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Author Topic: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Rise of the Jewel [Game Over]  (Read 113743 times)

Darvi

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #405 on: September 14, 2011, 04:57:23 am »

Kills (then Conversions)
I feel a lot safer now.


So Simple: Kills Tolyk
Max: Hands Think some drugs (to make him stoned. Geddit?)
Me: DM on TolyK.

Thieves are okay to steal from TolyK this day, but during the night, if there's any more than us two targeting him, somebody will have to explain themselves.
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Darvi

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #406 on: September 14, 2011, 04:58:28 am »

Unless of course wuba is the leader, sure. Then we block simple and lynch him the next day.
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Orangebottle

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #407 on: September 14, 2011, 11:27:28 am »

Wait. Can someone explain the logic behind there being a cult? Why couldn't it just be none-ing scum? Maybe they didn't start with a kill item?
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Darvi

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #408 on: September 14, 2011, 11:41:53 am »

Why couldn't it just be none-ing scum?
Because none-ing on the off-chance of there being a cult is quite a risk.

Also, the flavor says that the jewel can mind control, so cult seems the obvious answer.
Quote
Maybe they didn't start with a kill item?
Reread the previous RL's. They can kill without a kill item. Which is why the second game was so broken when they got one that didn't get used up during the first day.
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Simple

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #409 on: September 14, 2011, 12:09:24 pm »

Person: I decided it's better to not kill only due to feeble leads i got. I admit i have not thought it out completely and just acted on assumption that killing will be much more harmful than informative if i choose wrong target.

Personally, I would be going for the uncommon. The problem, however, is that then you won't know what you get until the night starts, right? So your not very useful to planning our night actions.
Also, confusing a cult leader means we have nothing to go off for figuring out who he would have converted. It is random.
You believe you can predict who cult leader would have chosen ? That's nice to know.. Don't go in that way, it's one-way road to wifom arguments.

I'm bit worried about what exactly is meant to happen. This plan has easy to find holes if scum got even semi-good items. So who does what exactly if wuba flips martyr/cultist/leader ?

Wait. Can someone explain the logic behind there being a cult? Why couldn't it just be none-ing scum? Maybe they didn't start with a kill item?
Well, aside from webadict thirdpartiness i think we got nothing to be sure of that. Does it changes anything anyway ?

Why couldn't it just be none-ing scum?
Because none-ing on the off-chance of there being a cult is quite a risk.

Also, the flavor says that the jewel can mind control, so cult seems the obvious answer.
What ? If they are scum they know they are cult or not, right ? Why would they fear none-ing in that case ? I'm confused.
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Darvi

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #410 on: September 14, 2011, 12:35:58 pm »

I'm bit worried about what exactly is meant to happen. This plan has easy to find holes if scum got even semi-good items. So who does what exactly if wuba flips martyr/cultist/leader ?
If he flips martyr(which he won't) or any other third party that isn't a cultist, back to square one. At least we know that Max didn't lie about his N2 claim though, but that could mean anything really.
If he flips leader, Max blocks you and you get lynched next day because TolyK (who logically would've been town back then) saw him visit you.
If he flips cult, then you kill TolyK.
If he flips town, you shoot Max.

Quote
What ? If they are scum they know they are cult or not, right ? Why would they fear none-ing in that case ? I'm confused.
You definitely are confused. It's not about whether scum knows if they're cult. He's talking about whether we know if they are cult or not.

The fluff states that the macguffin can mind control. So if there's a mafia they would assume that there's a cult.
They would want to get rid of the cult, because they share the same goals, albeit by different means:
The mafia can reduce the town's number, cult can increase their own number while keeping the number of suspects high.

Killing is the one advantage that mafia has over town (as well as knowing their own partners), and cult can, if not stopped, easily outnumber the mafia. It's in the best interes of the mafia to get as many people killed by any means possible (and hopefully get rid of the cult leader).

Noneing also prolongs the game, giving the town more time to root them out. Again, not helpful for the mafia.

