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[GlyphGryph]

On the other hand, I'd argue that seeking out people with immune systems compromised by the flu and coughing all over them because you have, like, chicken pox or something and you want to get them sick, should also be illegal.

Yes, people with mental illness's are ill - I don't see how this makes it wortwhile to argue that its acceptable to take advantage of these people with the intent to cause them harm (at the least) and to make them kill themselves (at worst).

And intentionally hurting people for no purpose other than hurting them is always wrong.

[Strife26]

He is being punished because he slandered someone, and acted in a manner intended to cause emotional harm to it's family.
There is a malicious act committed with malicious intend, for no reason.
It is really a textbook example for when freedom of speech is not relevant.

This is about everything that needs to be said.




As an aside, I can think of a couple of different reasons to kill oneself that don't require mental illnesses.

[Heliman]

I like giving more protection to freedom of speech in circumstances that don't cause panic.

And I like giving more protection to freedom of murder in cases where the murder weapon is a spoon.

um...

...Why do you like giving more protection to freedom of speech in circumstances that don't cause panic?

  Like, it would be nice if you gave reasons for this particular case.

It's quite simple, if it was protected, people could protest funerals. I don't know how or why someone would want to do that, but I'd like them be able to.

Of course not. They should have the option to refuse. But if they do, refuse nobody should be held responsible, even in part, shouyld they later commit suicide unless there was a clear intent to kill (not to harass or annoy mind you, to KILL)

There is no possible precedent upon which such a question could be asked because it's not safe to check seratonin levels.

Thanks a1s, please tell me how your version of depression is exactly the same as the one I still have. And how people with chemical imbalances are apparently inferior or whatever it is you're saying.

Look, it does not make people inferior any more than cancer or the common cold. But it is worse than being not crazy, all things being equal. Just like having a cold means you are sick in the lungs, and having a broken leg means you are sick in the leg, having depression means you are sick in the brain. And it doesn't serve you as well as it could. How is this news to anyone?

For the last time,

1. you can't safely cure or positively identify depression.
2. If you can't cure or identify depression, you can't make a law incarcerating people with depression.
3. .'.(therefore) you can't make a law incarcerating people with depression.

[GlyphGryph]

not to harass or annoy mind you, to KILL

Why doesn't this apply to other things, then? If you shoot someone in the shoulder with the intent to injure, but not kill them, and they die as a direct result of your actions, it is still murder. Perhaps not the same type of murder, but jailing someone for harassment that leads to suicide isn't the same as murder 1 either.

[a1s]

Yes, people with mental illness's are ill - I don't see how this makes it wortwhile to argue that its acceptable to take advantage of these people with the intent to cause them harm (at the least) and to make them kill themselves (at worst).

erm... I was actually trying to say that special care should be taken not to make these people harm themselves, and that just because internet has defense mechanisms against bullies, that doesn't mean depressed people will use them (I know I would not have had the energy to go through that whole procedure of setting up new accounts and would just feel more useless and depressed)

[scriver]

Which is why I looked suicide up on NIMH. Depression is what causes it... most of the time (this is why I hate (and also love) science- they can never give a straight answer, only probabilities).

My psychology textbook had something interesting to say about this - according to it, the people who are most likely to commit suicide is people who have been depressed but are "getting better". Because people don't have the energy to kill themselves while they are deeply depressed, but once the depression starts to recede they end up with more energy, while still suffering from their old thought-patterns and and vivid memories of the sadness, which gives them the strength to commit suicide. Ironically enough.

[Heliman]

Yes, people with mental illness's are ill - I don't see how this makes it wortwhile to argue that its acceptable to take advantage of these people with the intent to cause them harm (at the least) and to make them kill themselves (at worst).

erm... I was actually trying to say that special care should be taken not to make these people harm themselves, and that just because internet has defense mechanisms against bullies, that doesn't mean depressed people will use them (I know I would not have had the energy to go through that whole procedure of setting up new accounts and would just feel more useless and depressed)

Are you listening or are you just playing the "lala~ I can't hear you" game with me now? You can't take "Special Care" of people with depression without their consent. It's impossible to enforce without being totally flawed and violating some major human rights.

If you're asking about consensual rehabilitation for those with depression, they already have that, so if that's the case I don't know why you're even talking about it.

[Heliman]

Which is why I looked suicide up on NIMH. Depression is what causes it... most of the time (this is why I hate (and also love) science- they can never give a straight answer, only probabilities).

My psychology textbook had something interesting to say about this - according to it, the people who are most likely to commit suicide is people who have been depressed but are "getting better". Because people don't have the energy to kill themselves while they are deeply depressed, but once the depression starts to recede they end up with more energy, while still suffering from their old thought-patterns and and vivid memories of the sadness, which gives them the strength to commit suicide. Ironically enough.

I'd attribute that more to the tendency of people on antidepressants having suicidal thoughts than to people who are super depressed not having the strength to off themselves.

[a1s]

Are you listening or are you just playing the "lala~ I can't hear you" game with me now? You can't take "Special Care" of people with depression without their consent.

If my relatives didn't send me into therapy I would not have gone there myself. And would still be depressed now (or not, but there's a good chance I would be.) I'm not sure to what extent this should be something the government does, maybe they can let people opt out of treatment instead of in, but keep in voluntary? 

[Criptfeind]

This is a interesting thread. I have learned many things. Such as being Jewish or black or a gypsy is a offense of the order of harassment (and that 18 weeks in jail is the same thing as the murder of thousands.) and that it is the inherent responsibility of the victims to avoid transgressions and not the responsibility of the transgressors to not make transgressions.

Be right back, killing people then suing them for not dodging my gun shots.

[Bauglir]

Be right back, killing people then suing them for not dodging my gun shots.

Hey, if you can't punish people for stealing your bullets, what kind of justice can we really claim to have?

[freeformschooler]

it is the inherent responsibility of the victims to avoid transgressions and not the responsibility of the transgressors to not make transgressions.

I won't contradict the first part, but who was arguing this? Other than me, where it was a misunderstanding of what I was saying that was later cleared up? I am pretty sure that is not the case 100% of the time.

I might have missed something, I haven't read the last few pages of thread.

[Criptfeind]

The severity of the crime is less because of the methods to get away from it, IE: It is less of a crime to shoot at someone in a car then it is to shoot at someone walking.

[a1s]

This is a interesting thread. I have learned many things. Such as being Jewish or black or a gypsy is a offense of the order of harassment (and that 18 weeks in jail is the same thing as the murder of thousands.) and that it is the inherent responsibility of the victims to avoid transgressions and not the responsibility of the transgressors to not make transgressions.

Be right back, killing people then suing them for not dodging my gun shots.

The guy was jailed, if you remember. So even though we* don't care about your personal eugenics project, the cops just might.
________________________________________________
*This post should not be taken express the views of it's author. Killing people is not nice.

[freeformschooler]

The severity of the crime is less because of the methods to get away from it, IE: It is less of a crime to shoot at someone in a car then it is to shoot at someone walking.

No, it is not. The severity of the crime is the same, unless I am missing something. I am pretty sure no one genuinely argued that the moral or legal severity of the crime is different offline or online, even me. You also didn't answer my question.