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Author Topic: Suggested Armour Overhaul.  (Read 1252 times)

Iosis4al1

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Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« on: November 14, 2011, 01:56:29 pm »

A few tweaks to enhance the realism add flavour of worn equipment.

Head armour
-A new token to cancel head protection in cojunction with LBSTEP for collar type throat only armours.

Chest armour
-A new token to designate whether an armour piece covers the back or not.
-A chest piece overhaul: breastplates don't cover backs, cuirasses cover fronts & backs but not arms, hauberk cover fronts, backs, have sleaves & covers the upper legs.
-UBSTEP should be split into 2 tags to allow actual shoulder armour: spaulders= upper arms 50% protection: pauldrons= upper arms 100%, Cover: capes= back only, cloaks= chest-feet 50%, & mantles chest-feet 100%
-New Armour types with new flexibilities: laminar [BARRED] armour close to plate for chests, splinted mail [BARRED] with cloth backing for arms & legs, lamellar large [SCALED] armour for chests, scale armour [SCALED] with cloth backing for all armour pieces, & [ADJECTIVE:quilted] doublets for plain cloth chest armour.

Hand Armour
-A workable Left/Right tag for manually added complex reactions & adventure mode mods.

Shields
-Completely balanced using using at least 2 [BLOCKCHANCE] tags: a buckler = excellent melee block chance, a tower shield = excellent ranged block chance but probably shouldn't even use a blockchance stat as its just a passive moving wall, any shield in the middle = moderate in both.
-A directional '(' in front of mobs using said tower shield to designate futility of attacking that side.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2011, 12:44:13 am by Iosis4al1 »
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King DZA

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2011, 02:18:46 pm »

I'm all for realism and variety, but I think we should wait until Toady works out some of the bigger problems with the military system before making it more complex.

Iosis4al1

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2011, 02:41:19 pm »

dying to a serpentine of 4 goblin races at once can't be overhauled too much, but dying to 4 golin raids while in the tight formation...maybe
& what a coinkydink Wine on my system currently violently buffer overflowes too, serves me right for registry transferring.
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Kattaroten

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2011, 02:52:15 pm »

A good idea for sure, but you would need to rework the combat system quite a lot to account for attack direction and such.
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RabidAnubis

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2011, 10:36:22 pm »

This is before it's time.

And tower shields are just at good if not better at blocking meele as bucklers are.  Perhaps they should add in formations and stuff, doing spartan like stuff together.

But the militarily I think is coming after the tavern arc.  So don't worry about this until the tavern arc is coming to an end.
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Iosis4al1

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2011, 11:13:16 pm »

you sure: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shield can't wait for mobile build-able shield emplacements in ma adventure mode =)
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Neonivek

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2011, 12:09:07 am »

you sure: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shield can't wait for mobile build-able shield emplacements in ma adventure mode =)

One of the largest issues with applying real life to Dwarf Fortress is super attributes.

A lot of the issues with weapons and armor are completely overwritten when you have characters capable of lifting cows or who can sprint for hours.
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MrWiggles

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2011, 12:31:26 am »

I think dont this can work, because of the modding community and with the generated creatures.

With these tags to work, it requires a certain amount of assumed sanity with body morphology, which might not always be true.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2011, 12:41:47 am by MrWiggles »
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Iosis4al1

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2011, 12:41:21 am »

Or can punch through solid plate armour on that fateful pesky bogeyman infested night... wait what where we talking about?
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SirHoneyBadger

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2011, 07:05:29 am »

The way I'd like to see armour handled in the game is via measuring how much of a given bodypart is covered by a single piece of armour, as a percentage. Armour would then cover that bodypart in a layer fashion, dependent on material type, quality, and any damage that material had suffered.

In other words, a good right gauntlet would cover 100% of the hand, and 100% of the forearm, with leather, perhaps 80% of the forearm with light chain, 10% of the forearm with heavy chain, 70% of the hand with heavy chain, and 30% of the hand with light plate. All materials would be of fine quality, and the metals could be specified as, say, light steel plate, heavy bronze chain, light bronze chain. A weapon strike to the arm would then have a set 100% chance of atleast striking leather before flesh, with maybe a 33% chance to hit the hand.

Hitting the hand would result in the material of the weapon having a 70% chance to be countered by heavy bronze chain, and a 30% chance of being countered by light steel plate. Creating a wound would require cutting through as many layers as the armour provides, and each layer could react to force differently, depending on the material, quality, and if it's a surface layer.

This would give an armour system that is infinitely customizeable and quite deep, and also-atleast relatively-straightforward to understand. If you can understand Z-layers, it's not really all that different.

It should (I speculate) be capable of meshing with the current weapon/combat system, and could even incorporate various special aspects such as damage to armour, failure of small parts of a larger piece of armour, wounds resulting from damage to armour, Armour upgrades (replacing the above fine light chain with masterwork quality light chain, or steel, for instance), and even the calculation of how well specific weights "sit" on specific parts of the body.
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Funk

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2011, 07:20:49 pm »

did you just try to get muiti type armor?

is light and heavy chain is a bit hard to under stand,i think that by heavy mail you mean mail with thinker links?,
or do you mean 2 in 8 patten?(most mail is 1 in 4, one link is link to 4 more links)
read more here

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Agree, plus that's about the LAST thing *I* want to see from this kind of game - author spending valuable development time on useless graphics.

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IT 000

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2011, 04:19:48 am »

Sounds like a great idea, but first the one bar per armor regardless of size bug needs to be fixed, otherwise there is no point in making anything other then hauberks unless you're looking for a challenge.

A good idea for sure, but you would need to rework the combat system quite a lot to account for attack direction and such.


*already does, it's more prominent in adventure mode, and there is currently no way to tell where somebody is facing without attacking them, but it's there.
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peskyninja

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2011, 04:44:25 am »

Maybe the bigger the armour and the more complex it is the more experience/knowledge and of course materials are needed to craft it.
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SirHoneyBadger

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Re: Suggested Armour Overhaul.
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2011, 05:54:55 am »

did you just try to get muiti type armor?

is light and heavy chain is a bit hard to under stand,i think that by heavy mail you mean mail with thinker links?,
or do you mean 2 in 8 patten?(most mail is 1 in 4, one link is link to 4 more links)
read more here

Just generic *heavy* vs generic *light*, for simplification.

Heavy chain could mean thicker links, or a doubled layer of links, or 2 in 8 pattern, or whatever is preferred. More generic terminology, in my opinion, helps modders mod, but ofcourse, it's easier to complicate the terms than to simplify them, so whatever is desired could probably work.
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