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[Crowe~]

Hmmm 2wks... do you think maybe you need at least one character alive somewhere else for that to happen?

<----- afraid to stay out in the dark

[Reelya]

Map Stuff

- The editor now support sorting the columns alphabetically / numerically, so you can sort by e.g. blacksmith type, or prosperity. Blacksmith values now sort by quality rather than alphabetically.

- working on Chrome away from home, and found some map glitches that FireFox doesn't have. I fixed those, just hoping it still looks good in FireFox.

- color-coded cities based on how recent blacksmith info is:

> Blue cities means no blacksmith, and information is recent (less than 1 week). When someone confirms this they should set the "days" on the editor for that city to zero, to indicate that "no blacksmith" is current info.

> Red cities have blacksmith info that's over 29 days old, or have "none" listed and haven't been rechecked in the last week

> black cities have a non-god-like blacksmith that has a start date < 30 days ago. These might be out of date, but 30 days seems normal for a blacksmith's run, so it should be a fairly reliable indicator of which cities are worth checking out if we get data for all cities.

> anvils are still for the god-like blacksmiths.

So basically Red cities on the map are the ones that need to be scouted for blacksmith info

[Girlinhat]

Might look into it at some point, Reelya, if you can't make a plugin.  You'd basically authorize it to handle crownofconquest.com and strip information off the page.  When it detects "The blacksmith has been working X days and is Y skill" then it'd transmit to your server.  It'd only work if the scouting player had this plugin, but it could make auto-mapping much easier, if you can handle plugin creation...

[Reelya]

I've used Greasemonkey a bit, so I'll think about doing that. Probably after I convert to a full database implementation though, because this is editing a text file when you do the request, which is pretty risk-free if only a few people are updating things sporadically, but has implications for concurrent update issues. i'm also planning it so you can click on any map square and it would pop up a form to either edit or add a location note (dungeon or garrison type stuff).

It would definitely be nice if mayor + prosperity information was transmitted automatically when the player visited a town, too.

As a stretch goal, I'd set up user accounts on the map server, then we could do things like have personalized map notes and quest locations per player, this is something that would definitely need a full database to support. After I do this, it might even be possible to have the plug-in automatically read quest data from your quests page when you open it, and create map notes for you with the quest locations.

[Reelya]

*** God-Like *** blacksmith currently at: Firenymph (42, 98)

I think I've confirmed that blacksmiths do get better the longer they're there. some have gotten better since I started playing, and they've been there longer than I have played.

Sorting by "days existing" in the database for the cities I know about, there's a definite upwards trend in quality, so we might be able to pinpoint likely future god-like blacksmiths without guesswork - ones with high quality vs low number of days alive.

This will be good if it pans out - less guesswork, more !!science!!

[choppy]

hm...found a 2 handed sword with fire damage 3. Its really good, shame it has 97 durability on it.

I want this weapon :O

Heh I have one with fire damage 6, 137 durability, 10% feather weight, and +1 to movement.

[Craterface]

Wall of text...


Suggestions/questions from a newbie, only played this game for a couple of days but I am interested in helping out as much as possible with the creation of a Bay12 Kingdom. These suggestions are based on what I have experienced (so far) in-game and what I have been able to gather in this forum and the official one.

Kingdom management: It’s a drain on a person’s resources to manage a kingdom which will result in the King/Queen player will be spending most of their time grinding dungeons just to keep up with expenses.
Using the Trade option in-game to set up a way for Bay12 players to donate gold to the kingdom.
I’ve not seen the option to outright give away neither gold nor items to other players, that’s why with the trade option, let’s say, Girlinahat sets up 10 arrows for sale at a 1000 gold a pop, several of these and we other Bay12 players can donate by buying these. That way more of us can help out, financially, and Girlinahat won’t have to grind dungeons but can actually run the kingdom.
Also, buildings need materials, which we might have to gather in other towns. We can use the trade option to collect and sell these to Girlinahat for a fair price and have it restricted so it can only be sold to her.

New units/recruits: Alternate accounts for the creation of LVL 1 recruits, for the sake of garrisons and other players who need to expand on their entourage.
By having a second account and creating a 5 unit team, within set perimeters for the different classes (keep them all dwarf for RP reason or min/maxing?), 4 of these a player sell to the recruitment office (since, I haven’t tried it but I guess you need at least one party member for the sake of disbanding and making new ones) at Bay12 capital, or other when we have expanded. What I’ve understood, might be wrong, and is that units in town garrisons gain XP, but do they cost anything and what is the limit?

If they do get XP by just sitting around, we could set up a system of passive training of units, by donating gold in case they cost upkeep.
Girlinahat sets up arrows or something that is usually in abundance, the cost would be the initial hiring fee for her + x amount of days for the upkeep of these – the end selling price/cost they will have in the recruitment office for the original player, then get in contact with the player which is having these sitting around for training so that when they are done the end up once again in the recruitment office and the other player can snatch these before anyone else.

Also just having an alternate account just for the sake of making units so that others Bay12 players can get hold of the units they need for their own garrisons + party, so they don’t have to run around looking in several town for a specific class + race. Similar by using ones eight unit other players can train units meant for being mayors (set parameters, min/maxing, to get the most out of them).

The worst thing is, I believe, is when you set up a new party they pop up in a town by random selection. So if you’re really unlucky you could spawn in the other end of the map. Might then just be better to disband and re-generate a new party in hope of spawning closer it the kingdom/town.

Feudal system: Is there a King/vassal system in place for a multiplayer kingdom? What I mean can other Bay12 players be in charge of towns but swear fealty to a kingdom and somehow be of benefit for the kingdom? Or is it better for the King/Queen to be the owner (or the player that owns the mayor in charge of the towns) for tax collection? Or do vassals pay X % of gold to the kingdom? Or is other player better to be sort of “knights” and keep garrisons in the field rather than have mayors?


