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[Hannibal Barcalounger]

What distance are you using between the Archery Target and Marskdwarf?

For example, if this is your setup:

Code: [Select]

T...☻
the distance would be 3. (Number of blank spaces, not including the AT or dorf spaces.)

Does anyone know if it's possible to set up bolt recycling in the square in front of the target?

I have heard, but not verified personally, that dwarves WILL NOT shoot at a target they can't path to. It would be worth testing if diagonal or side access is enough, meaning that you could possibly do recycling like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

======
.T_...☻
......
======

key:
= is wall
. is floor
T is target
_ is open space above channel
☻is Marksdwarf


Or even add in walls and channels above and below the target, as long as you can path to it from behind.

Does anyone currently do bolt recycling? Can you tell us if the bolts are picked up and put in stockpile as single stacks, or if they're made into multi-bolt stacks?

If your marksdwarves have to go back to the stockpile every 5 shots to pick up 5 more single bolts, it might be worth the time to just craft a full set of bolts, rather than wait for them to shoot, reload, shoot, reload, shoot, reload, &c.

[ZeroSumHappiness]

In my bolt recycling setup they are indeed individually placed in stockpile squares, but will multiple individual bolts can be placed in bins in the stockpile and in a dwarf's quiver.  I did not test if dwarves will put bolts in a quiver in a bin in a stockpile.

[Hannibal Barcalounger]

When they take individual, recycled bolts, how many do they carry overall? I've only ever seen five stacks of five bolts each, for a max of 25. If they don't have stacks of 5 to grab, they end up with fewer than 25, but still 5 entries in the quiver contents screen.

I don't know if that's because of some slots_per_quiver cap, total_items_per_quiver cap, or just some quirk of how I run my bone industry and choose my squad ammo settings.

Edit: just checked and one of my guys is carrying seven individual bolts plus four stacks of 5 bolts. So, 27 bolts total, and 11 entries on the quiver contents list. Clearly there is some SCIENCE needed here.

[Grumbledwarfskin]

So as I understand it, you've got something like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

=========
|T|T|T|T|
| | | | |
| | | | |
|       |
|  ###  |
|♫ ###  |
|  ###  |
|       |
| | | | |
| | | | |
|T|T|T|T|
=========

Key:
= is wall
| is wall
T is constructed archery target
# is ammo stockpile
♫ is armor stand


Each of the shooting lanes is declared as an individual, separate barracks, with the squad set to train in it (T when examining room). Furthermore, the entire thing is also one large barracks, declared from the armor stand.

Is that correct? Is anything missing or inaccurate?

If so, what are the squad settings in the armor-stand barracks? Train? Sleep? Anything?

There is one thing missing from this description...the shooting direction. You have to set the shooting direction appropriately for your dwarves to be able to use the shooting range.

[Hannibal Barcalounger]

I've checked just now to verify it, and my shooting ranges are set to shoot from top to bottom along the south wall and bottom to top along the north wall.

How big are everyone's defined barracks? My barracks defined from the archery targets include the target, 3 blank spaces, the 4th space where the marksdwarf should supposedly stand, and one more space on each side of the dwarf's intended position (due to lack of doors to seal off room growth).

My barracks defined from the Armor Stand used to cover the entire room and fully overlap all of the archery-target barracks, but as an experiment I've reduced it to only cover the beds and not overlap any target-defined barracks at all.

[Kon]

I don't have problems with marksdwarf training at archery targets.

Handling the assignment of bolts is very important. Have you checked their quivers to see if they have bolts? Are those bolts training bolts or combat bolts? Have you tried assigning them bolts without specifying a material and with both Train and Combat set? Doing this may help isolate the problem.

Sometimes bolts are in quivers that are in bins that are in the Finished Goods stockpile. I set up a separate Finished Goods stockpile with just quivers. If I see bolts in those quivers, I mass dump the bins, remove 'dump' from the bins and from the quivers. They will dump just the bolts. Then un-forbid the bolts, and they will move them to the ammo stockpile.

