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Author Topic: Cult Mafia - GAME OVER - Psomeone Pscrewed Up  (Read 84841 times)

Jim Groovester

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #240 on: October 01, 2011, 02:12:24 pm »

Hey, yeah.
D2.
Anyway. Blocked toaster, did not get converted. QED, toaster is the cult leader.

Told you so.

Why would blocking any particular person lead to a convincing case against them?

There are several alternate explanations for why you were not converted:

1. You were converted, but are lying.
2. The Cult Leader did not target you.

Both of which are plausible for one reason or another and in no way condemn Toaster.

In any case, Urist is scum for the same reasons as yesterday.

Which are what, again?
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I understood nothing, contributed nothing, but still got to win, so good game everybody else.

NUKE9.13

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #241 on: October 01, 2011, 02:44:52 pm »

There are several alternate explanations for why you were not converted:

1. You were converted, but are lying.
2. The Cult Leader did not target you.

Both of which are plausible for one reason or another and in no way condemn Toaster.
True, true. Both those things are possible, from your perspective. From my perspective, however, the first is impossible. And the second seems unlikely.

Add to this my D1 case against toaster, and whilst it is possible that he is not the leader, it seems highly unlikely. I'm talking 90% certainty, here.

The cult leader has some very good reasons to convert me: confirmed non-leader, so less risk of losing a cultist, removes the risk of their actions being sabotaged (which, suspicions aside, has a 13/42 chance of happening night one, and those odds only get worse N2 and on), and of course my stunning personality and leet mafia skills would be at their disposal.
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Long Live United Forenia!

Toaster

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #242 on: October 01, 2011, 08:49:51 pm »

Jim:  Yes, I still suspect Dariush.   My case was summarized here and expanded a bit here and here.  Nothing has changed on that front.


Nuke:  Your words and actions don't match up.  You were voting Urist at day end, yet blocked me and voted me day start.  What changed?
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HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Think0028

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 1 - This Is Gonna Psuck [9/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #243 on: October 01, 2011, 09:58:07 pm »

Votecount:
Urist_McArathos [2]: Jim Groovester, Dariush
Toaster [1]: NUKE9.13
Dariush [1]: Toaster
Not Voting: Urist_McArathos, Powder Miner, Jack A T, NativeForeigner
Day ends Tuesday, 8:00 PM PST!
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If it scares people into posting, then yes.

If they end up lynched because they didn't post, oh well. Too bad for them. Maybe they should've tried posting.
Web-based Lurker Tracker for Mafia

NUKE9.13

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #244 on: October 02, 2011, 08:17:15 am »

Nuke:  Your words and actions don't match up.  You were voting Urist at day end, yet blocked me and voted me day start.  What changed?
Yeah, I never stopped thinking you were scum. But seeing as no one was going to listen to me, I decided to take matters into my own hands and just block you.
I was voting Urist on the off chance that you weren't scum, and that unvoting thing did make him look pretty bad. Unfortunately for you, he cracked the wrong side of scummy, and I blocked you.
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NativeForeigner

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #245 on: October 02, 2011, 07:14:34 pm »

Hmmm.

Sunday. No productive post today. I'll give one tomorrow.

On the bright side, my internet is now fixed, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Oh, and NUKE: Your reasoning completely depends on the cult leader absolutely wanting to convert you right away. Don't you think the leader might have wanted to keep some wine around for a while?
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Yeah, you're a dick, NativeForeigner.
Quit being such a dick, you dick.
Maybe if you weren't such a dick you wouldn't be such a dick.

Toaster

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #246 on: October 02, 2011, 09:16:27 pm »

Nuke:  At what point did you stop suspecting him?
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HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Jack A T

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 1 - This Is Gonna Psuck [9/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #247 on: October 03, 2011, 01:15:33 am »

Dariush: Why have you not answered this?  What is your answer?
I missed it. I didn't accuse him of being too pro-town, I accused him of trying to paint himself as town while putting the process in front of scumhunting, additionally paired with bandwagoning Nuke.

Ah.

Thing is, Too Townie refers to a fallacy: "he's so town, he must be scum"/"he's doing many, many townie elements, and thus is obviously scum".  It is generally to be avoided, and using its name to describe part of your argument makes your argument somewhat less convincing.

