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[Leafsnail]

...But how exactly was it "shot down by his own party" when only 2 of his senators and every Republican senator except one voted against it?  Surely that would be "blocked by the opposition party".

[Heron TSG]

Well, the protest went fairly well, I suppose. Our local (R) representative got asked a whole lot of questions that she couldn't really answer. I think she was hoping the crowd greeting her at her office was there to congratulate her.

I think the worst part is that she did nothing actively on the issue other than simply voting. No recommendations, no theories, no comments, nothing. She sat there and voted with her party the entire time. Way to represent our state, lady.

[nenjin]

That's practically spending twice as fast. Democrats had control of the purse strings for years and years, and every time the debt limit came up they asked for a bigger line of credit without any attempt to slow down their spending. So if you're concerned the party that had control of congress, and so the budget, for the last four years or so might be blamed for a financial crisis occuring you should have raised that consideration back in 2007 when your party took legislative power. You are now reaping what you've sown.

Let's see...

-Who reduced everyone's taxes so the government lost massive revenues, and then tried to make anyone repealing those tax breaks any enemy of the middle class and business?

-Who made our primary GDP increases contingent on a war economy?

-Who inflated our military budget in the first place, and signed us up for two wars that as a nation we're publicly committed to seeing through whether we want to or not?

-Who left office with the economy at its lowest point up to that date and handed off responsibility for fixing it?

We're reaping what was sown alright. You just seem to act like that last gardener doesn't have to account at all for the way he left the garden littered with stink bulbs.

[Phmcw]

Democrats had control of the purse strings for years and years, and every time the debt limit came up they asked for a bigger line of credit without any attempt to slow down their spending. So if you're concerned the party that had control of congress, and so the budget, for the last four years or so might be blamed for a financial crisis occuring you should have raised that consideration back in 2007 when your party took legislative power. You are now reaping what you've sown..

You're seeing exactly what you want : Whenever the president is rep. the debt grow. Clinton had it lowered. Bush raised it again and everyone knew that the economy was fucked beyond repairs when Obama won the election.

[ed boy]

Worse, when young people did protest in the UK, it was just slapped down. Newspapers were just full of articles about lazy, entitled youth and how it shouldn't have been allowed, then focused solely on the actions of a small fringe of anarchist nutters.

Woo ageing populations. Dem kids etc.

The reason why the newspapers called the youths lazy and entitles is because they were.

The government is still subsidizing university education a huge amount, even with the increased fees. The problem is, the UK has a university enrolment rate far higher than most other countries. Although countries with a university enrolment rate of around 20% of people are able to fund universities for free, the UK spent a long time with a target of 50% of people going to university. The government, by reducing funding, managed to save roughly £12.5 billion per year. The increased limit of fees allows universities to more than make up for the funding lost.

[Nadaka]

It wasn't "people" screaming "fascist neo-feudalist" it was me. I also called them traitorous anti-Americans trying to end America. I should have also called them evil and terrorists.

I can only conclude that the difference is that I was addressing the agenda and the collective that endorses it rather than an individual.

You can call this reaping what we have sown, and you would be right. We have been weak and cowering, submitting to the will of those who would destroy this nation. We can stand by no longer and allow this to continue.

The simple fact is that this countries economy has been ruined by the republicans slashing taxes and spending billions to fill the coffers of the already wealthy and enact an authoritarian police state. The democrats spend billions trying to keep the people thrown underneath the cogs of that machine from being ground into dust, while ceding ground to empower the wealthy and continue the police state in a desperate attempt to stave off disaster. The liberal progressive policy is a balanced budget, with the social safety net supported by reasonable taxes and a government that does not oppress its people. They have not been allowed to pursue that policy by the right, and now we face oblivion.

I am a patriot, my agenda is clear. Raise the damn taxes, end class warfare, protect and save America.

[Lord Shonus]

On that note, and on somewhat topic, why do a lot of people I've heard from hold a grudge against Nancy Pelosi? I haven't heard much about her so I am curious. She was one of the people they featured on the news the most when I was watching it earlier today and yesterday. I didn't see a huge problem.

A huge, effectively universal part of politics involves piling as much manure on your opponents as possible. Because it's critical to flip the fringe members of the opposition party to your banner, it is usually not prudent for political leaders to pile that shit on everyone who identifies with the opposition party, but rather to try to make the opposition leaders look as bad as possible to disenchant those fringe voters, especially when a large number of those on the fringe are only in the opposition becuase your leaders screwed up so badly. Thus, Nancy Pelosi, being the Speaker of the House when the Democrats had control, thus makes a convenient target for the entirety of the shit that Republicans try to shovel on the Democrat's policies and initiatives, much how Bush and Boehner get most of the shit going in the other direction.

