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[Necro910]

For me its not about my enjoyment or concern that I still have so much left to accomplish.  I'm fairly lazy and I know I'm not going to do anything amazing in my life.  I simply like existing.  Not existing seems like the most terrible thing I can think of, and I'm an Atheist so I can't console myself with an afterlife.

It might be considered selfish or narrow minded, but I really don't think its such a bad thing to want to live.  I'm still hoping that before I get cancer, a heart attack or a deadly stroke that they figure out how to copy brains into computers.   

FEAR MY OMNIPRESENT MALWARE BEING! I SEE ALL! I AM ALL!

NeCRO9-10? Neurotoxins ahoy.

[Itnetlolor]

If I ever had a terminal illness that would guarantee my death, as a big middle finger to healthcare and the types of people who live life to their fullest when near death; I would not change my life, or what I would do with my final moments at all.

Simply put, I've been given such a hypothetical to the point of if I was aware that I would die in less than an hour, what would I do? "Nothing different from usual." would be my answer.

I mean, if there's a pet peeve I have, it's people who finally live when they're about to die. It only proves to me that they chose to die while alive, and then panic in their last moments. To add to the pet peeve are terrible people who finally have a change of heart and become good people at the last moments of their life. Hey, it may pass for some people, but God can see past your crap. The Scroodge method of redemption has been abused so many times, it's practically a trope.

As an alternative answer to my last moments; had I the funds, I would orchestrate an elaborate Thanatos gambit prank to trigger moments before I actually pass so I can confirm that it started. Essentially, I would have a series of activities go on that emulate that I'm still alive (or as a ghost, am interacting with the real world), just to screw around with people for at least a year. The prank would end on April 1st however.

[Funk]

life is the only thing any off us really ever has beond it lies only a void mystery.
in time you and all who know you will fade away it the the void mystery ,but only by great acts can but a warp reflection of your life be left behind, the glory of achilles.
look at those that have left there own the glory of achilles,Adolf Hitler ,Joseph Stalin ,Winston Churchill, Alexander the Great mankind will not forget them,but nor will it forgive them.

[MonkeyHead]

Yea, the whole bucket list crap pisses me off too. You dont need an excuse to do the things that would make you happy.

[Necro910]

Yea, the whole bucket list crap pisses me off too. You dont need an excuse to do the things that would make you happy.

If you're about to die, might as well do a shitton of excessively dangerous nonsense that will likely get you killed.

You're dead anyway, WHY NOT IN STYLE?

life is the only thing any off us really ever has beond it lies only a void mystery.
in time you and all who know you will fade away it the the void mystery ,but only by great acts can but a warp reflection of your life be left behind, the glory of achilles.
look at those that have left there own the glory of achilles,Adolf Hitler ,Joseph Stalin ,Winston Churchill, Alexander the Great mankind will not forget them,but nor will it forgive them.

The eternal fame of men is written in the blood of their enemies. A couple percent of the world's population is an effective number, don'tcha think?

[Itnetlolor]

Yea, the whole bucket list crap pisses me off too. You dont need an excuse to do the things that would make you happy.

If you're about to die, might as well do a shitton of excessively dangerous nonsense that will likely get you killed.

You're dead anyway, WHY NOT IN STYLE?

That is probably my only real exception; which I also propose to suicidal people.

"Live life like it's your last day on earth." is not my cup of tea as a sentiment. If I were to follow that, I'd be so sluggish and unmotivated to get out of bed or where I currently am, I would be legally marked as dead. I suppose if you're taking advantage of a guaranteed last few days on Earth, might as well be a total dick about it and have some fun. Which I suppose can explain some people on the elderly front. They can get away with asshole behavior because they stopped caring since they know they're past their prime and so forth; they're just taking advantage of their final moments. Plus, seeing how the younger generations are pretty much throwing their lives out the door anyhow much of the time (as far as the media also shows), I would understand the elders' vendetta against the youthful, and being 15-under speed limit drivers and so forth, and being a pain in the ass in grocery stores. This is a pastime for them in their final days. Who wouldn't take advantage of such a perk?

