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[Zangi]

"Quick, crush the dissidents before they give anyone any ideas!"

Hit them hard and scare em now, before they get any bigger!

[SalmonGod]

Many OWS participants and supporters are against capitalism (myself included), but I definitely don't think they are representative of the movement itself.

[Heron TSG]

I'm not against capitalism, I'm against plutocracy. (As one of my favorite homemade signs says.)

[scriver]

Mine says "Terra for the Terrans!".

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Yup. Although I still have no idea why articles like that are claiming that OWS is against capitalism.

1: So they can demonize and discredit the movement by any means necessary.

2: Because the very few organizations against capitalism do support OWS.

3: Because capitalism is a religion. And anything that does not deify the invisible hand of the unregulated marketplace is complete blasphemy.

Or maybe it's because a majority of the signs pertain to 'Death to Capitalism' in some way, shape, or form?

[Nadaka]

Yup. Although I still have no idea why articles like that are claiming that OWS is against capitalism.

1: So they can demonize and discredit the movement by any means necessary.

2: Because the very few organizations against capitalism do support OWS.

3: Because capitalism is a religion. And anything that does not deify the invisible hand of the unregulated marketplace is complete blasphemy.

Or maybe it's because a majority of the signs pertain to 'Death to Capitalism' in some way, shape, or form?

Majority? Really? I have seen maybe 1 or 2 out of hundreds.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Yup. Although I still have no idea why articles like that are claiming that OWS is against capitalism.

1: So they can demonize and discredit the movement by any means necessary.

2: Because the very few organizations against capitalism do support OWS.

3: Because capitalism is a religion. And anything that does not deify the invisible hand of the unregulated marketplace is complete blasphemy.

Or maybe it's because a majority of the signs pertain to 'Death to Capitalism' in some way, shape, or form?

Majority? Really? I have seen maybe 1 or 2 out of hundreds.

Do not take my wording literally. The point still stands. And as Wall Street is essentially a large figurehead for the institution that is modern capitalism, it's not a very far step to take that OWS is primarily anti-capitalism due to it's unfairness.

Unless, of course, the overarching economical changes that will lead us to a golden age will come from a way other than massively overhauling our entire economic structure from capitalism to some such other system.

[Nadaka]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart? Or is regulation an issue once it affects everyone and not just the regulated? 'Give an inch and they'll take a mile' may be a good phrase to remember if these dreams do come true, you know.

How does OWS wish to implement stronger smarter regulation? Do not simply state the abolishment of Citizen's United, that's Step 1.a) in the process.

[Nadaka]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart? Or is regulation an issue once it affects everyone and not just the regulated?

How does OWS wish to implement stronger smarter regulation? Do not simply state the abolishment of Citizen's United, that's Step 1.a) in the process.

Fascism? What? That is ridiculous. No. Are you actually serious? Explain that.

[Derekristow]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart? Or is regulation an issue once it affects everyone and not just the regulated? 'Give an inch and they'll take a mile' may be a good phrase to remember if these dreams do come true, you know.

How does OWS wish to implement stronger smarter regulation? Do not simply state the abolishment of Citizen's United, that's Step 1.a) in the process.

'Give an inch and they'll take a mile' indeed.  Wall Street being idiotic with our economy is usually blamed for the recent economic failures, and most of them got off scot-free or even with a bonus.  There have also been a number of laws recently (SOPA, PIPA, the infamous "Pizza is a vegetable serving") that were clearly bought and paid for by companies that directly harm the American public.  Someone has clearly overstepped their bounds, but it isn't the government.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart? Or is regulation an issue once it affects everyone and not just the regulated?

How does OWS wish to implement stronger smarter regulation? Do not simply state the abolishment of Citizen's United, that's Step 1.a) in the process.

Fascism? What? That is ridiculous. No. Are you actually serious? Explain that.

You don't get the liberty of asking a question in response to rather serious queries that have yet to be answered solidly by any supporter of this 'movement.'

But I'll humour you; Yes, regulation does lead to an increase of government control and can lead to a cascade effect of liberty and privacy being erased for the sake of government convenience, hence 'take a mile' as in deciding that simply having opposition is becoming tedious and that centralized government power is exactly what they've always wanted anyways. Fascist in most meanings of the word, I'm not sure how else you would define an overly secretive nanny state of that type of calibre. A much different story from civil liberties being chipped away by corruption caused by the overly wealthy and powerful higher classes, but still a scary one nonetheless.

Smarter regulation =/= More regulation.

[scriver]

This is where I point out that most countries the west have both bigger governments and more regulation ensuring privacy and civil liberties than the USA currently has.

Also, "nanny state" is a pretty good word for it, even if it's loaded with negativity. "Fascist" is mostly just used about two kind of states; either one actively believing or following the classical Fascist ideology (conservative nationalism); or a dictatorship which rules and stays in power by use of violence and fear.

[Nadaka]

The vast majority of the OWS movement is in favor of regulating capitalism, not replacing it.

As much as the randroid sycophants want to believe it, the free market is NOT a god imbued with divine power in its purity and deserving of worship.

It is a tool, one that has worked better in the past and can be restored, or even improved.

Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart? Or is regulation an issue once it affects everyone and not just the regulated?

How does OWS wish to implement stronger smarter regulation? Do not simply state the abolishment of Citizen's United, that's Step 1.a) in the process.

Fascism? What? That is ridiculous. No. Are you actually serious? Explain that.

You don't get the liberty of asking a question in response to rather serious queries that have yet to be answered solidly by any supporter of this 'movement.'

But I'll humour you; Yes, regulation does lead to an increase of government control and can lead to a cascade effect of liberty and privacy being erased for the sake of government convenience, hence 'take a mile' as in deciding that simply having opposition is becoming tedious and that centralized government power is exactly what they've always wanted anyways. Fascist in most meanings of the word, I'm not sure how else you would define an overly secretive nanny state of that type of calibre. A much different story from civil liberties being chipped away by corruption caused by the overly wealthy and powerful higher classes, but still a scary one nonetheless.

Smarter regulation =/= More regulation.

I do get the liberty of asking you to explain yourself when you make a ridiculous statement like: "Isn't an overly regulated capitalism a fascist entity at heart?" We are not fascists here, you don't get to deny me that liberty.

As for your question: how to make smarter regulation? Repealing citizens united is part of it. So is restoring Glass-Steagall, the separation of interests in financial institutions. OWS has no one leader that sets the policy and agenda. There are thousands of suggestions on how to move in the right directions, some of the good, some of them bad.

[Bauglir]

Depends on what you mean by "regulation". The sort of regulations you get when large businesses are paying for them? Absolutely fascist, to the extent that fascism involves economics. Fascism is partially characterized by collusion between the wealthy and the government, in that while you see nationalization of major corporations, but the individuals who run them remain in powerful positions and essentially take up the state-defined leadership roles. At the same time, you get a government happy to devote national resources to prop up these now-nationalized business institutions in times of economic hardship. In short, you get circles of friends in all the leadership positions, and these people are willing to do whatever they can to help a buddy out.

That's not the kind of regulation most left-wing people actually push for, even if (more and more) it is the kind of regulation we end up with. When people say regulation is important, it's typically anti-monopoly, environmental, transparency, or taxes, all of which are somewhere between antithetical and irrelevant to fascist ideology.