Actually, I found they train up very quickly shooting at enemies once the ambushers and sieges start, so training at ranges isn't that big a deal.

[ZeroSumHappiness]

Open question: Do dwarves get more XP from firing at live targets?

[Azated]

From what I've read so far, it looks like you have your marksdorfs set to train in the normal barracks as well as the archery range. Never done this myself, but I guess it would cause them to train melee skills as well as crossbow.

[Kon]

P.S. I know that firing-squad setups with wood bolts and armored live targets are the most reliable and fastest method for training up marksdorf skill. I know this. It's not necessary to point it out. I'm interested in figuring out how to make it happen in a barracks setup with archery targets, for science as much as anything else.

No need to trap them when they come close enough to your fortress to shoot them. I find they train fastest shooting at ambushers and siegers with wooden bolts from behind fortifications. One technique is to have two drawbridges, and, after they pass over one of them, close them both. Then shoot them. Usually I have a chained dog or two as bait.

Trapping them, connecting a lever to the cages, and pulling the lever takes too long.

[Quietust]

Archers assigned to both Archery Ranges and Barracks seem to prefer training in the barracks - they'll occasionally go to do archery practice, but sometimes they'll stop archery practice to go train in the barracks instead (and sometimes run back and forth as they try to make up their minds).

Archers will only perform Archery Practice using Training-allowed bolts stored in their quivers, which means that an archer whose quiver is completely filled with Combat-only ammo will not practice. Back in 0.28.181.40d and earlier, practice bolts were hauled to the range and fired directly from the dwarf's hands, so this was never a problem.

[Blue_Dwarf]

Open question: Do dwarves get more XP from firing at live targets?

They get 6 exp for each shot at an archery range.

They get 30 exp for each shot fired at a live target. This is also the case for Adventure mode, even when you fire shots into the ground for powerleveling.

Both Marksdwarf and Archery gain this exp when you fire crossbows. In Adv mode bows only give 30 exp to Archery, haven't tried in Dwarf Fortress mode.

[Gizogin]

I have a setup which works for me, with a few of my marksdwarves always shooting at the targets, even when not scheduled to train.
Simplified version:

Code: [Select]

=======
|X_X_X|
|     |
|     |
|     |
|     |
|     |
|R   W|
===+===

= is a wall
| is also a wall
X is an archery target
_ is a channeled floor
R is an armor stand
W is a weapon rack
+ is a door
Only the middle archery target is defined as a range, so they only shoot at that one.  I also have a barracks defined from the armor stand.

[Hannibal Barcalounger]

Gizogin, does the barracks defined from your armor stand cover the whole room? Does it overlap the barracks defined from the archery target, or just bump up against it?

What assignments does the squad have for the archery target barracks? Z,T,Q, the other thing I forget? What about the assignments for the Armor Stand barracks?

[knutor]

Hanni,

I am about to test this. 

Set 4 marksdwarves to ambush.  Chop up the topside map outside into 4 equally sized burrows of enormous scale.  Assign 1 hunter to each burrow.  Include a food/drink pile, dining hall, and chair in ea of the 4 burrows, I'll call mine hunting lodge, #1, 2, 3, 4.  Then allow them to hunt.

I'm just a little worried at what will happen if I don't assign a hunting dog to them.  Without a dog the prey might flee further, into another burrow, and the hunter might just stop his pursuit.  This won't really matter once I get 4 hunters up and rolling.  But at that point I could prolly build a china wall and seperate most of map into the four hunting fields, cept the edges of course...

That might save ya some arrows, since hunter misses can be reused.

Have a good one,
Knutor

[Lagslayer]

If I want hunting done, I usually do it manually. Civilians with the hunting labor active tend to get killed easily by invaders, as they cannot be redirected and cannot wear armor. If you don't mind the risk and have lots of wildlife, then it's a great way of training up marksdwarves with little micromanagement.

Also, do burrows work with hunters?