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[Twiggie]

just ally them, let them expand to the sea then force-PU them

hopefully before they hit the inevitable collapse.

[Azthor]

Don't forget that the provinces they are occupying can be terrible for their tech levels. Simply outlasting them for sufficiently long will eventually result in a curbstomp battle.

[Dutchling]

Are they still pagan?

[Rex_Nex]

Unfortunately not. They are Christian now.

Don't forget that the provinces they are occupying can be terrible for their tech levels. Simply outlasting them for sufficiently long will eventually result in a curbstomp battle.

Thats true, but I'm looking for a "good" fight. If I take down Lithuania, its going to become World of Frankenmuth (Michigan joke).

For those knowledgeable about D&T, it's interesting to note that Ming did not become the dominant Chinese nation. Actually, Ming is gone. Where giant Ming would be is Tianwan. Odd. You'd thing the nation that starts with the richest CoT in the world would always win, but I guess not! Also, Song is down to two provinces in the middle of Jurchen, near Joseon.

[Errol]

It's either Ming or Wu most of the time. They've got the advantage of not existing, so they can break away with quite some size. And if those Wu rebels manage to occupy enough territory quickly while Ming is derping, they come out on top easily enough. Sometimes Qing also becomes a factor but most of the time they're sitting in Manchuria with all of China cored and their prestige obliterated because of that. It depends on how fast they expand into Yuan.

And then there's always China in my Vietnam and that's just stupid.

[RedKing]

So....after like a year and a half of cranking out spreadsheets and gathering data to allow a CK:DVIP -> EU3:DW conversion....I find that someone already made a working converter.

Simultaneous rage and joy. Even better? This shit actually works. Even with the More Kingdoms mod, it just turned Aquitania into France (the next most logical title) and the Order of Santiago into The Knights, and so forth. The resulting game will actually be far more difficult than I expected, because it converted such that I only retained my royal demesne. ALL my vassals are their own duchies now, althought they are vassals of France.

The one other quirk is that there's no HRE at all, but this is apparently a result of no ruler having the "emperor" tag. Since I'm essentially the Emperor, I'll go in and add that tag to my ruler and re-convert.

Also, apparently there's an option to turn on "blobify" which prevents the million zillion vassals thing, but I think I'll leave it as is. Makes for a more challenging game that way.



@Errol: Why is China in your Vietnam stupid? More than a couple of dynasties made forays into Annam and/or made tributaries out of the various Vietnamese client states.

[Heron TSG]

It makes sense, considering that Viet Nam is Chinese for 'Great South'.

[Johnfalcon99977]

My China is divided into three states. I don't know what those nations are actually named (Localized names mod), but it actually looks pretty interesting.

I'm also trying something new. Italy was becoming too easy, so I killed my leader and switched to Toulouse (One of the reformed nations which revolted from France) to try and make a nice little Kingdom in the buffer area between France and Iberia. So far its been going fairly well. Absolutely crushed Foix, a hardcore Catholic revolter which used the "Expel Reformed/Protestants from our country!" Religous decision a bit too much. To the point where their population was less then every German OPM. Individually. I would like to point out that they were a Four province minor in South Western France.

I also managed to peacefully vassal the state that I released as Italy. Protip: The "Have the same Religon" requirement doesn't apply to different sects of a religon. However, now I need some advice. I just got the mission to annex this vassal. When you peacefully annex someone in the modpack I'm using (OSC, I believe), I have the option to core all of the Vassal's land in exchange for "An assembly of the Estates" which are pretty annoying. They aren't disirable at all, but it also takes 150 years for cores to pop in the same modpack. Should I just annex them straight up for only one core, or should I try and get both?

[RedKing]

It makes sense, considering that Viet Nam is Chinese for 'Great South'.

quibble: Actually, that would be Dai Nan (and Dai Nam -- regional dialect shift on the latter word -- was a name for Vietnam at one point). The earlier name of An Nam means "peaceful/quiet south". In early Imperial China (Qin and Han dynasties), the kingdom of Nanyue (Southern Yue people) encompassed northern Vietnam and the southern Chinese provinces of Yunnan, and parts of Guangxi and Guangdong. "Viet" is the Vietnamese pronunciation of the Chinese appellation "Yue", so even the name Vietnam is China all up in your Vietnam. 

I'd be curious to see this D&T mod to see how they handled splitting China.

[Errol]

@Errol: Why is China in your Vietnam stupid? More than a couple of dynasties made forays into Annam and/or made tributaries out of the various Vietnamese client states.

I don't like the regularity with which it happens. It's not quite as bad as Korea all over the place (Vietnam, Xia), but the borders in this game are still hella ugly. Chinese enclaves everywhere, no land connections... like half of their lands are terribly administrated. And they keep growing.
Also, it's an aspect of the big bad Mingblob. Stupid damn Mingblob does not appreciate your efforts to become the dominant power of the far east.
And even if you through sheer tenacity, attrition and disregard of the forcelimit manage to get them out of Korea and occupy Nanjing while at it, even if you beat Qing into giving you the rest of Korea they held on to - at once, this time -  even of you force release Fang holding most of the east coast provinces (including Nanjing), cutting their income by a third and finally denying them the strait to Taiwan - they just don't stop. It's getting ridiculous.

Actually, this time it wasn't Ming who started the war. It's been Qing. But they are allied to Ming with superglue. And Qing also has an alliance with Fang, which, for some reason, takes priority over mine, in a war they started. Sigh.

This time, I am not going to stop until China looks like the goddamn Balkans on steroids. Fuckers should consider themselves warned.

[RedKing]

One does not simply conquer into China. 

Manpower reserves and metric shit-ton of provinces (and sliders which are typically full serfdom) means they have a war exhaustion reservoir waaaaay deeper than most people can handle. You have to utterly crush them to get relatively minor concessions.

[Errol]

Yeah, kind of noticed - when I was off resting my troops after peacing out Qing in the latest war, I went to rest mine (45 regiments, 10k troops. ouch) before attempting the "Occupy Nanjing" mission I got after fulfilling the "Get some more pieces of Korea" one. Cue two 20k stacks again and another in the making after just two or three months. I crushed them again, and they were willing to accept peace to my terms after I successfully assaulted their capital. Still.

The entire war was kind of an uphill struggle. This is why I am so looking forward to crushing Ming beneath my damn heels.

Not having armories in most of my provinces does not help matters. Obviously Workshops and Drydocks are much more important.

[NRDL]

Yeah, kind of noticed - when I was off resting my troops after peacing out Qing in the latest war, I went to rest mine (45 regiments, 10k troops. ouch) before attempting the "Occupy Nanjing" mission I got after fulfilling the "Get some more pieces of Korea" one. Cue two 20k stacks again and another in the making after just two or three months. I crushed them again, and they were willing to accept peace to my terms after I successfully assaulted their capital. Still.

The entire war was kind of an uphill struggle. This is why I am so looking forward to crushing Ming beneath my damn heels.

Not having armories in most of my provinces does not help matters. Obviously Workshops and Drydocks are much more important.

What are you playing as again?  You got screenshots? 

[Errol]

I'm playing as Japan, so I have a fighting chance... although, the latest war caught me with my pants down (read: zero military maintenance)

Screenshots incoming.

[Rex_Nex]

What effect does occupying someone's capital have? I know these is something bad about having your capital under enemy control, but I cant recall what it is. War Exhaustion increase?