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[PTTG??]

The problem is the voters. People keep voting for democrats and republicans after being shown time and time again that both sides are uninterested in serving the country. You can't change the system by voting for the same two parties.

[Itnetlolor]

I think it's more the case of how much our political system, or more like our country, has pretty much turned into a super-massive high school. Those in politics are interested in serving the country to progress their own means. If it means locking down the A/V kids because they can easily slander them with a birthday party gone wrong video or something of the sort, or have connections with "Anonymous", and organize a homebrewed terrorism plot against somebody clearly in the wrong (as revenge as well for countless acts of bullying and abuse of power); they'll stop at nothing to make sure they get not only their A/V labs and such shut down, but also turned into the biggest outcasts in the school system, that not even the other nerds want to be associated with them; either out of fear of the school political clubs outcasting them as well (mostly made of "the populars" or those funded by friends who are related to the local donut shop owner or something, and pays voters off with that convenience), or because they feel shame for that group as badly as everyone else, despite being (near-constant) targets of bullying themselves.

You'd think the foreign and drama clubs are let off easily by them? Hah. They're just as bad off for the evulz, so to put it.

So far, the high school analogy of how our country is running is probably the most accurate representation of what's going on.

[Criptfeind]

I feel the issue is the people who think the issue is the 'voters'

I can't blame someone for not doing more then a minimum in a fucked up system, but I sure can blame someone for being useless and calling others useless.

Now. Not saying that you -PTTG-are worthless. But most people who talk like that are.

[PTTG??]

I didn't say anything about anyone being useless. What I said is that people who vote for the same party every year and then complain about getting the same results astound me.

[Criptfeind]

So tell me.

What do you do?

[inteuniso]

You form your own damn party, and you actually campaign for it across the internet, and you use kickstarter to gain funds for ads, and you get up enough support where you can actually get a candidate into a debate (18%, by the way)

[PTTG??]

I vote for independent and third-party candidates. Was that not clear?

[Criptfeind]

I vote for independent and third-party candidates. Was that not clear?

What I am getting at is voting for a third party that is never going to win is less useful then voting for a party that can win, but is not good.

[Darvi]

Now you're just being a jerk, Cript.

*nothing new*

[Criptfeind]

It's true though. If you want to help: Do something along the lines of what Inteuniso said (perhaps not that drastic)

If you want a hope someone else does something: Fine.

If you want to be all uppity about the people who just sit and hope: You better damn well be a person who is actually doing something. Or at least not actually being worse then the people you are being uppity about.

[Darvi]

I think PTTG made it pretty clear that he's not one of those not doing anything. It might be not much, but it's not nothing

[Criptfeind]

He votes for third parties:

What I am getting at is voting for a third party that is never going to win is less useful then voting for a party that can win, but is not good.

Unless he does other things, which he has not made it clear if he does, I do, in fact, count him in the less then useless pile.

[Aklyon]

Its also useless to vote for the same party every year regardless, though.

[Criptfeind]

True.

You got me there.

I cast him in the worse then useless pile.

Edit: Also. Like I said. I don't have a issue with useless people. I have a issue with people who are useless but still decry others for being useless. Hypocrites if you will.

[ECrownofFire]

Third parties really can't win in a FPTP system anyway. You either split the vote or you're successful and beat out one of the previous two, which is incredibly unlikely.