I can’t be of much help at the moment, since I’ve got myself lost in a LVL1 dungeon somehow.   

Thoughts/opinions would be appriciated.

[Girlinhat]

You can 'donate' to a player by buying ridiculous items.

Let's avoid the use of alts, just as a matter of principle.  There's no limit to the number of characters a player can control, you just have to visit a recruitment office.  At level 12, you can spend 15,000 gold to produce a new custom character the same as when you start the game.  I don't know if you can sell a character and someone else can buy them, though.  Either way, you can set up your own garrison fairly cheaply, that can generate gold and exp per day.

Towns have the option to set who they pledge loyalty to.  I assume the kingdom gets some of their tax income, as that's mentioned in a few places.  There's also a soft limit on the number of mayors you can have, so having multiple players control regions not only would help mechanically, but would ease some of the stress instead of one person controlling the kingdom.  With the use of the map, I intend for us to set up 'zones of control' for different players to own cities and whatnot.

[Reelya]

Many small notes:

- Apparently any class can use scrolls, at least for the priest scrolls I have. This is interesting. I might switch down a 1-priest build in the future and rely on a garrison priest making stacks of portal scrolls etc. With that it's not so critical to keep 1 priest alive since anyone can effectively cast portal, and I can keep some emergency healing on hand.

- Mutant gave me 1000 free turns for finding that stat-boosting bug! Yay!

- Look for stacked armor. I found a 170 durability full plate mail, stack of 3. But each one has it's own durability. The two under the stack were 202 and 222 durability, so if you have spare gold, buy the whole stack and sell back the shitty ones.

- Girlinhat can actually create something useful to sell, I think. How about giving the monarch a monopoly on scroll sales, and set reasonably profitable prices? About $50 per spell point required or something.

---

Also, I improved the map color-coding of cities more:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Anvils are still God-like as before.

Excellent and Amazing blacksmiths are purple now, Good ones are green. Those are the best candidates for future God-like ones. The map now indicates both how old the blacksmith is and how many days since the last Dorf updated the details. Ones that are good but young are the best God-like candidates. Just before the 21 days mark, some Good and Excellent ones start to appear.

"None" ones stay blue for 1 week, then turn black because they're pretty certain to be a regular blacksmith you can use for general repairs by then. Blacksmiths that are terrible, poor or average on last check are just Black, too.

Red is used to indicate ones that should be updated, this triggers after 21 days. Ones that check out as at least Good after this will be the candidates for God-like blacksmiths.

[Sartain]

- Mutant gave me 1000 free turns for finding that stat-boosting bug! Yay!

I certainly didn't think the game was still being supported 

[a1s]

- Girlinhat can actually create something useful to sell, I think. How about giving the monarch a monopoly on scroll sales, and set reasonably profitable prices? About $50 per spell point required or something.

That is unenforceable, since scrolls are:
a) generated with shops, so it's not a full monopoly.
b) unless personally traded, can not be tracked.
and massively inconvenient, since:
c) Girlinhat can't be in every town every day.

unfortunately, selling overexpensive arrows is also not that easy, since the game has a cap on how much things can cost (which with some of the more favorable magic items can be too restrictive IMHO)

[Arx]

Aargh, confusion. There is already a garrison belonging to someone () at 96,69. I ended up accidentally misreading something and placing my garrison at 96,70 by mistake.

Does 96,69 belong to a B12er?

If so, I'll drop another at 96,78 instead. If not, we'll have to re-shuffle the plan.

[Reelya]

EDIT: btw as well as the bug fix, Mutant also coded one suggestion I had! This was for cases when you click on dungeon mobs but they move out of the way. Mutant says they won't do this anymore. So, slightly less wasted turns in dungeons now.

- Girlinhat can actually create something useful to sell, I think. How about giving the monarch a monopoly on scroll sales, and set reasonably profitable prices? About $50 per spell point required or something.

That is unenforceable, since scrolls are:
a) generated with shops, so it's not a full monopoly.
b) unless personally traded, can not be tracked.
and massively inconvenient, since:
c) Girlinhat can't be in every town every day.

unfortunately, selling overexpensive arrows is also not that easy, since the game has a cap on how much things can cost (which with some of the more favorable magic items can be too restrictive IMHO)

a) scrolls are not generated with any great frequency, they're pretty rare and not often the one you want, or in stacks of more than 1. Compare with "you can definitely buy portal scrolls in town X and the money goes towards building up the capital city". That's not a bad deal for low-level players who can't make scrolls.

b) don't need to be tracked! If a non-bay12er pays ridiculously high prices for a portal scroll, that's GOOD for us, not bad. This is about putting money in the kings pocket, regardless of how it gets there. I don't think we need to automatically track which b12er bought them, someone can just PM girlinhat after buying the scrolls, and she can check her trades screen. Most people probably won't even worry about taking credit.

c) she doesn't have to be in every town, we select one fairly central town in the middle/east part of the map, and make that the designated trading area

[Arx]

Is the game actually being actively developed? It looked to me like the last update was in '12.

[Reelya]

Is the game actually being actively developed? It looked to me like the last update was in '12.

It's not active, but Mutant still plays a little, and if you point out glaring bugs or little quick fixes that Mutant can do he seems to be open to suggestion. I mainly suggested small easy fixes that reduce the randomness a bit in places it isn't fun (like enemies randomly moving out of the way when you try and engage them, which wastes turns for no benefit, or randomly rolling a "1" on a heal spell and basically wasting the spell). Neither of these "random" things adds any gameplay/strategy aspect, which should be the main criteria.