[nenjin]

That and like all politicians, she talked a good game at the start but didn't really deliver as speaker. It was under her that Democrats basically got nothing done. And while you can always blame Republican opposition for that, many Dems and voters took her to task for not being aggressive enough or for not wanting to repeat Republican performances even when maybe she should have.

[Glowcat]

That and like all politicians, she talked a good game at the start but didn't really deliver as speaker. It was under her that Democrats basically got nothing done. And while you can always blame Republican opposition for that, many Dems and voters took her to task for not being aggressive enough or for not wanting to repeat Republican performances even when maybe she should have.

Wait... what? I seem to remember Nancy Pelosi's House being one of the most productive sessions in history. The problem was the Senate bottleneck.

[nenjin]

I'm not claiming perfect memory, or the willingness to go read Wikipedia atm

[Glowcat]

I'm not claiming perfect memory, or the willingness to go read Wikipedia atm

Well, I seem to remember a Maddow segment going over the impressive number of bills which got passed through the House, and I also remember the furor over how much the Senate Republicans/Conservatives were abusing filibusters.

[nenjin]

Ok I lied, I do have the will to go to Wikipedia:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/111th_United_States_Congress

Spoiler: 111th Congress legislation passed (click to show/hide)

    January 29, 2009: Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-2
    February 4, 2009: Children's Health Insurance Program Reauthorization Act (SCHIP), Pub.L. 111-3
    February 17, 2009: American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (ARRA), Pub.L. 111-5
    March 11, 2009: Omnibus Appropriations Act, 2009, Pub.L. 111-8
    March 30, 2009: Omnibus Public Land Management Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-11
    April 21, 2009: Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act, Pub.L. 111-13
    May 20, 2009: Fraud Enforcement and Recovery Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-21
    May 20, 2009: Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-22
    May 22, 2009: Weapon Systems Acquisition Reform Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-23
    May 22, 2009: Credit CARD Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-24
    June 22, 2009: Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, as Division A of Pub.L. 111-31
    June 24, 2009: Supplemental Appropriations Act of 2009 including the Car Allowance Rebate System (Cash for Clunkers), Pub.L. 111-32
    October 28, 2009: National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2010, including the Matthew Shepard and James Byrd, Jr. Hate Crimes Prevention Act, Pub.L. 111-84
    November 6, 2009: Worker, Homeownership, and Business Assistance Act of 2009, Pub.L. 111-92
    December 16, 2009: Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2010, Pub.L. 111-117
    February 12, 2010: Statutory Pay-As-You-Go Act, as Title I of Pub.L. 111-139
    March 4, 2010: Travel Promotion Act of 2009, as Section 9 of Pub.L. 111-145
    March 18, 2010: Hiring Incentives to Restore Employment Act, Pub.L. 111-147
    March 23, 2010: Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, Pub.L. 111-148
    March 30, 2010: Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act of 2010, including the Student Aid and Fiscal Responsibility Act, Pub.L. 111-152
    May 5, 2010: Caregivers and Veterans Omnibus Health Services Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-163
    July 1, 2010: Comprehensive Iran Sanctions, Accountability, and Divestment Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-195
    July 21, 2010: Dodd–Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act, Pub.L. 111-203
    August 3, 2010: Fair Sentencing Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-220
    August 10, 2010: SPEECH Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-223
    September 27, 2010: Small Business Jobs and Credit Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-240
    December 8, 2010: Claims Resolution Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-291
    December 13, 2010: Healthy, Hunger-Free Kids Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-296
    December 17, 2010: Tax Relief, Unemployment Insurance Reauthorization, and Job Creation Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-312, H.R. 4853
    December 22, 2010: Don't Ask, Don't Tell Repeal Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-321, H.R. 2965
    January 2, 2011: James Zadroga 9/11 Health and Compensation Act of 2010, Pub.L. 111-347, H.R. 847
    January 4, 2011: Shark Conservation Act, Pub.L. 111-348, H.R. 81
    January 4, 2011: Food Safety and Modernization Act, Pub.L. 111-353, H.R. 2751

And the 110th for good measure:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/110th_United_States_Congress

Spoiler: 110th Congress passed (click to show/hide)

