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[ashton1993]

In which region? Middle East? China? Europe?

They seemed to be in use in China around...the 10th century but needed to use water as a power source.

True mechanical clocks seemed to become more widespread around the Mediterranean around the 12th-14th century.

But if I'm correct, the clocks your thinking of became really common in the 15th-16th century, at least in Germany.

I was thinking of being a clockmaker, with a.. business on the side.

Damn it! As I was reading this I was deciding on who my character would be and on the bus ride home (I read some before and after) I essentially decided to be a Hacturi mechanic who fiddled around with unethical experimentation and specialist spy work. Or will your character be different enough mine will still work?

EDIT: Also I support organic game growth and starting in say just 1 - 3 cities

[NUKE9.13]

Ok, so we're starting small and expanding from there? That works well for the majority.

Excellent. Next question, where to have this small start. Saying 'the storm coast' is all well and good, but the storm coast appears to cover the entire length of a continent.

Might I suggest here?

Spoiler: Aww yis, using paint to edit compressed images. Best quality. (click to show/hide)

I made some changes to the geography because the coast looked a bit boring, and also some cities were too close together.
White is basically neutral land, lacking in real governance/power
Grey represents minor city states, who, without player intervention, can be left to muddle along not doing anything interesting.
I propose we center play (to begin with) around the light purple city state (in the red box). Expansion/Rebellions could go overland to the north, or overseas to the west, or even overseas to the south.
The game would probably naturally expand to fill the larger red box, offering both the yellow and pink states as more serious enemies, a variety of islands and city states to conquer, and the large orange blob to the NE as a source of !!FUN!!. For reference, the larger red box is about as large as the map of elbreth in the first post.

Other:
-Made Vasir a large city. Not sure if thats appropriate, but it seemed like a good idea. Also, Vasir's wiki page mentions that it owns islands, but I wasn't sure where they were supposed to be, so, yeah.
-To the south is a proposed location for the lowlands (the bright orange country), and also the fringes of the light orange nation's natural enemies, the light green nation.
-I still think the coast needs more inlets and islands, but such details are better sorted on the fly, methinks.
-The unowned land above the northern borders would, I figure, be a wasteland inhabited by barbarians/worse

...maybe?

[Digital Hellhound]

Picture doesn't work, actually.

Vasir doesn't have many islands large enough to be shown on the map, but you can drop one or two wherever you want, like Crete and such with Venice. North of the Storm Coast (looking from Vasir) is the Udanese High Kingdom, a long-time rival/enemy of the city-states, and no doubt lots of disorganized barbarians.

I'll leave further comments for a map I can see.

[ashton1993]

Ok, so we're starting small and expanding from there? That works well for the majority.

Excellent. Next question, where to have this small start. Saying 'the storm coast' is all well and good, but the storm coast appears to cover the entire length of a continent.

Might I suggest here?

Spoiler: Aww yis, using paint to edit compressed images. Best quality. (click to show/hide)

I made some changes to the geography because the coast looked a bit boring, and also some cities were too close together.
White is basically neutral land, lacking in real governance/power
Grey represents minor city states, who, without player intervention, can be left to muddle along not doing anything interesting.
I propose we center play (to begin with) around the light purple city state (in the red box). Expansion/Rebellions could go overland to the north, or overseas to the west, or even overseas to the south.
The game would probably naturally expand to fill the larger red box, offering both the yellow and pink states as more serious enemies, a variety of islands and city states to conquer, and the large orange blob to the NE as a source of !!FUN!!. For reference, the larger red box is about as large as the map of elbreth in the first post.

Other:
-Made Vasir a large city. Not sure if thats appropriate, but it seemed like a good idea. Also, Vasir's wiki page mentions that it owns islands, but I wasn't sure where they were supposed to be, so, yeah.
-To the south is a proposed location for the lowlands (the bright orange country), and also the fringes of the light orange nation's natural enemies, the light green nation.
-I still think the coast needs more inlets and islands, but such details are better sorted on the fly, methinks.
-The unowned land above the northern borders would, I figure, be a wasteland inhabited by barbarians/worse

...maybe?

Hmm... I'd probably prefer if we played a bit further west and start with maybe two cities: Vasir and Acre (republic of groaning's capital) as we've written about them before, your character would probably do well in Acre actually I'm pretty sure a large part of it's economy was creating art tapestries, may have been somewhere else though, and also isn't the republic of groan on the other side of Vasir? Your location would involve more world building before a thread could be created and possibly holding things up a bit when we go into debates over its history and such. Yar and some other parts of the map are a wee bit confusing as DH just pointed out

I may be getting my internet turned off by my older brother.

Thought you lived alone, ah shucks doesn't really matter at all.

[filiusenox]

I may be getting my internet turned off by my older brother.

[NUKE9.13]

Hmm... I'd probably prefer if we played a bit further west and start with maybe two cities: Vasir and Acre (republic of groaning's capital) as we've written about them before, your character would probably do well in Acre actually I'm pretty sure a large part of it's economy was creating art tapestries, may have been somewhere else though, and also isn't the republic of groan on the other side of Vasir? Your location would involve more world building before a thread could be created and possibly holding things up a bit when we go into debates over its history and such. Yar and some other parts of the map are a wee bit confusing as DH just pointed out

Well, I'm not sure how much preparation went into the original thread, but I get the impression that a lot of things were made up basically on the fly as they came up (although I could be totally wrong). Regardless, I thought the whole point of moving the game was so that new worldbuilding can occur, without having to constantly check whether it interferes with the old.
I figured that basic world building for the starting city and surroundings would do, and the other details could be filled in as they were encountered.

