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[mainiac]

But I would rather vote for someone, then have a group of people tell me who to vote for...

You can have your cake and eat it to.  Simplest to understand is vote ranking but proportional systems can give you what you want without even needing a complex ballot.  There are proportional systems that allow you to chose a candidate as your first preference but express a party to support as well.  Then the 'losing' and 'excess' ballots are used to elect the candidates at large from the party slate, ensuring that all voters are equal regardless of geography, gerrymandering, etc.  Germany is a good example of this and as a result it is a country with a very diverse set of parties that reflects the electorate very well.

And besides, unless you are doing a write in candidate, the odds are you are voting on the basis of party nomination anyway in a first past the post system.  So even though you have a 'choice', it's just a choice between two guys.

When the constitution was written, democracy like we knew it didn't exist.  Nobody knew to expect things like vote splitting, gerry-mandering, etc.  We have more then two centuries of experience to build off of but we are still using the system they invented back when they knew nothing.  Kinda silly.  It's not amoral or anything it's just obsolete.

[Vector]

Roosevelt didn't drag one of his men from a sinking ship by using his mother fucking teeth.  Bam!

He did however deliver a 90-minute speech immediately after being shot. Bam!

And is the only vaguely modern-era commander in chief to have lead troops into anything resembling battle.  Fizzle!

[Neonivek]

Roosevelt didn't drag one of his men from a sinking ship by using his mother fucking teeth.  Bam!

He did however deliver a 90-minute speech immediately after being shot. Bam!

And is the only vaguely modern-era commander in chief to have lead troops into anything resembling battle.  Fizzle!

Frankly to me that is so uttarly pointless to being the president that I am halfway convinced he was a terrible president that everyone liked.

What did he do OTHER then be a person who awsome in its purest form could be collected from his pores?

[ECrownofFire]

No that is a lie. You would rather have someone say that because you imagine yourself a, lets say, "Conservative" that you are obligated for AMERICA to vote for this guy.

I would rather vote for a person then a party that chooses someone.

Because if I don't like the person I can change my vote. With PR, you have no say over who is elected or not. None.

How about IRV then?\

Edit: I like the Schulze Method more though.

[Bdthemag]

Roosevelt didn't drag one of his men from a sinking ship by using his mother fucking teeth.  Bam!

He did however deliver a 90-minute speech immediately after being shot. Bam!

And is the only vaguely modern-era commander in chief to have lead troops into anything resembling battle.  Fizzle!

Frankly to me that is so uttarly pointless to being the president that I am halfway convinced he was a terrible president that everyone liked.

What did he do OTHER then be a person who awsome in its purest form could be collected from his pores?

Didn't he create Social Security or something like that?

[Dsarker]

Roosevelt didn't drag one of his men from a sinking ship by using his mother fucking teeth.  Bam!

He did however deliver a 90-minute speech immediately after being shot. Bam!

And is the only vaguely modern-era commander in chief to have lead troops into anything resembling battle.  Fizzle!

Frankly to me that is so uttarly pointless to being the president that I am halfway convinced he was a terrible president that everyone liked.

What did he do OTHER then be a person who awsome in its purest form could be collected from his pores?

So he was president of the USA, right? Or was he one of those communist dictators in the southern countries?

[Leafsnail]

Didn't he create Social Security or something like that?

I think that would be the other Roosevelt.  Although there is a common historical theory that FDR was in fact Teddy Roosevelt's soul channelled into a different body.

[Vector]

That wasn't TR, it was FDR.  But he did a bunch of breaking up monopolies (trust-busting) and working on infrastructure (railroads), had the Panama canal built, and so on, and so forth.  Pioneered the "square deal," i.e. the idea that you could make your way up in life here and should get a fair shake at it.  Basically started the conservation movement as we know it.  Both of them were really great presidents, frankly.

Other than the colonialism on TR's part, and advocacy for eugenics.  That was uncool.

Didn't he create Social Security or something like that?

I think that would be the other Roosevelt.  Although there is a common historical theory that FDR was in fact Teddy Roosevelt's soul channelled into a different body.

They were fairly close relatives, actually.  Cousins or something, IIRC.

[ECrownofFire]

Didn't he create Social Security or something like that?

I think that would be the other Roosevelt.  Although there is a common historical theory that FDR was in fact Teddy Roosevelt's soul channelled into a different body.

They were fairly close relatives, actually.  Cousins or something, IIRC.

Wikipedia says they were fifth cousins.

[mainiac]

Roosevelt didn't drag one of his men from a sinking ship by using his mother fucking teeth.  Bam!

He did however deliver a 90-minute speech immediately after being shot. Bam!

And is the only vaguely modern-era commander in chief to have lead troops into anything resembling battle.  Fizzle!

Unless you count his immediate predecessor, McKinley or the roughly half the presidents before that lead troops into battle, depending on where exactly you want to draw the line on 'vaguely modern'.  Or there are JFK and Gerald Ford, both of whom saw a heck of a lot more battle then Roosevelt ever did.  History'd!

Edit: Forgot about Bush Senior.  And while we're at it, I'd say that Dubya's illustrious service had nearly as much danger as Roosevelt's vacation in Cuba.

[KaelGotDwarves]

While TR was progressive for his time, he put the "conserve" in conservatism, meaning that he basically saved a good portion of the land that would have gone to companies and made them national parks - partially at John Muir's request, who was also a badass.

[Vector]

Nah, I meant "while serving as president."  Previous military careers--yes, certainly.  But during the presidency, I remember very, very few having acted as a field commander of any sort.

[mainiac]

Nah, I meant "while serving as president."  Previous military careers--yes, certainly.  But during the presidency, I remember very, very few having acted as a field commander of any sort.

I was unaware that the US was at war between 1901 and 1909.  And for that matter the only president I know of who lead troops during the presidency was Washington.

[Vector]

Not officially at war, because he was just sending/leading troops in the South American region(s).

[mainiac]

During the presidency?  He was running the country from south america?