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[thistleknot]

Maybe I'm not doing it the right way, but I like to let my non important civilians run outside and pick up anything and everything (goblinite type stuff).

My entrance to the caverns is generally accessed from the outside, far away from my fort.  So my dwarves run off into the wilderness to the stairwell leading deep into the caverns (I just completed my internal entrance as well, but I'm still working on all the traps).

My question is this.  As bad guys occasionally show up, sometimes my dwarves are caught inbetween the stairwell and the fort's safety, sometimes resulting in death.

Although lately, I've been okay for the most part, only losing one or two at a time.  I'm trying to learn from my mistakes and ensure proper safety.

So rather than let me dwarves run off into the wilderness, is there a better way?  I was thinking setting prefferred paths, and assign a burrow to that path for my militia to patrol.  So the "invaders" such as the recent cave dragon, are targetted by my militia while everyone else can run to safety.

Any other ideas?

[i2amroy]

Dig a path underground that leads from your fort to the cavern access stairwell and make that the only way to reach the stairwell. Then you can trap that corridor to your hearts delight and as the dwarves are still technically inside of your fort they will never be caught aboveground under the sun's harsh light and the deadly hail of goblin bolts.

[King DZA]

I just dug out a stairway directly under my fort and placed a floor hatch over it.

Although, to be honest, my caverns seem pretty tame. The only forgotten beast I've encountered was a blob of snow with a tail, and that was killed by my friendly neighborhood olm people.

[thistleknot]

Well I like to recover goblinite, which is outside.  The underground cavernous hallway is a great idea though.  I could have multiple openings.  But I'm not sure if that is going to protect me in the long run.

[i2amroy]

I just dug out a stairway directly under my fort and placed a floor hatch over it.

Be careful with this, as Trolls will smash their way right through any floor hatches you have, allowing goblins to walk rich tint your fortress. As for the goblinite, I tend to just simply wait until the siege has been completely defeated and the goblins have retreated and then open up my doors and let all of my dwarves go out to grab things. If all the goblins are gone, then there are no problems picking up the stuff, but if any are still hanging around all I have to do is activate the alert that restricts civilians to a burrow inside the fort, at which point they simply retreat behind the entrance traps.

[thistleknot]

This is exactly what I've been doing, but I was 'surprised' by a cave dragon on the top part of the map.  And, well.  I was thinking if I had the militia on patrol up top, the dragon wouldn't have targeted innocent (well, maybe not completely) civilians.

I thought the tunnel thing was a good idea.  I could tunnel from the outside of my entrance to my fortress, to the entrance to the cave, but again, that defeats the goblinite collecting, which is a whole rock, paper, scissors dilemna I have.

I understand there's some risk with dwarves outside, but what I want to do is keep them restricted to a main "safe path" that they run back and forth from that is protected by the militia.

[King DZA]

I thought building destroyers couldn't break things above them? If you mean destroying it from up top, then no worries. The entrance to the caverns is at the lowest point in my fort, below the workshops, living quarters, burial chamber, control rooms, and the like. If any troll manages to get that far into my fort, cavern beasties will be the least of my worries.

Back on the topic of safety:
If your looking for a safe path for your dwarves, I suppose you could always construct an above ground tunnel. Just build a hall using walls, then roof it over, and place a couple doors or floodgates to distract any building destroyers, fill the tunnel with as many traps you'd like.

Of course, I have no idea what your fort looks like, so I'm not sure if this would work for you. But if it's the only way back into your fortress, the dwarves will use it

[Aspgren]

As I mentioned in another thread I made a "trash chute" from the surface into the fortress.  Goblinite, bolts, wood, corpses ... anything from the surface would be dumped there and dwarves didn't have to run up and down the stairway. They would exit the fort, clean up the surface and then go down again.

 After a while they have no reason to go outside at all. The cleaning is relative quick and the forest industry can be moved underground with everything else. Also the rotting corpses are exposed to the surface through the chute so they don't cause miasma or anything. Doesn't contaminate the rest of the fortress one bit! You have all your crap in one place and can sort it at your hearts content. Not risking a single life.

[thistleknot]

As a side-note, since you mentioned forestry, which is why my operations are pretty much above ground (plus the meat I get).  I do not, I repeat, do not, have a single tree down below.  It could be because I have civforge going.  But I don't have a single tree (I'ma have to double check that).  I know 'trees' per se don't grow, but rather mushrooms and such.

Thanks for the advice.  I think that's a good idea.  The only fear I'd have is from flying creatures.  I could mitigate that (unless it's a flying building destroyer).

[Aspgren]

  The only fear I'd have is from flying creatures.

Yeah that's ... what I figured as well.

 Truth is that it's tempting to block the trash chute and build something elaborate up there .. but in reality you just need to shut the room off from the rest of the fort if anything gets in. or put traps there or otherwise incorporate it in the interior defense.
 It's much more safe that way. Because dwarves are tards and will screw up in ways you cannot anticipate.

edit: oh and. mushrooms won't grow underground until you've breached the caverns.

[CapnUrist]

I just dug out a stairway directly under my fort and placed a floor hatch over it.

Although, to be honest, my caverns seem pretty tame. The only forgotten beast I've encountered was a blob of snow with a tail, and that was killed by my friendly neighborhood olm people.

Don't be so foolish to make assumptions based on this beast. FBs composed of non- or semi-solid materials such as water, fire, snow, ash, and steam are easily trounced by an unskilled kick to the body. When you have a FB tarantula made of lead stroll up to knock on your door and ask for a cup of dwarven sugar, then you'll see how aggravating they can be.

[Tirion]

You could make lots of armor (bone will suffice, metal is better) and maybe even some weapons. Make a "civilian protection" uniform, either over or replace clothing, off duty: uniformed. Conscript all your dwarves save your miners, hunters and woodcutters (bugs with unseen profession uniform, just stick with war dog spam if you must send them out) into squads with that uniform assigned. Do NOT assign a barracks, no not activate them in quads screen. They'll equip it and keep it on, without bad thought or work time lost to training.

[thistleknot]

That's a really neat idea.  Any way I can have my miners with armor (just don't specify a weapon/shield).  Hmm.....  The possibilities, that's a lot of squads for 130 dorfs.

[Aspgren]

FBs composed of non- or semi-solid materials such as water, fire, snow, ash, and steam are easily trounced by an unskilled kick to the body.

 This is definitely true but I'll have to point out that fire FBs explode into a ball of FIRE when you deliver that unskilled kick to the body. They can definitely be aggravating.

edit: or am I thinking about fire titans/men/something? I'm assuming the same thing occurs whenever a creature is made completely of fire.

[sambojin]

The civilian uniform idea does wonders. Even just a wooden shield, a metal helmet, a cloak and a weapon makes a dwarf a lot safer. Add as much metal armour to that as you can (chain shirts, then high boots, then leggings, then gauntlets), but 130 dwarfs takes a LONG time to armour properly. The cheap version works reasonably well (and never usually stuffs up, everything is able to be worn over clothes).

That, and give your hunters/miners/woodcutters decent weapons. Copper bolts/crossbows or bronze/steel picks and axes at the very least. These are your least protected dwarves, who are often in the more dangerous areas, so they should at least be able to retaliate well. Attack is a certain form of defense.