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Author Topic: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)  (Read 9284 times)

Bohandas

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #90 on: September 10, 2011, 12:45:27 am »

F*ck the authorities!

The most enduring lesson that I learned from my time in high school was one that they taught me accidentally, namely that the system is evil and that order is pain.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2011, 01:01:44 am by Bohandas »
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Bohandas

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #91 on: September 10, 2011, 01:08:55 am »

A few years later, I was accused of stealing 40$ from a school bake sale. A civil case was raised over it, and as such, the one and only judge in the county that handled civil cases vs. minors offered me the following option: Accept a plea of "No Contest" and pay the school 40$, or plea "Not Guilty", hire a lawyer (as a minor, I was not allowed to represent myself; as my parents had no legal training, they could not represent me; as it was a civil case, I was not entitled to a public defender) and then go to a hearing with the same judge that was offering me the plea bargin (no jury, of course) and have my lawyer present a case for why I shouldn't be fined for lying to the court in addition to the 40$ in damages.

Ain't Texas great?

I'm pretty sure that the Seventh Amendment legally entitles you to a jury on all disputes over matters exceeding twenty dollars. You should've sued that judge, Best case scenario in that case would be that you would gain money AND (better still) the judge would probably lose his job.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2011, 01:18:57 am by Bohandas »
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Duuvian

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #92 on: September 10, 2011, 01:21:41 am »

I haven't gone through the whole thread, just responding to the OP but:

I bet they don't test for tobacco, do they?

Consumption or possession of tobacco by minors is technically legal in the USA. Laws only forbid the sale of tobacco to minors.

So I imagine they don't bother testing for it.

It must be at the state level that you must be 18 years old to possess tobacco then. In my state I believe the name of the crime is called a Minor in Possession, or M.I.P. I think that covers anything that a minor should not have though. I guess it differs state to state. Basically though if <18 year old people have cigarettes on them and police find them, they are in trouble.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2011, 01:23:55 am by Duuvian »
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Sort of finished and awaiting remix due to loss of most recent song file before addition of drums:
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Bohandas

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #93 on: September 10, 2011, 01:24:04 am »

They're wasting people's tax dollars on this shit.
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Grek

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #94 on: September 10, 2011, 01:33:05 am »

You should've sued that judge.

As a minor, I did not have the standing to sue anyone. My parents would have had to file it on my behalf and then somehow convince a jury that the judge did what he said he did when the only evidence is the testimony of an accused juvenile delinquent and their parents. Which would be stupid of them to do, since no jury in the world would convince on that evidence. Ultimately, even if we won, chances are it would have still cost more than the 40$ for a plea after taking into account lost work hours, legal fees and driving too and from the courthouse.
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Bohandas

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #95 on: September 10, 2011, 01:54:06 am »

Good point. I suppose a more realistic best case scenario would be that you might waste more than $40 of the district's money by pushing the issue thus making them lose money despite their inevitable win.
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Vector

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #96 on: September 10, 2011, 01:59:42 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
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kaijyuu

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #97 on: September 10, 2011, 02:02:17 am »

Well, it is for the lawyers.
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Quote from: Chesterton
For, in order that men should resist injustice, something more is necessary than that they should think injustice unpleasant. They must think injustice absurd; above all, they must think it startling. They must retain the violence of a virgin astonishment. When the pessimist looks at any infamy, it is to him, after all, only a repetition of the infamy of existence. But the optimist sees injustice as something discordant and unexpected, and it stings him into action.

sluissa

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #98 on: September 10, 2011, 07:30:05 am »

*Sigh* I remember when things like this mattered to me. It wasn't that long ago I was a public school student. Every little "injustice" made me mad. I wanted my "rights" early, because, why was it fair to force, me a perfectly intelligent being, to follow the same rules as toddlers, and my "less intelligent" peers. Yes, I thought that way. Yes, I was immature.

Is the world fair? No. Are some minors capable of enough understanding to make the kinds of decisions that are being stated here intelligently, and logically? Maybe. Does anything change when you hit the magic age of 16/18/21/whatever the age is locally? Not really.

Re, Minor/Students rights:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Re, School Drug Tests:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Re, Hats and other dress code issues:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Anyway, that went on for way too long, and I'm sure I missed some things I wanted to talk about. If anyone wants me to, I'll spoiler the separate sections to make the whole thing less of a wall of text to scroll past.
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Virex

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #99 on: September 10, 2011, 08:08:00 am »

He shouldn't get worked up without knowing why they're doing it. What use is it to question what you do not understand?
Ok, I don't want to strawman you, so correct me if I'm wrong. Here's what I'm reading:

A) You're claiming he doesn't understand why the administration is doing it (maybe a fair assertion; I don't know)
B) Thus, he should shut up and comply. (...what?)
I was thinking more of
A.) He doesn't understand why the administration is doing it.
B.) He should find out why they're doing before causing a row over it.
The confusion over this point may be because I used question in an impropper way...
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #100 on: September 10, 2011, 08:24:50 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
Money is the only thing these people generally care about, so forcing it all down the drain is the only way to get through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system.
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sluissa

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #101 on: September 10, 2011, 08:30:20 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
Money is the only thing these people generally care about, so forcing it all down the drain is the only way to get through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system.

To look at it another way, they're already throwing money down the drain in much larger amounts than what one court case would cost. You think you can clog it?
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #102 on: September 10, 2011, 08:35:17 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
Money is the only thing these people generally care about, so forcing it all down the drain is the only way to get through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system.

To look at it another way, they're already throwing money down the drain in much larger amounts than what one court case would cost. You think you can clog it?
On the whole? No, that would require a nation-wide moment. What I alone would attempt to do would be to inflict a single unworthy judge with so much wasted time, money, and media coverage that he resigns just to get the hell away from me. Failing that, I'd just try to get my individual case declared a mistrial.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.

ed boy

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #103 on: September 10, 2011, 08:38:43 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
Money is the only thing these people generally care about, so forcing it all down the drain is the only way to get through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system.
Good lord man, get your ego in check. It's not about wasting their resources to force what you believe 'through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system'. If you have disagreements with justice system, then the way to resolve them is not to do that. Doing that just makes things worse for everyone involved.
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Student's/Minor's Rights? (USA)
« Reply #104 on: September 10, 2011, 08:52:32 am »

I don't think the ideal response is to force the district to waste taxpayers' money on petty corruption.

If there were some better way to handle it, then hell, go for it.  But I really don't think "waste as much money as possible" is a good outcome for anyone.
Money is the only thing these people generally care about, so forcing it all down the drain is the only way to get through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system.
Good lord man, get your ego in check. It's not about wasting their resources to force what you believe 'through the thick, neigh-impenetrable skulls of those involved in the "justice" system'. If you have disagreements with justice system, then the way to resolve them is not to do that. Doing that just makes things worse for everyone involved.
I agree that it isn't a way to resolve problems with the justice system, my hypothetical is for a situation such as the one Grek was in, to make an unfair trial very, very difficult for everyone involved.
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Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.
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