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[pikachu17]

PTW

[LordBaal]

Starcraft Total War.

I believe it would be loads of fun.

[MoonyTheHuman]

A Free To Play MMO(RPG) with a player driven economy that doesn't need realworld payments (cosmetics are fine tho) and lets the players shape the world.

[Gatleos]

A Free To Play MMO(RPG) with a player driven economy that doesn't need realworld payments (cosmetics are fine tho) and lets the players shape the world.

RIP Ultima Online 

[Reelya]

A Free To Play MMO(RPG) with a player driven economy that doesn't need realworld payments (cosmetics are fine tho) and lets the players shape the world.

RIP Ultima Online 

Ultima Online doesn't match that description because he wants free to play. UO was firmly from the subscription era. And actually still is, from a casual google.

However, I have a problem with that as a "game you wish existed". Sure, you could make that but it's either going to look like balls or go broke 1 week later.

The thing about Free To Play models is that they need a predictable character upgrade path so that they can get people to buy the cosmetic upgrades at a predictable rate. Having a player-created world with it's own internal economy means it's going to suffer from real-world economics: boom and bust cycles and other player-caused meltdowns. If your whole payment model is based on selling cosmetics to players then they need to stick around and have a predictable path to success, e.g. they need PvE / monster farming, but PvE effectively side-steps the whole point of the "player driven economy" thing because monster drops are not part of the economy, so suddenly the whole player-driven economy thing is meaningless.

Plus, if you let players build wherever they want, that's really hard to balance so that every player has a fair game and that the server load is reasonable. e.g. economies suffer from things like monopolies: e.g. people corner the market in a certain material / item, and suddenly new players cannot afford weapons. All that makes the players angry at the game creators. And if you're reliant on charity (cosmetics) then that's a problem. Notice that most "economy" games always have some stuff that you can buy and sell directly to NPCs, thus bypassing the entire economy itself. The other big problem is that one player can make multiple accounts on a free to play game, and if it's an economy-based game then they can use that advantage to corner the market or build up ridiculous economic empires.

[Gatleos]

Yes, the whole player-driven economy thing is really hard to do, and probably near-impossible with a free-to-play model. I'm not really concerned with pricing models here, just the gameplay as they described it.
On a different note, I'm tired of stealth games that get less interesting the more you try to challenge yourself with them. It seems like almost all of them front-load their mechanics into a combat system, and shooting your way through a level (even if you're doing so in a stealthy way, not just running and gunning) is inevitably the easiest way to play. Then they convey the message that the greater challenge in the game is a "no kill run". And it almost always is a greater challenge, but it also turns out to be less fun than killing everybody, because it's a "no fun gameplay mechanics allowed run".

Stealth games need to start pushing in the same direction as character action games. Those get more rewarding the better you get at them, because the deeper mechanics are hidden behind a more user-friendly "surface game". The game starts out fun but simplistic, and the player can more or less button mash through most of it on a lower difficulty level. Higher difficulty levels and a grading system then encourage the player to replay the same areas and improve, perfecting their understanding of the mechanics.

I don't know how you would do that with stealth gameplay mechanics, but moving away from a binary win/lose state (a stealth equivalent of a health bar?) might be a possibility.

[Arx]

On a different note, I'm tired of stealth games that get less interesting the more you try to challenge yourself with them. It seems like almost all of them front-load their mechanics into a combat system, and shooting your way through a level (even if you're doing so in a stealthy way, not just running and gunning) is inevitably the easiest way to play. Then they convey the message that the greater challenge in the game is a "no kill run". And it almost always is a greater challenge, but it also turns out to be less fun than killing everybody, because it's a "no fun gameplay mechanics allowed run".

This is almost the entire reason I've played very little of Dishonored. I don't want to murder my way through everything, but every mission feels almost exactly the same going full stealth.

[Fniff]

I don't know how you would do that with stealth gameplay mechanics, but moving away from a binary win/lose state (a stealth equivalent of a health bar?) might be a possibility.

I'd highly recommend you check out Tom Francis's article here, as he goes into detail about win-loss conditions (and how the spectrum between total victory and utter defeat is where things get fun) in stealth games, but also games in general.

[Reelya]

I think giving the player many more ways to interact with the environment could allieviate the repetitiveness of just sneaking. e.g. imagine if you could start a fire and it would attract attention, or set off an explosive, then in the ruckus you can dash through where you need to be.

I also didn't like in e.g. the early thief engine that environmental noise doesn't mask your footsteps. One time I was in a basement below a noisy kitchen and there was gravel in the basement. One wrong step and the guards above would yell out and come running. Very unrealistic.  If you could make it so loud noises hides your own sounds then it would be more realistic, and you could get a sense of satisfaction of causing some ruckus, and using the resultant noise as cover.

The thing to avoid is that full-stealth thing where you can't do anything wrong or try anything too interesting because they'll see or hear you, and it just turns into a long slog. Think: the heavily zombie-infested levels in Thief I for that. It was fun for a while but those areas just go on too far. Constant hiding loses it's excitement value.

[Egan_BW]

I don't know how you would do that with stealth gameplay mechanics, but moving away from a binary win/lose state (a stealth equivalent of a health bar?) might be a possibility.

I'd highly recommend you check out Tom Francis's article here, as he goes into detail about win-loss conditions (and how the spectrum between total victory and utter defeat is where things get fun) in stealth games, but also games in general.

Hehe, I was just about to recommend he play Tom Francis's game, which puts some of those ideas into effect.

[Fniff]

Someone's gonna one-up us both by actually being Tom Francis, I bet.

[Egan_BW]

I would be genuinely surprised if he had an account here.

[Mathel]

With stealth, I would like, if being spotted while sneaking actually had penalties.

While yes, if you are sneaking, there is less of a chance someone will detect you, when someone does (let's say in any TES), they should automatically call for help. While if you walked normaly, nobody would bother you.

The thing is, a person sneaking is automaticly suspicious, while a person walking can just pass.

[AzyWng]

With stealth, I would like, if being spotted while sneaking actually had penalties.

While yes, if you are sneaking, there is less of a chance someone will detect you, when someone does (let's say in any TES), they should automatically call for help. While if you walked normaly, nobody would bother you.

The thing is, a person sneaking is automaticly suspicious, while a person walking can just pass.

In Hitman 2016, trying to sneak while in view of someone else will raise suspicion. Walking generally does not (unless you're tresspassing/holding an illegal object/getting to close to one of the people you're disguised as).

[Mathel]

I have not watched or played Hitman games. But that sounds like what I mean.