I'll also ask everyone what their best guesses to who the Cult Leader is.

At the moment, my top suspect is Dariush, for iffy cases and having brought in the idea of people voting me for being scummy D1.  And lurking.  However, I want to see more content from Urist and Native.

Considering jailer is the only role with an action, I'd say that converting an idiot like you simply to get rid of a RB chance at night is a really, really dumb move.
...Please explain.
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Quote from: Pandarsenic, BYOR 6.3 deadchat
FUCK YOU JACK
Quote from: Urist Imiknorris, Witches' Coven 2 Elfchat
YOU TRAITOROUS SWINE.
Screw you, Jack.

Jim Groovester

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #248 on: October 03, 2011, 02:12:18 am »

Ah.

Now that you understand the accusation, what do you make of it?

I'd prefer it if you responded to what I listed as faults with Urist_McArathos, since even though Dariush and I seem to be in agreement about him, my list is clearer and more detailed.
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I understood nothing, contributed nothing, but still got to win, so good game everybody else.

NUKE9.13

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #249 on: October 03, 2011, 06:29:29 am »

Nuke:  At what point did you stop suspecting him?
I stopped suspecting him about the time I woke up this morning with my mind intact, and knew that you were the leader for sure.

By which I mean, I didn't stop suspecting him. I never said that. I said that I never stopped thinking you were scum. I didn't suspect him more than I suspected you. Frankly, in the unlikely event that you are not the leader, I would be going after Urist next.

Oh, and NUKE: Your reasoning completely depends on the cult leader absolutely wanting to convert you right away. Don't you think the leader might have wanted to keep some wine around for a while?
Did you miss the bit about 13/42 chance of me sabotaging him N1, with those odds only getting better as time goes on?
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Toaster

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #250 on: October 03, 2011, 08:12:45 am »

Nuke:  Fair enough re Urist.

Your argument relies on both believing you weren't converted and that you were indeed the target.  Conclusive for you maybe, but I think it went more like this:

<CultLeader> Sup cultbuddy
<Nuke> Sup
<CultLeader> How about you keep on Toaster?  Everyone knows you think he's leader
<Nuke> Okay, I'll tunnel him uselessly and loudly and distract everyone
<CultLeader> Great- you won't get lynched since you're the jailer and ergo not leader


Native:
Oh, and NUKE: Your reasoning completely depends on the cult leader absolutely wanting to convert you right away. Don't you think the leader might have wanted to keep some wine around for a while?

Isn't that question WIFOM in itself?
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HMR stands for Hazardous Materials Requisition, not Horrible Massive Ruination, though I can understand how one could get confused.
God help us if we have to agree on pizza toppings at some point. There will be no survivors.

Urist_McArathos

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #251 on: October 03, 2011, 10:21:03 am »

Sorry about the delay, but I was NOT going to try and post from my phone again after that bullshit.  Anyway, as promised, my response.

Dariush - He makes a lot of sense sometimes. Hasn't participated a lot though. I'm leaning town.
I'm not, but more on that in a bit.

Quote
Urist_McArathos - Lots of funny vibes. I get the feeling he's trying very hard not to attract attention, by overly explaining things, not trying to tread on anyone or their opinions, being extremely careful with how he votes, and so on. In other words, he's very much more concerned with looking like town than actually hunting scum, and he has a good idea of how to do it.
...
This list was constructed by rereading through Day 1 since that's the only thing I have to look at right now. Urist_McArathos by this list.

Okay, so let me see if I get this.  Yesterday, after a thorough battery of questioning, you tell me "you don't have anything on (me) anyway", yet decide FIRST THING this morning that, hey, actually, you do after all?  There's nothing different from your case you already dismissed yourself, yet now it's worth pressing?  I find that change of mind somewhat suspect, Jim.  However, I've got nothing to hide, so let's have my rebuttal.

1. Overly explaining things: I'm wordy, no denials there.  I fail to see how trying my hardest to be clear, thorough, and transparent in my reasoning is scummy.  I'm letting you guys get a nice, fat read on me with every juicy, detailed post.  It would be WIFOM to openly state that I cannot be scum because of this, but I would like to know why it's a scumtell instead of a town tell or just, hell, my meta?  You personally have told me in several games to tone down the length of my replies, so it's nothing new.