Picture doesn't work, actually.

Er. Does the direct link work? If not, perhaps

Spoiler: this will work? (click to show/hide)

Vasir doesn't have many islands large enough to be shown on the map, but you can drop one or two wherever you want, like Crete and such with Venice. North of the Storm Coast (looking from Vasir) is the Udanese High Kingdom, a long-time rival/enemy of the city-states, and no doubt lots of disorganized barbarians.

Yeah, I thought as much. Also, what sort of place is this Udanese High Kingdom? Could it conceivably stretch all the way to join the eastern light orange?

[Digital Hellhound]

Looks like it was a problem with my internets, nevermind.

Udan (I was sure I'd written a page for it, huh) is large but decentralized, so I guess it could. It's made up of loosely-connected tribes independent in all but name in a sort of Holy Roman Empire-ish situation. You folks are free to detail the place in any way you want.

EDIT: Err, not that it should take up any of the existing map. It's far above the coast.

[ashton1993]

Hmm... I'd probably prefer if we played a bit further west and start with maybe two cities: Vasir and Acre (republic of groaning's capital) as we've written about them before, your character would probably do well in Acre actually I'm pretty sure a large part of it's economy was creating art tapestries, may have been somewhere else though, and also isn't the republic of groan on the other side of Vasir? Your location would involve more world building before a thread could be created and possibly holding things up a bit when we go into debates over its history and such. Yar and some other parts of the map are a wee bit confusing as DH just pointed out

Well, I'm not sure how much preparation went into the original thread, but I get the impression that a lot of things were made up basically on the fly as they came up (although I could be totally wrong). Regardless, I thought the whole point of moving the game was so that new worldbuilding can occur, without having to constantly check whether it interferes with the old.
I figured that basic world building for the starting city and surroundings would do, and the other details could be filled in as they were encountered.

Well a few bits were considered, some was made up on the fly and then sometimes that would be built upon and linked to other stuff, ect. whilst the point of moving the game was making sure we wouldn't have to deal with consistency problems and making it a bit easier for new players I think we can still do this in a familiar setting and if we're moving why not start somewhere that's already been described but doesn't have a (really confusing) muddle of plot, defining a new area from scratch will essentially put us where we would be with something more similar to my proposition but without the familiarity older players could feel. The Vasir area really isn't that confusing just to sum everything up there:

Groaning and Aching exist with a few minor towns and stuff
They merge and become a republic
Acre is the capital made of two half the trading port and the city proper further inland which is a cultural hub
A merchant lord declares independence from Groaning and creates the Duchy of Vasir
The Storm Coast Trading Guild rises to power in Vasir, a militaristic trading group similar to the East India Trading Company

I'm pretty sure that's about it if your looking for an overview of the areas history without detail

EDIT: Okies I'm of to the photographic society meetup so probably won't post again until tomorrow

[Iituem]

I was making sh-t up all the time.

But seriously, starting in the one city-state is a good idea.  You are King was as much about infighting and politicking between nobles and powermongers either trying to strike out on their own, win the king's affections or downright replace them as ruler entirely.  Starting in the one city state gives us the scope to begin with that and then expand accordingly as the game develops.

My rule of thumb in the original game was 'let the players take it where it needs to go'.  Admittedly this could have done with a touch more management to avoid me burning out, but it worked well enough for a good time.


Also, the SCTG had spies in both Government and Treasury.  Suul had spies in Government and Espionage (they had a man in Kain's own department - his lieutenant).

Edit:  When you guys decide on an Arbiter GM, make new OOC and RP threads.  Or I may, if I end up being the rulemaker.  We'll see.

[CyberGenesis]

This game is -your- baby Iituem. Anything we'd do we'd want your blessing on. So if you want to just be 'God' to our kings while they rule the world, that'd be awesome. When we have ideas or modifications to the current rules - you'd get the PM and Executive Veto powers.

My personal intention has always been to play the game first and foremost, and break it as a secondary...somewhere in third place is 'screw your neighbor'. I have a long background in game design as a hobby - as does terenos. I can try to fabricate a few things to roll for us (fights and whatnot). I already remade the trade tables based on the ones posted already (using the majority of what i proposed as modifications to trade)

When we get there i have a few other suggestions for the equality of merchants and nobles (and by equality, i mean nobles able to string up merchants when justified)

[Ardas]

well then, it seems most of the details can be hammered out as we wait for the vote to finish.

[NUKE9.13]

well then, it seems most of the details can be hammered out as we wait for the vote to finish.

Which details? And who will be doing the hammering?

[Ardas]

All of them! And it will be a Hammerer of course! What a silly questions you ask.

[NUKE9.13]

...yes.

Maybe (crazy idea), you could do some of the hammering?

And all of them, that would be:
-Where we start (geographically)
-What sort of place the starting place is (politically, socially, religiously)
-Major details about the surroundings (basically just the names for things)

I've suggested a starting location. I believe ashton is suggesting we start in Vasir. Hammer away.

[Taricus]

Well, starting in the purple city outlined on Nuke's map sounds reasonable, if we could make our own culture for it.