Of course there are several circumstances where mafia would want to not kill, but those are very specific cases.
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Max White

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #411 on: September 14, 2011, 06:56:35 pm »

I'm bit worried about what exactly is meant to happen. This plan has easy to find holes if scum got even semi-good items. So who does what exactly if wuba flips martyr/cultist/leader ?

If Wubba flips martyr:  ???
If he flips cultist: The cult leader is either Tolyk or think, thus we must shut these guys down tonight, before they get another convert. Either kill or block.
If he flips cult leader: Well he claims to have visited you n1, so you have fun with that.

Mr.Person

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #412 on: September 14, 2011, 07:28:29 pm »

Person: I decided it's better to not kill only due to feeble leads i got. I admit i have not thought it out completely and just acted on assumption that killing will be much more harmful than informative if i choose wrong target.

You could of at least killed Think. Don't you think that would of been a good idea? We're at 8p, Think is asking for a replacement. I dunno, it just makes a lot of sense to me to kill Think last night.

I gotta say, the fact you didn't is seriously making me worry you're the cult leader. But we'll know for sure when Webadict flips. Rampant useless paranoia is, well, useless.
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Max White

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #413 on: September 14, 2011, 07:33:29 pm »

That a good point.
Perhaps if Wubba flips cultist, Simple should kill Think. It get's a potential leader out of the way, and somebody who can't play right now.
I can still block Tolyk, so if he is the leader he can't make a convert, and we lynch him tomorrow, and at least he would have a slim chance to defend himself, and the game seems more fun that way.

No fun in having to lynch somebody that isn't even playing. And Wubba knows that, thus the girly fit about not posting.

Orangebottle

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #414 on: September 14, 2011, 07:51:42 pm »

All these cult theories are making my head hurt.

The fluff states that the macguffin can mind control. So if there's a mafia they would assume that there's a cult.
Didn't Wuba flavor-claim the macguffin?

I hit Simple with the probing, not Orangebottle.
Funny, I don't remember simple claiming a ring of warning. Hrm. Must have missed it somewhere.

You could of at least killed Think. Don't you think that would of been a good idea? We're at 8p, Think is asking for a replacement. I dunno, it just makes a lot of sense to me to kill Think last night.

I gotta say, the fact you didn't is seriously making me worry you're the cult leader. But we'll know for sure when Webadict flips. Rampant useless paranoia is, well, useless.
...So, you're calling what you're doing useless? You have to be pretty paranoid to be that suspicious of a person who requested a replacement. Killing a person being replaced is just a waste of a kill. Save it for someone who is truly scum. Like Webadict. Or TolyK.



Well, aside from webadict thirdpartiness i think we got nothing to be sure of that. Does it changes anything anyway ?
Well, for one thing, if we have none-ing mafia, then they're laughing their asses off right now. It also means all this cult speculation is useless.

PPE:
That a good point.
Perhaps if Wubba flips cultist, Simple should kill Think. It get's a potential leader out of the way, and somebody who can't play right now.
I can still block Tolyk, so if he is the leader he can't make a convert, and we lynch him tomorrow, and at least he would have a slim chance to defend himself, and the game seems more fun that way.
...
If think is the leader, the cult was screwed from the start. Think has a reason to not post, while TolyK has been extremely useless all game.
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Mr.Person

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #415 on: September 14, 2011, 08:53:48 pm »

Actually, we need at least two roleblocks per leader suspect to ensure with 100% certainty they both get roleblocked. Or killed. Or whatever bad thing you want to happen.

Oh damnit, I just realized something. Webadict could of been converted n2 if Max White himself is also a member of the cult. If that's the case, Darvi, Think, and TolyK are all actually cleared. Also, it's entirely possible Web was a different third party before being cult'd. This complicates things.

