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[Taricus]

Actually, I just want to read it, so it's more from a reading perspective and such.

I mean, if we all started PMing all this there wouldn't bemuch in the thread, and that generally means it's boring...

[filiusenox]

I'm pretty sure nothing besides Espionage rolls need to be Pm'ed for.
I mean William right now is trying to gain control of a kingdom, you don't see me pm'ing Nuke for all the answers and shit, to Will's questions.

[Taricus]

The thing is, is that I doubt it was espionage action (Cosidering it would've had to have been a foreign nation. There is no other player kings (Or queens) right now so I highly doubt that.

[filiusenox]

So?
Someone went and burned some books. It's not like he poisioned the wells and killed the general.
Why don't you hunt them down IC? Instead of Discussing it in OOC?
I'm pretty sure thats what your supposed to do. Or what I was supposed to do, if I was in charge of Internal Affairs.

[Ardas]

I'm against meta-gaming. this rule held in the first YaK and i wish that it remains so. Besides, I hope we all trust each other sufficient to know that OOC does not leak to IC, so there is no trouble with espionage being carried out that way. But please, do not PM each other in such case, just for the sake of fairness and transparency with other players.

[Taricus]

I'm against meta-gaming. this rule held in the first YaK and i wish that it remains so. Besides, I hope we all trust each other sufficient to know that OOC does not leak to IC, so there is no trouble with espionage being carried out that way. But please, do not PM each other in such case, just for the sake of fairness and transparency with other players.

Bolded the part I tried to say, but failed.

At any rate, to whoever did that I just have to ask if it is involved with that noble being chucked out the window. If so, try again as that's a different storyline being worked on...

[filiusenox]

...
So should I re-open the voting thread for this matter?

I think that Pm'ing for secret rolls is interesting, it's surprising and it keeps you on your toes, you don't know whats going to happen next, you don't know what the people have planned and can't think "Wow I think becuase those guys on the other side of the feild are outnumbered, that they have something planned, im going to call off the charge!" .
Plus it makes it so that you can't just say, "I just randomly chop the culprit's head off, becuase i'm chaotic and i don't like him, oh and would you look at that? He has the knife that stabbed the general! What luck!"
Theres a hundred tiny ways you can meta-game, that ae barely noticable but can be used to give yourself a bonus. You could look for clues that aren't there and find one that proves that someone did it.
Say if someone murdered somebody, then the queen decides that that person looks a bit suspicous and asks for a tail to be put on him. Then they discover that he murdered somebody.
Life's not fair. Getting murdered by a spy is part of being a noble, you can't expect everything, and if we continued playing in the old one, Kain would most likely be dead. I would find it an annoying surprise, then gen a new char, while posting some crap about Amaryills being pregnent with Kain's son.
But in my opinoin, if something bad happens and it don't fit in your plans and you don't know who did it:
GET OVER IT AND HUNT THEM DOWN.

[Taricus]

I'm sticking with what Iituem said about PMing for rolls. Thus, no secret rolls.

[filiusenox]

Where did he say that?
I've sent Iituem secret rolls before, concerning the fact that the treasury had been inflitrated. He rolled them right up.

And you don't have the power to declare that, Taricus.

[Taricus]

That was in response to an NPC nation doing so.

And I have 1/3 power to say that though.

[NUKE9.13]

I am torn between saying secrecy should be allowed and saying it shouldn't.

On the balance, I say it should be allowed. If CG thought the secrecy was merited, it probably was.

But secrecy should not be overused. Most actions, including most covert actions, should be public. Only things which carry a high risk of subconscious metagaming, like secret manoeuvres in battles (I think that the enemy has a trap set, I will retreat for now), or, indeed, assassination plots (I think I am being followed, I will wear armour all the time), should be allowed to be secret.

[Taricus]

Laythe already wears the full armour though

In all seriousness, I do think that the situations that Nuke describes would be the only one that any sort of secrecy would apply to...

EDIT: Do I smell a shadeling in that dungeon?

[filiusenox]

Sounds like time to go Dungeoncrawling.

[CyberGenesis]

Tari: Not knowing something OOC is actually a good thing (Battle of Miring). And the part you bolded, was against US PM'ing eachother giving up information about Esp missions and such that they couldn't possibly know. Was also not Iituem's, but i'm pretty sure i remember his issues against it were for the same reason.

I can rule for this action to have been espionage, because it was basically a sabotuer action. It was also a basically meaningless action in terms of the damage done to Ligoria. What royalty doesnt keep backup records of all of that information in the castle itself?

No, it doesnt need to be another nation - players can run Esp missions. They just get neg mods for not being/having spies - unless they are of course

I believe Iituem's intent on the no secret rolls was mainly in regard to heavy metagaming. Esp missions are allowed - If it helps, given the lack of a spy involved, i made a second set of rolls for the city watchmen (your watch is a bunch of tards apparently).

Long story short, it's cool. No more blind actions unless they're entirely NPC. I'm good with that

[filiusenox]

Badass. I got a dragon skeleton.
...
Damn, I just need a house to put it in.