    February 2, 2007 — House Page Board Revision Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-2, 121 Stat. 4
    May 25, 2007 — U.S. Troop Readiness, Veterans' Care, Katrina Recovery, and Iraq Accountability Appropriations Act, 2007, Pub.L. 110-28, 121 Stat. 112, including Title VIII: Fair Minimum Wage Act of 2007, 121 Stat. 188
    June 14, 2007 — Preserving United States Attorney Independence Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-34, 121 Stat. 224
    July 26, 2007 — Foreign Investment and National Security Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-49, 121 Stat. 246
    August 3, 2007 — Implementing Recommendations of the 9/11 Commission Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-53, 121 Stat. 266
    August 5, 2007 — Protect America Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-55, 121 Stat. 552
    September 14, 2007 — Honest Leadership and Open Government Act, Pub.L. 110-81, 121 Stat. 735
    November 8, 2007 — Water Resources Development Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-114, 121 Stat. 1041 - Veto Overridden
    December 19, 2007 — Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007, Pub.L. 110-140, 121 Stat. 1492
    February 13, 2008 — Economic Stimulus Act of 2008, Pub.L. 110-185, 122 Stat. 613
    May 21, 2008 — Genetic Information Nondiscrimination Act, Pub.L. 110-233, 122 Stat. 881
    May 22, 2008 — Food and Energy Security Act of 2007 (2007 Farm Bill), Pub.L. 110-234, 122 Stat. 923 - Veto Overridden
    June 30, 2008 — Supplemental Appropriations Act of 2008, Pub.L. 110-252, 122 Stat. 2323, including Title V: Post-9/11 Veterans Educational Assistance Act of 2008 ("G.I. Bill 2008")
    July 10, 2008 — FISA Amendments Act of 2008, Pub.L. 110-261, 122 Stat. 2436
    July 29, 2008 — Tom Lantos Block Burmese JADE (Junta's Anti-Democratic Efforts) Act of 2008, Pub.L. 110-286, 122 Stat. 2632
    July 30, 2008 — Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008, Pub.L. 110-289, 122 Stat. 2654

House in Salinas, California under foreclosure, following the bursting of the U.S. real estate bubble.

    October 3, 2008 — Public Law 110-343 (Pub.L. 110-343), 122 Stat. 3765, including:
        Div. A: Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008, H.R. 1424 ;
        Div. B: Energy Improvement and Extension Act of 2008; and
        Div. C: Tax Extenders and Alternative Minimum Tax Relief Act of 2008
    October 15, 2008 — Pub.L. 110-430: Setting the beginning of the first session of the 111th Congress and the date for counting Electoral College votes, 122 Stat. 4846
    December 19, 2008 — Pub.L. 110-455: A Saxbe fix, reducing the compensation and other emoluments attached to the office of Secretary of State to that which was in effect on January 1, 2007: allowing Hillary Clinton to serve as Secretary of State despite the Emoluments Clause of the United States Constitution.

The 111th did pass an impressive amount of legislation compared to previous Senates, so maybe I'm misremembering this one. Although I do recall some dems wanting her to pursue healthcare legislation more aggressively than she did, because the President wanted bi-partisan agreement on it and the Republicans weren't going to give it easily.

I'm sure if I go to the Daily Show archives there's other stuff that made her less than popular that I've forgotten about.

[Aqizzar]

I've seen the same numbers, but I don't know how they're supposed to be added up.  The House of Representatives passes bills all the time, because they have no cloture rules and only need a straight majority to pass anything.  Especially if the government is divided, they get to pass assloads of ridiculous bills secure in the knowledge that none of them will go into effect.  So you're only supposed to count the stuff that gets signed by the President, which includes tons and tons of internal changes and spending measures.  Bear in mind that the Wikipedia list only has actual laws that somebody felt like adding to the page.

As I recall, the numbers were something like 300 bills each passed into law by the 110th and 111th Congresses.  Including this debt ceiling package, Boehner's 112th Congress has in six months passed about 13 things into law.  Note that most conservatives don't consider this a meaningful argument or response of any kind - they will readily and in same breath complain about a "do nothing Congress" (regardless of what it's actually doing) while insisting they want their government to "do" as little as possible.

[nenjin]

http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/02/news/economy/moodys_credit_rating/index.htm?hpt=hp_t1

Moody's et. al affirmed the US's AAA Credit Rating today. They changed their ratings outlook for the US to "negative", signaling the possibility of lowering our rating based on future events or our government's failure in the future to hold to their financial reform plan.

So it's back to business as usual, for now. Markets suffered their worst 8-day losing streak since 2008 because of this, confidence in government is shaken, we as tax payers spent about $2 billion+ on interest rate payments that fluctuated and our credit prospects are less stable than they were before the debt ceiling debate.

God bless America.

[Nadaka]

Plus the FAA is shut down during the congressional holiday costing 25 million a day in uncollected tax revenues.