Night 1 with (if this player is cult leader) analysis

Webadict:  Protect on Simple (Either Simple or TolyK is converted)
Mr.Person:  Cursed Weapon Dariush (Somebody else cursed Dariush, so converted is Simple or Orangebottle)
Think0028:  Protect on Webadict (Webadict or Darvi is converted)
Simple:  Noned (Everyone but Webadict is possible)
Max White:  Tracked Darvi to Webadict (Darvi, Think, Simple, or Orangebottle is converted)
Darvi:  Detect Monster on Webadict, came up Darvi, Think0028, and TolyK (Somebody else used the detect monster, the converted cult member must be Max White)
TolyK:  Tracked Webadict to Simple (Webadict or Darvi is converted)
Dariush:  Noned
Orangebottle:  Noned, No one targeted (Everyone but Webadict is possible)

And for Night 2:
Darvi: Bussed Person and Webadict (Convert is Webadict)
Max: Inspect Person, got redirected towards webadict, result Third party. Confirmed by webadict. At least the result. (Anybody is possible for N2)
Webadict: Door creation on TolyK (If TolyK was converted N1: Anybody but Person| If Simple, then TolyK or OB is converted)
Tolyk: commanded OB, got door'd (If Darvi was converted N1: Nobody was converted| If Webadict, anybody but Person)
Person: Probed Simple (If Simple was converted N1: Anybody but Webadict| If OB, then Simple, Think, or TolyK)
OB: Scroll of teleport. (Anybody)
Simple: None'd (Anybody)
Think: Presumably none'd (If Webadict was converted N1: Anybody but Person| If Darvi, anybody)

For the love of FUCK proofread this.

If we assume that Webadict is cult, here's all the players and their status on potential of being cult leader.

Webadict: We instantly win, or are likely to win after RB'ing Simple, then lynching Simple and TolyK, then noneing until we get items and win with them
Mr.Person: Fully cleared (Unable to ever target Webadict all game)
Think0028:  Possible
Simple:  Cleared*
Max White:  Possible
Darvi: Possible (Yes, I made a mistake earlier, this is correct I think)
TolyK:  Possible
Orangebottle:  Cleared*

(*Only cult leader if Webadict was a third party before being cult'd or other shenanigans have happened)

Remember, this isn't a list of who is or isn't converted, this is a list of who is or isn't the cult leader. You know what, here's the convert list as well:
Think: Webadict N1, Anybody but Person N2
Max: Darvi, Think, Simple, or OB N1, Webadict N2
Darvi: Max White N1, Webadict N2
TolyK: Webadict N1, Anybody but Person N2

Actually, when Webby flips cult, I WILL in fact be clear. Wow, I'm making mistakes left and right. Oh well.

You could of at least killed Think. Don't you think that would of been a good idea? We're at 8p, Think is asking for a replacement. I dunno, it just makes a lot of sense to me to kill Think last night.

I gotta say, the fact you didn't is seriously making me worry you're the cult leader. But we'll know for sure when Webadict flips. Rampant useless paranoia is, well, useless.
...So, you're calling what you're doing useless? You have to be pretty paranoid to be that suspicious of a person who requested a replacement. Killing a person being replaced is just a waste of a kill. Save it for someone who is truly scum. Like Webadict. Or TolyK.

I realized as such mid post, which is why I actually said that post and the entire line of reasoning behind it was useless. Hence why I instead did all this.
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Hmm...I've never been a big fan of CCGs - I mean, I did and still do collect Pokemon cards, but I never got heavily into the battling and trading thing.

By definition that makes you a fan since you still buy them.

Max White

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #416 on: September 14, 2011, 09:23:47 pm »

Ok, so I can see how I'm not cleared, it would take a pretty bit gambit on my behalf, but technically you are right.
But how can Darvi be the leader? How did he know who visited Wubba n1?

Orangebottle

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #417 on: September 14, 2011, 09:25:50 pm »

Person: Explain your logic behind you being clear if Webadict is cult.
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Darvi

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #418 on: September 14, 2011, 11:24:02 pm »

@Max: If I converted somebody on N1 who did the Detect Monster on Webadict, or if webadict had one of those Rings of Alarm, I could've easily taken the credit for the tracking while they claimed something else.

@OB: I bussed Person and wuba N2. If webadict was a convertee in D2, then the cult wouldn't have tried to convert him and any attempt to convert Person would fail. That's how.
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Orangebottle

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Re: Roguelike Mafia 3 - Same Story, Different Day [Day 3] [Need Replacement]
« Reply #419 on: September 15, 2011, 12:00:49 am »

Right. And if Wuba flips town or martyr?
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