On the suicide front:
To off oneself to to end your life because something made you sad is just crap, and is stupid, and you're running away from your problems. However, if you decide to face your problems head-on, since you have nothing left to lose, well then, now we're going somewhere. If you're too scared to do that; I would only have to ask why you have no fear to end your life however? So you have less fear killing yourself, instead of making your suicide useful or fun? I mean, if you lost the value of your own life already, then you should be able to face any problem from thereon with gusto. At least, anytime I get hit with suicidal depression, I do something silly/crazy/stupid, and if I survive, I'm that much more awesome and immediately knocked out of it (depression, not life). If anything, I look forward to suicidal tendencies. Gives me more balls than usual to do something all-out nuts.

Much apologies if that offends anyone, but I am not a fan of suicidal types unless they do something useful or fun with it; even screwing others out of further torment of the victim before they kill or spare them for more future torture, and at least have post-mortem plans to haunt them for the rest of their lives or something. But suicide as an escape infuriates me, and is by my books, the most cowardly act ever outside of using the law (not law enforcement/police, but the legal part instead, like economy-based laws) to your advantage to bully someone.

Speaking of bullying, that's something that came up during an argument about bullying, and suicidal kids. I have been subject to bullying all my life. Even still as an adult. If you're driven to suicide, then that's one of the best times to face a bully. Once you stop caring or valuing your life, you have personal right to go effin' nuts all over them, and scare them straight. Why? because normally with those tendencies, you'd be running away from the problem and killing yourself. Why not face your problems and die anyway? The difference would be the amount of balls you leave the Earth with. And provided you survive, you've just made yourself that much more awesome.

[GlyphGryph]

So what do you think of Terry Pratchetts decision to commit suicide, then?

[kaijyuu]

Have you ever had depression or closely known someone with it, Itnet?



Anywho, in my opinion the concepts of "cowardice" and "bravery" do not exist, or at least they're meaningless. They reek of "honor before reason." Doing something brave but stupid is, well, stupid. Running away or giving up can be a perfectly valid solution to a problem. What does matter, though, are the concepts of selfishness and generosity. Running away from a problem only to leave it to be dealt with by other people is quite selfish. Taking on a problem yourself so others don't have to is generous. As such, calling someone a "coward" is a pointless and empty insult to me, while "selfish" will likely fit the bill much better in most situations where it is used.

As far as suicide goes.... that depends on the situation. Depression can be cured (or at least mitigated). Cancer... less likely (same goes for other mostly incurable terminal diseases). As such, suicide seems a quite reasonable solution to the latter problem if it means less pain for little to no benefit, and if selfishness comes into play, it's the family members imposing their own idea of what the dying person should do.

[Itnetlolor]

Sorry I wasn't able to respond. 504'd for some odd reason for the past hour or so.

Maybe I overstepped my ground in that regard (was meaning to edit post until I couldn't access bay-12 for the time being); though I have had my bouts of serious depression in the past. I suppose one of the ways I coped with depression to even the suicidal levels myself was to give myself an ego boost regarding achievements in my life, or taking advantage of a self-value toss-out or something; or simply put, convincing myself that doing any self-damage would only inconvenice me later on. Regardless how bad I got with any form of depression I fell into, I was always put off by stuff like cutting and whatnot. Sorta why I go to the levels I stated.

I dunno. I at least try to reverse my mindset under the worst conditions, essentially turning waste into fuel. Sometimes it tends to go nuclear. The results tend to be unpredictable at times.

EDIT:
Regarding Terry Pratchett, I would actually consider self-execution over a worse method of dying is not really a form of cowardice than taking advantage of a potential convenience. Given the chance, I would prefer a quicker and more painless death anytime; even if it means committing suicide. Sorta like a cyanide pill option over arduous torture that eventually leads to death. I'll take the cyanide pill please.

EDIT EDIT: (Don't mean to derail, so don't start one from this.)
At a religious level where suicide is looked down upon greatly as a needless/pointless method of escape from life (where much of my basis of perspective about the matter comes from as well). I would suppose the more forgiving side of God would understand the context of the suicide. If there's no choice but death, choose the less painful path, or endure the pain and give the pain up for salvation (or something to that effect) in lieu of others in pain. I suppose it's a sorta honor thing (like the source of miracles is funded by the selfless acts of endurance and sacrifice of others, given to those they're going through the pain for). Under such context, actually seems to humanize the concept of God a bit there (making miracles a form of economy even). In a sense, I think at a supernatural level, the more you can endure, the more you can overcome after crossing over. In theory, life could be none more than training to become a warrior of God. Reincarnation is taking the course again.

