (I built a large scale manually operated obsidian factory - produces somewhere around 440 stone each time it's operated).

What was the nature of the fix for slade bars? Can it be applied to a running fort? I''m 6 years into my current fort and just got a slade factory up and running and wanted to try out slade weapons... but they don't work in my current version.

Tallow candles also don't seem to be valid 'candles' for the purposes of constructing the evil nasty temple thing. Does it have to be wax candles, or a special candle I don't have? It says I need 2, but I have 7 tallow candles. Going outside to find bees for wax is not practical right now... might have to wait until the humans, zombies, and unicorns finish fighting.

Currently trying to get plans for a magma weaponry but I've been under siege continuously for 5 years so no traders are arriving. Managed to get a magma armoury out of my resident mad scientist, but the tech factory is really really slow.

Had a food scare earlier on - all my cats got vaporised by a hellfire turret (which actually saved the day by also melting my entrance bridge - yay), and the 'vermin eating food' thing seems to have a fairly big effect. Also no ash due to no cats/lizards. Is it possible to have a reaction which takes vermin from animal traps and turns them into ash at the crematorium? (burn trapped vermin?). My current plan is to assign a couple of dwarves to vermin capture, but I don't know how to dispose of the vermin afterwards.

I think that there should be an option for more tools; meaning that stonecutter's workshop uses a 'chisel' that has a 5% chance to break with each task, and the same for the gem workshop. It would mean that you need wood to produce chisels before you can make everything with stone, and even then woodworking would be much less micromanagement-intensive. I think it would satisfy the parties who want stonecutter's to not make the carpenter's shop obsolete, and people who just want stonecutter's as it is.

That would overly complicate things and slow down crafting jobs (any jobs requiring a preserved reagent go more slowly as they have a tendency to get re-stockpiled - they also go slower because the workshop gets more cluttered due to the added item). It would also be inconsistent with every other workshop in the game (why don't we have anvils wear out? I don't think that would add anything.

My suggestion for 'fixing' the stonecutter is somewhat different, though I honestly don't think it's broken in the current form:
 

• Make each stonecutter job produce some sort of waste product (e.g. 'stone debris').

If you classified it as 'refuse', this would tie up haulers without causing the workshop itself to be any more annoying. It makes sense to me that a job which makes a bin out of a boulder would have a lot of leftovers. If not disposed of / dumped, this would slow down stonecutter jobs over time as the workshop becomes cluttered. Tying up haulers is preferable to tying up my masons. My masons are already overworked making doors, coffins, etc.

I also don't buy any arguments along the lines of "bins would have to be really thick and heavy!". If dwarves can carry the boulders which make the bins, they can surely carry the bins themselves. Maybe they add wheels? Maybe they're just that dwarfy.

[bombzero]

• Make each stonecutter job produce some sort of waste product (e.g. 'stone debris').

im not sure if meph wants to add waste products that accomplish nothing but tying up haulers with dumping something...


but on the candle thing: Meph, beekeeping is horribly broken ATM, it has multiple serious caveats. and can become permanently bugged in any given fortress...

EDIT: current dark necromancer interaction is broken, no ability to raise corpses for warlocks or dwarf necromancer.

[UncleCern]

I tried 1.5.1 and had some severe crashes in 100% embarks after 3-5 minutes. Gamelog shows crap. No idea why game crashes.

Back to 1.5.0 - this one works well for me. Having tons of fun with my current fort right now. Especially after drows came and immediately something called blood beast appeared as they started unloading goods. Infected 30% of my population with necrosis (only feet luckily so only one died thanks to quick medical staff response).

[ItchyBeard]

• Make each stonecutter job produce some sort of waste product (e.g. 'stone debris').

im not sure if meph wants to add waste products that accomplish nothing but tying up haulers with dumping something...

Yet he's perfectly ok with artificially tying up my masons with crafting/hauling things . I just hate the idea of not having easy access to bins/barrels. I murdered one of my vampires and he was carrying over 1000 amulets/rings/etc. That all needs to go somewhere.

My suggestion above was an attempt to avoid these two situations:

• Needing craft blocks on auto-repeat - this causes me to run out of stone (both in a local stockpile and in general) and is a problem when other items (e.g. tables) are made of boulders. I don't want my masons turning all my stone-which-is-going-to-be-a-table into blocks.
  
• Needing to queue up two crafting jobs when I just want 30 more bins. I don't want to have to queue up 30 block jobs, then 30 bin jobs, and then get a bunch of spam because one job is going faster than the other. The problem is magnified when I want 100 more bins because my furnaces are going all out...

These are very minor issues though. I'm ok with blocks for bins.

You're probably right though... extra hauling jobs would probably slow the game down.

[Iax]

One quick bug,  I just tried out the uniform macro and for all the new uniforms it sets up, it doesnt specify any armor for the uniforms, just legs/helm/gloves/boots.
Other than that I really like the uniform macro,  I hate having to go through and set up the different stuff every time.

Also any reason why the macro picks low boots for everything,  whats the difference?

