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[Tellemurius]

Funny you should mention that.

The negotiation changes based on who has control of Whiterun.

If it's the stormcloaks, Tullius does the same thing except demanding Riften.

Riften can go for all i care as that Jarl bitchy-Briar needed to die so badly.

[Eagle_eye]

The imperial replacement is far worse.

[WillowLuman]

The Imperials put Maven on the throne. I hate that bitch. Good news is, sometimes with werewolf mauls it glitches and lets you kill essential people.

On the other hand, the stormcloaks put Ingun Silverblood on the throne, and he's equally bad. He wants to enslave the Forsworn.

[Tellemurius]

The Imperials put Maven on the throne. I hate that bitch. Good news is, sometimes with werewolf mauls it glitches and lets you kill essential people.

On the other hand, the stormcloaks put Ingun Silverblood on the throne, and he's equally bad. He wants to enslave the Forsworn.

Somehow that feels good to me considering the treatment they put me through
"Wait so you tried to kill me and now you want me to help you break out so you can still poke around the Rift and call me names? F you old man"

[WillowLuman]

Yeah, but he also wants to put everyone else down his damn mine

[Shadowlord]

There were never any peace talks for me, since by that point I had assassinated the Emperor (As the dragonborn, I intended to claim the throne, and he was in the way), and then assisted the Imperials in re-taking Skyrim from the Stormcloaks and killing Ulfric in a matter of days. My reason for taking out the Stormcloaks and Ulfric was chiefly because I was an Argonian, and Ulfric and his Stormcloaks appeared to be trying to create Nazi Skyrim. The early warning signs were obvious to me - he skipped the making-them-wear-symbols stage because the non-human races have obvious visible differences from humans in Skyrim, and was already in the separate-them-into-ghettos stage in his capital city (He also had the charismatic leader thing going on).

[Felius]

The Imperials put Maven on the throne. I hate that bitch. Good news is, sometimes with werewolf mauls it glitches and lets you kill essential people.

On the other hand, the stormcloaks put Ingun Silverblood on the throne, and he's equally bad. He wants to enslave the Forsworn.

Somehow that feels good to me considering the treatment they put me through
"Wait so you tried to kill me and now you want me to help you break out so you can still poke around the Rift and call me names? F you old man"

On the other hand the Silverblood run the town from the shadows, or at least enough to frame you and have you thrown on their names. Personally, the most satisfying way to deal with that quest is to kill the forsworn in the mine because they are murderous bastards, accept the thanks of the Silverblood bastard, follow him home and cut his head off. Or just kill him in plain sight of the guards and pay the fine, it's not like it's very expensive.

[WillowLuman]

Both the Silverbloods and the Black Briars corrupt their town from the shadows, and both take charge officially if the town changes hands.

[Lightning4]

On the other hand the Silverblood run the town from the shadows, or at least enough to frame you and have you thrown on their names. Personally, the most satisfying way to deal with that quest is to kill the forsworn in the mine because they are murderous bastards, accept the thanks of the Silverblood bastard, follow him home and cut his head off. Or just kill him in plain sight of the guards and pay the fine, it's not like it's very expensive.

You can go a best of both worlds if you're lucky. I ran out with the Forsworn, and they promptly ran out killing tons of guards and a few NPCs they're hostile to. I believe the majority of them escaped, but their leader ended up getting split off and facing that merc guy with the giant weapon. He promptly died.
Silverblood was one of the first to die in the fray, of course.

I pretty much just watched. I did nothing. I guess it doesn't help much, there's still like, five other Silver-Bloods, but their patriarch is gone, essentially.

[Cecilff2]

There were never any peace talks for me, since by that point I had assassinated the Emperor (As the dragonborn, I intended to claim the throne, and he was in the way), and then assisted the Imperials in re-taking Skyrim from the Stormcloaks and killing Ulfric in a matter of days. My reason for taking out the Stormcloaks and Ulfric was chiefly because I was an Argonian, and Ulfric and his Stormcloaks appeared to be trying to create Nazi Skyrim. The early warning signs were obvious to me - he skipped the making-them-wear-symbols stage because the non-human races have obvious visible differences from humans in Skyrim, and was already in the separate-them-into-ghettos stage in his capital city (He also had the charismatic leader thing going on).

Yeah I remember how all the altmer and imperials of Windhelm are discriminated against.  Oh wait, Niranye's doing well, so is Nurelion(Though he's dying of old age), as is his apprentice, as is the stable master and wife, as is everyone in windhelm who is not dunmer.  You know why?  It isn't his job to govern them, they were told they would govern themselves and as such had no obligation to the holds.  It sucks that the argonians can't come in, but you've got a large population of old traditional clannish dunmer who saw their homeland get invaded and many of their people slaughtered by argonians.  Despite all his words, Brunwulf doesn't change a thing about the policies.  He even admits that he can't let the argonians in because he's afraid of what will happen to them.

Furthermore, Imperial skyrim does the same thing.  Ahtar the headsmen in Solitude notes that Torygg never would've allowed argonians into solitude.  The orc at the lumbermill outside town notes that he dreads having to go into town because of the treatment they give to orcs.

The thing is EVERY RACE IN TAMRIEL is typically racist as hell by default.  Or did you forget about the argonian exclusive torture chambers in Leyawiin?  Or the tendency of most Black Marsh argonians to want to kill and eat outsiders.  Or the bosmer and khajiit's typical fueds.  Or the altmer's superiority complex.  Or the hatred of the orcs by the bretons and redguards.  Or the beast race slavery in morrowind.  The clannish, and distrustful ways of the orsimer.

[Teneb]

-snipped to avoid quote pyramid-

You make a good point. Still, I'd rather support the Empire so they can have a better chance against the Dominion.

[Putnam]

Note also that Nords, Argonians and Dunmer usually have nothing but hate for each other, to the point that there has never been any peace between them that wasn't forced by an outside government.

Except for TES:O, but fuck that.

[Shadowlord]

The Altmer probably weren't discriminated against as much because Ulfric was a Super Secret Thalmor Agent. As for Imperials, they're still men and he can't alienate EVERYONE all at once.

As for having peace forced by an outside party, yes, the Empire tends to do that when it gets done conquering / unifying provinces under its banner. It didn't stop the Dunmer from keeping slaves, though, despite the illegality of slavery in the rest of the Empire. Considering the Tribunal's power at the time Morrowind joined the Empire, it's not surprising that they weren't too demanding. The Empire (and Emperors) probably didn't see any reason to fight an unnecessary war, especially if any of them were aware of the coming Oblivion Crisis ahead of time.

[Cecilff2]

Note also that Nords, Argonians and Dunmer usually have nothing but hate for each other, to the point that there has never been any peace between them that wasn't forced by an outside government.

Except for TES:O, but fuck that.

Nords + Dunmer teamed up when the Kamal invaded.  Snow demons that want to kill everyone on Tamriel are a bigger priority I suppose.

[WillowLuman]

Was it the Kamal? It was just some invaders from Akavir that were unspecified, I thought. Didn't Vivec destroy their army by flooding Morrowind?

Also, Orcs and Nords have a long history of teaming up to go invade the Dunmer. Dunmer and Argonians hate each others guts due to years of slavery and revenge for slavery, and revenge for revenge for slavery. Vicious cycle of hate and all that. Which is why Brand Shei is so interesting.