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[Max White]

Either Jim, Azure or Bd. I want claims from Azure and Bd before figuring this out.

[Leafsnail]

The players do win (like they win if they are killed or RFG'd in any other way).  Toaster who played Devil last time around should be able to confirm it if he asked that question (it seemed like an obvious one to me anyway).

[Max White]

Hmm, because I was thinking. If we lynch Jim, then he has a good chance to flip vampire lord, town wins.
Otherwise, Leaf gives the offer to me, and I use it to kill Azure, the vampire lord is dead, and we win or Bd was the lord, get's sent to hell and we win.
And if somehow Irony was the lord after all, the remaining players lynch him, and we win.


You can swap Jim and Azure around, as well as Irony and myself. If we end up giving Irony the deal and he turns it down, because he is the vampire lord and can't be sent to hell, we lynch him. Same for me, but I know I am town.

[ECrownofFire]

Hey Meph, if the vampire lord dies and there are no third parties remaining, then does the town win or do we have to hunt down the remaining slaves? Anything even remotely related can help.

[Mephansteras]

Town wins when there are no remaining threats.

[ECrownofFire]

Right, so slaves count then...

Max, your plan is horrible. It focuses way too much on getting the lord. There are still two slaves running around and while the first priority is the lord, we can't throw everything we have into getting him and end up losing because of the remaining slaves.

[Max White]

I was under the impression that killing the lord meant the death of the minions. Like it would chain kill all scum bar third parties.
Do we know what happened if the vampire lord was killed in prior games?

[Jim Groovester]

As the Vampire Lord for Supernatural 3, there was no mention that vampire slaves died with the Vampire Lord.

Since this is a closed setup and not a bastard mod, if something like that was going to happen it would've been mentioned in the role PM.

(It would also make for a terrible game; one townie gets a lucky shot off and all of a sudden the game is over.)

Yap yap yap plan plan plan devil devil devil deal deal deal

Right. So nobody else sees the obvious problem of giving scummy players a kill. Even if the plan works flawlessly and everybody does what they're supposed to, the effects range from winning instantly (everybody who took a deal is a vampire or every vampire dies or gets spirited away to hell) to losing instantly (everybody who took a deal is town and town gets shot), and that's too much of a risk. And I doubt the plan would go off without a hitch. There's nothing stopping anyone who takes the kill from just shooting Leafsnail with it, thereby defeating the whole purpose of the plan.

Unvote anyway.

Otherwise, Leaf gives the offer to me, and I use it to kill Azure, the vampire lord is dead, and we win or Bd was the lord, get's sent to hell and we win.

It really makes me want to trust you to see you volunteering to get the kill.

lordnincompoop (or his replacement), Azure Sepulchre, and Bdthemag need to claim, by my count.

[Max White]

Meh, if we only needed to kill the lord, nuking the town would be a pretty good idea. We're giving a kill to players who can only use it if they aren't the one we are after. But if we need to mop up minions as well, I guess that is a bit of collateral. Sorry Leaf, no win for you.

[Leafsnail]

Right. So nobody else sees the obvious problem of giving scummy players a kill. Even if the plan works flawlessly and everybody does what they're supposed to, the effects range from winning instantly (everybody who took a deal is a vampire or every vampire dies or gets spirited away to hell) to losing instantly (everybody who took a deal is town and town gets shot), and that's too much of a risk.

By the same logic, you shouldn't lynch anyone because if every person you lynch is town you lose.  The difference here is that the Vampire Lord doesn't get a conversion after every kill.

And I doubt the plan would go off without a hitch. There's nothing stopping anyone who takes the kill from just shooting Leafsnail with it, thereby defeating the whole purpose of the plan.

...Wha?  They could, but it would be pointless since I'd be gone by that point.

[Max White]

I always forget that part. Unvote.

[Jim Groovester]

Right. So nobody else sees the obvious problem of giving scummy players a kill. Even if the plan works flawlessly and everybody does what they're supposed to, the effects range from winning instantly (everybody who took a deal is a vampire or every vampire dies or gets spirited away to hell) to losing instantly (everybody who took a deal is town and town gets shot), and that's too much of a risk.

By the same logic, you shouldn't lynch anyone because if every person you lynch is town you lose.  The difference here is that the Vampire Lord doesn't get a conversion after every kill.

Sure, let's just take this reasonable assertion and apply a slippery slope argument to it.

And I doubt the plan would go off without a hitch. There's nothing stopping anyone who takes the kill from just shooting Leafsnail with it, thereby defeating the whole purpose of the plan.

...Wha?  They could, but it would be pointless since I'd be gone by that point.

How certain are you that you win before you get killed?

[Toaster]

Max:

Your willing to claim devil from my inspect, but you don't believe I'm a fortune teller?
We can shorten that list by two spots right now by taking off lordnincompoop and myself. If nobody else counter claims, we can clear IronyOwl as well. So that is three people! Looks like I just did your job for you.

This of course assumes you haven't been converted yourself and aren't covering lordbuddy Lord Vampirepoop.


On Devils:  Didn't the taken players lose regardless of alignment?  Leaf, you might want to confirm that with Meph.  Getting taken to hell for eternal damnation doesn't sound like much of a victory to me.  Otherwise, your plan is sound, if risky.

In regards to the devil getting shot, that's exactly what happened to me Super1, except it was after collecting my first soul.  RedWarrior took a kill and shot me with it.  I got the credit for one soul (still a loss), so I'd think taking the kill and shooting Leafsnail would be counterproductive.


Has Azure posted anytime recently?  We probably shouldn't rely on him doing anything.

[lordnincompoop]

I still need a replace, unfortunately. BDthemag also needs a replace, as he has informed me (outside the game) that he has decided to leave the mafia subforum for the time being.

lordnincompoop (or his replacement), Azure Sepulchre, and Bdthemag need to claim, by my count.

Well, I'm about ready to claim, since Max White pretty much outed me.

I'm a Guardian Angel, who wins by ensuring IronyOwl's (formerly Pandarsenic) survival for the remainder of the game. Each night, I may choose to protect said person from nightkills, from inspects (both are complete) or require that the person needs one more vote to be lynched the next day. I'm not sure if irony can confirm this or not.

Seeing as I'm also a third-party, you could probably lynch/NK me too. It wouldn't be very productive, though, seeing as I don't have a dangerous wincon and IronyOwl isn't a dangerous role.

[Leafsnail]

On Devils:  Didn't the taken players lose regardless of alignment?  Leaf, you might want to confirm that with Meph.  Getting taken to hell for eternal damnation doesn't sound like much of a victory to me.

I have confirmed it.  It isn't really any difference to winning of spite of having been brutally murdered.

In regards to the devil getting shot, that's exactly what happened to me Super1, except it was after collecting my first soul.  RedWarrior took a kill and shot me with it.  I got the credit for one soul (still a loss), so I'd think taking the kill and shooting Leafsnail would be counterproductive.

On the other hand, this would be my third soul, triggering my wincon.  I would still win.

I'm a Guardian Angel, who wins by ensuring IronyOwl's (formerly Pandarsenic) survival for the remainder of the game. Each night, I may choose to protect said person from nightkills, from inspects (both are complete) or require that the person needs one more vote to be lynched the next day. I'm not sure if irony can confirm this or not.

This isn't a full claim.  You haven't said what you chose to do each night.