[bombzero]

the throwers are supposed to be light armored shock troops i think... decimating the enemy with thrown weapons and then following up with a quick cleanup. btw throwing weapons have same stats as the standard type of that weapon... theirs no reason NOT to use throwing weapons...

[smakemupagus]

the throwers are supposed to be light armored shock troops i think... decimating the enemy with thrown weapons and then following up with a quick cleanup. btw throwing weapons have same stats as the standard type of that weapon... theirs no reason NOT to use throwing weapons...

There is a trade off, attacking at range with it uses the throwing skill rather than the axe (etc.) skill, so if your guys fight in close combat too they'll need to level up two combat skills

[slay_mithos]

No, most throwers use and train the related weapon skill (spear, axe, sword), making it a good way to use recruits in battle, while still keeping them mostly away from the main fight.

[Iax]

Its just that the included macro doesnt give them ANY torso armor or head armor,  I think thats by mistake or is it on purpose?

[alagon]

Hey Meph,

I also encountered the crossbowdorf not equiping rock-tip bolts problem like someone earlier in this thread.

I was besieged by 28 dark stargelers in the late winter of the 1st year. Luckily my simple moat and bridge were up, and also they were just sit outside and wait. So i try to make some quick copper and iron weapon and armor, and decided to strike them once the core team is ready. In the second month of the next year, I assmebled a markdorf squad of 3, a heavy melee squad of 2, and a sucidal miner squad of 5. However, when the time comes, I found none of my markdorf were bring ammo with em.

1. I tried to let them equip specific ammo, namely rocktip blunt bolts under both "bolts" and "foreign bolts" category. Not working.
2. I tried to give different order, moving em around and disbanding them. After awhile, re-actived them to see if they would equip ammo. However, they did not.
3. I tried to move the ammo from and to different stockpile, and to see if option 1 and 2 will work. Again failed. My squad would just stand next to the stockpile full of bolts but did nothing.

After trying for the last 2 hours, I cannot but give up trying. I still have the last save before I assembling the squads to break siege. I will post the save file up, and see if you want to have a try.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7708225/region1-sum-252.rar

All the ammo is currently on the big stockpile of 1st fort floor. All the military team were set up already, you only need to change the ammo type in the military screen to see if you can make any difference.

I will try a bit more after I went back home later!

Btw, I am using v1.51 of the mod, plus the quick "object" update from yesterday!

[smakemupagus]

@alagon, I've had my guys use rocktip bolts in 1.5.1, but i don't think I do anything different than you describe 

@everyone:

Silkworms.
How do you use em?  They're in cages.  I can take them out of cages to put them in animal traps, that doesn't seem too useful.

[Meph]

Silkworn need hives, like bees. And instead of harvesting wax, you harvest silk. Needs the beekeeping skill.

The wax problem is not really a problem, since candles can be made from tallow as well. I think the problem is (was, i fixed it) that the reaction wants candles, but the produced candles are produced in a box. I added [REAGENT:Box:1:BOX:NONE:NONE:NONE]     
    [CONTAINS:A][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
         [DOES_NOT_DETERMINE_PRODUCT_AMOUNT]
to the reaction, should work fine. I also took out candles from the building mats for the dark church. Did they work fine in this ?

The armor macros are from 3 versions back, maybe something has changed in that regard. The problem is that macros are stupid, if I alter ONE item, then the macros might get confused. I will test them. Same goes for disabling certain parts of the mod, the macros wont work then. They need the default setting, or at least no changes to the items.

Funny that there is such a big discussion about the bins... ^^ I make them from blocks now. End of story. Just playing a game with this change, and it is barely any extra work.

Throwing weapons use the weapon skill in close combat, and the throwing skill in ranged combat. I intended them to be different, but smakemupagus noticed that. I included a throwing training to the libraries btw, just for those.

The slade bars fix was simple, I just removed the slade mineral, and made the reaction to accept the slade stone, but produce the slade ore/metal. This way people can make slade in the factory, grind it to powder and smelt the powder to slade bars. Currently the value of slade is super low (still vanilla value) so you can embark with a full set of slade armor.

@Alagon: I will have a look later. Thanks for the upload.

Regular elf caravan came
They had blood steel.
I have war pets turned on and they didn't offer any for trade.

FYI I noticed in an older game it's not safe for regular elves to bring magma hounds in wooden cages.  Highly amusing, but not safe.

P.S.  Having cremating remains and grinding meat cause dwarves to be sick is a little silly.  I mean, i can see getting momentarily nauseated by the sight/smell of something...but they leave trails of vomit everywhere.

This is odd. I will test this, since I play a testfort just now anyway. But really difficult, I have slime raining all day, everyone hit gets major bruises and falls asleep. Even invaders, birds and caravans. The map is... fun... kind of.

PS: OMG, so much balancing. I have a long list of balancing, some few bugs remaining, a lot of flavor/refining that is not terribly important but makes the mod look better, and 11 pages in my "eternal to do list" What would you say about adding diseases ? (i'll do it anyway )