2. Not treading on anyone's opinion.  Sure, I guess.  Oh, except for the fact I've been arguing with you, Dariush, and NUKE all throughout Day 1, and even pressed NUKE for a bit after the wagon was shifting away from him.  Toaster didn't interest me, and I didn't see a point in getting involved in Max and Native's pissing contest.  I'm hardly along there, so I think it's a tad untrue to say I'm gingerly avoiding conflict.

3.  Being extremely careful with my vote.  This one is straight up bullshit, Jim.  You know that careless voting, and not really giving a damn who gets lynched is a MAJOR scumtell.  Town should ALWAYS be careful with their votes, because Town have something to lose with a mislynch.  You can't deny if I was being reckless and flippant with my vote you'd call it scummy, so why is the exact opposite a scumtell?  You're putting me in a lose-lose situation with this so-called scumtell Jim.  Why would you do that, when you know better?

In any case, Urist is scum for the same reasons as yesterday.
Which are what, again?

Allow me to answer that.  He's accused me of being "Too Town" (and now he's trying to weasel out of that by saying "Oh, I didn't mean that in the way that makes me look scummy, sorry it took me nearly a fucking week to clarify that, I certainly wasn't scrambling for a way to avoid looking scummy in my response").  In that same post he accused me of voting NUKE for no reason (my response here proves that's just flat-out not true).  He also accused me of jumping on the NUKE bandwagon despite having LESS of a case against NUKE than me, and has accused me of avoiding the arguments in the game and lurking by sitting back and watching.  First off, not true (I've been arguing with three different people AND answering Jack and Toaster's questions all damn Day 1), and second it's mighty hypocritical coming from someone who's been prodded by the GM and had several players ask him where the fuck he's been all game long.  Someone's lurking here, but it's not me.  It's almost like he's determined to lynch me, no matter how terrible his case is or how I respond to his baseless and patently false accusations.

Is it any wonder I'm still voting Dariush as I was at the end of Day 1?

Hey, yeah.
D2.
Anyway. Blocked toaster, did not get converted. QED, toaster is the cult leader.

Told you so.

If you are being 100% honest in everything you say here, this tells us two and ONLY two things.

1. Toaster was blocked.
2. You are still town.

Could you explain to me how this proves that someone else wasn't the cult leader, and didn't just convert someone else?  While eliminating the jailer before he can fuck up any night actions seems like a sound strategy, it's been established you cannot assume that scum will play competently just because they are scum.  I'd really like to hear a stronger case against Toaster from you than this.
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Dariush

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #252 on: October 03, 2011, 11:11:36 am »

In any case, Urist is scum for the same reasons as yesterday.
Which are what, again?

Allow me to answer that...
Answering question about my reasons for voting you for me? (uhh... that didn't make much sense. Whatever) Now that's just plain overdefensiveness. Combine that with OMGUS and bandwagoning aaaand... yeah, you're scum.

Urist_McArathos

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #253 on: October 03, 2011, 11:23:06 am »

In any case, Urist is scum for the same reasons as yesterday.
Which are what, again?

Allow me to answer that...
Answering question about my reasons for voting you for me? (uhh... that didn't make much sense. Whatever) Now that's just plain overdefensiveness. Combine that with OMGUS and bandwagoning aaaand... yeah, you're scum.

Actually, it's me reiterating MY case from yesterday: that your case is a crock of shit, you're a scummy lurker, and I'm voting you for it.

Hell, aren't you even going to argue my points?  Or are you going to slink off to the shadows AGAIN?
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Dariush

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Re: Cult Mafia - Day 2 - I'm Psyked for Today [8/9] -- ONE REPLACE NEEDED
« Reply #254 on: October 03, 2011, 11:43:28 am »

Oh wow, now I'm a lurker. Are you that desperate for arguments for your shitcase?

Hell, aren't you even going to argue my points?
Sure, I'm going to. Immediatly after you answer why the fuck did you answer Jim's question about my reasons. I just can't think of a single coherent reason why you would do that except to rub in how spotlessly you pulled off your case against me.
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