[GlyphGryph]

There's an interesting question there, though - who is more of a coward? He who welcomes death with open arms simply because he is tired of living, or he will do anything, burden their family, destroy their wealth, live and misery and pain, anything at all to avoid its grasp?

It's no an easy question, because there's no real answer. There are those who prolong their life out of fear, and those who do so out of a stubborn commitment to fighting it through. But I don't think you can call accepting the outcomes of an illness cowardice. Selfishness, perhaps, in some situations. Stupid, maybe. But cowardly? I'm not so sure.

Regarding Terry Pratchett, I would actually consider self-execution over a worse method of dying is not really a form of cowardice than taking advantage of a potential convenience.

He's not choosing it over anything painful, though. In fact, the condition he has is Alzheimers. He's choosing, quite simply, to go out on a high note rather than as a madman. Perhaps he is afraid of who he'll become when his mind goes - thats fear. Is it a good enough reason to end his life? Perhaps he's afraid of being a burden on those around him - again, fear. Cowardice could be the driving factor. But sometimes... sometimes dying really is better than the alternative, isn't it?

Surely we all have things we believe are worth dying for? Why not our own happiness, or are legacy in the memories of loved ones?

[mainiac]

The prank would end on April 1st however.

Or would it?  MuwahahaHAha

[Jimmy]

Glad to see such a large amount of lively discussion in my topic.

On the subject of end of life awareness, I feel privileged to work as a health care professional. I see the sick and dying on a daily basis and it's forced me to confront these issues myself. Though I don't face a terminal illness and hope to enjoy many years of full life, in the event something happens I have done my best to prepare myself and my family.

I strongly suggest everyone research the steps involved in completing an advance medical health directive. I have completed one to state my wishes in the event I end up in a situation where I'm unable to communicate due to injury or illness. Basically you can outline whether you want medical staff to spend every effort to keep you alive, or draw a line at the point you would want them to turn off the machine. It's also a method of clearly defining your enduring power of attorney for choices about your health so you know which family member will be calling the shots for you. I personally think "Do Not Code" tattoos are an excellent idea if you're reaching the end of your life and want to pass with dignity.

I've had a marvelous discussion with a social worker who specializes in working with end of life hospice patients. She herself is a Buddhist nun and works from a monastery in the nearest metropolitan city to provide support for people facing the final stages of terminal illness. An amazing person and someone I deeply respect, she had so many insights and stories about the different ways people face their death. Ultimately we will all die, and I know I hope my passing will be dignified and on my own terms.

[scriver]

Sorry I wasn't able to respond. 504'd for some odd reason for the past hour or so.

Maybe I overstepped my ground in that regard (was meaning to edit post until I couldn't access bay-12 for the time being); though I have had my bouts of serious depression in the past. I suppose one of the ways I coped with depression to even the suicidal levels myself was to give myself an ego boost regarding achievements in my life, or taking advantage of a self-value toss-out or something; or simply put, convincing myself that doing any self-damage would only inconvenice me later on. Regardless how bad I got with any form of depression I fell into, I was always put off by stuff like cutting and whatnot. Sorta why I go to the levels I stated.

I dunno. I at least try to reverse my mindset under the worst conditions, essentially turning waste into fuel. Sometimes it tends to go nuclear. The results tend to be unpredictable at times.

No fucking way you've ever suffered from depression, Itnet. I refuse to believe it's possible to go through that and come out with such an uninformed notion of what depression is. It's like having gone through spinal paralysis and coming to the conclusion that "all those lameys should just pull themselves together and start walking, that's what I did". Whatever little inconveniencing bouts of sadness you suffered from, it sure wasn't depression.

[Luke_Prowler]

I don't know about you guys, but I plan on living forever.

Working fine so far.

[justinlee999]

You may die today, you may die tomorrow, or you may die in 30 years.

But never forget.