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[lordnincompoop]

Can we please get another or a longer extension? 16 hours from now is so not enough.

You can extend again all the way into Monday if you want.

Beyond that, however, I'm more hesitant. I'd rather the game start progressing, seeing as we've had D1 for the better part of a week now.

LNCP: Dariush is voting for me, not Urist.

Noted and corrected.

[Dariush]

I would expect a power role to be less worried about constantly fitting in than the scum, and so refuse to give info, rather then lie to look like town.

Power role should be worried about not revealing that it's a power role. Thus lying.

Is this your revenge for the last two times I had something to do with your lynching Dariush?

Nope.

[Simple]

To pretty much force a mislynch. It will be a dumb theory if we don't get any reply, and Panda is lynch, and especially if he flips scum, and if so, no harm done, but it couldn't hurt to try.

If he's scum it would be harmful...

What sort of power do you think requires knowing someone's name to use?

Basically what urist said , getting some power over someone trough their name is pretty popular dark magic theme and while i don't expect this to be Death Note mafia something like role reveal or roleblock are sensibly powerful to be gained this way (which basically requires victim help). Besides that names are completely useless unless they are references so revealing them would bring no benefit to the town.

Thank you, Urist. I am familiar with this, but I wanted to ask Simple what he thought might be a Witch's role that required a name to use--how the idea might be engineered to fit into the game.

You mean what Witch role ? Oooh That's interesting! I never know the witches have many different roles! Is there something else that you know about them Flandre ?

TL:DR That would be a drastic and scary change, with unpredictable impact on balance, and I as a player wouldn't like it.

While we're on the topic, Simple, why the continued interest in specific flavor details?  I find it odd because you were critical of Max's constant theorizing, yet are doing some similar things yourself.  It's odd, contradictory behavior to me.

Would you reveal flavor-inspect result to the town ? I don't like bringing theories from nowhere that are used as a evidence of someone scuminess, bringing up theories about game mechanics or scum powers is fine if it does not interfere with scumhunt. And if i find some flavor to be non consistent it's rather obvious i will be interested in it.

I would expect a power role to be less worried about constantly fitting in than the scum, and so refuse to give info, rather then lie to look like town.

Is this your revenge for the last two times I had something to do with your lynching Dariush?

So power roles are more suspicious to you than scum and you believe you would find power role first ?

[Max White]

Because, as your being up for lynch D1 of every game shows, you need to clean up your playstyle.

I was trying to be a little more laid back in this game too, maybe have some fun trying to figure out what clues meant with others while scum try to be misleading about their interpritations. Well, these things happen. You get lynched until you learn how to play, and I wouldn't have it any other way. No Org sheilds, even for me.

If I do end up being lynched, however, I have a request for all of you.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

PLAY THE FUCKING GAME!!!!

Because seriously, having a bunch of lurkers easily lynching the most active player doesn't set a very good premise.

If he's scum it would be harmful...

If he was scum he would need to show up and explain himself or suffer a lynch.

So power roles are more suspicious to you than scum and you believe you would find power role first ?

Power roles, or at least town ones, are looking for scum. Scum, on the other hand, are trying to hide. Making an attempt to lie about your flavour is trying to fit into the town through deceit.

[Pandarsenic]

Max, the problem is that your attempt to "scumhunt" means that if the town has anything more useful than a townie you want them to lay their heads on the chopping block in the name of "not lying."

Do you really not see how this is a problem?

LNCP: Monday should be fine.

[Max White]

Not really. How many people have claimed that much? Not many, or at least not enough to find any power roles through process of elimination. But the fact that somebody was willing to claim they had given all there role info, then when I pointed out that what they had given they, they suddenly had all this information, and apparently a lot more.

It isn't about how much somebody gives or doesn't give, it is about how much somebody will chance their stance to try and fit into the town.

[IronyOwl]

IronyOwl, I'll grant you that Max White has been very odd this game, but tons of scumhunting isn't really something anybody has a definitive claim to so far. Why are you holding Max White accountable for it?

Most people have been waffling around a bit, or poking at flavor while poking less at scumhunting. Max is being very active and focused, but it's in a mostly useless series of directions. If most people are lurking, he's activelurking.

Max, you've done zero scumhunting but are going to town with wild theories based on flavor. Do you really think who's scum has been written into the opening posts and whatever role PMs they choose to share like that?

Now I have to point out a distinction here. I haven't been going off flavour as in 'Oh look, the victim has a stab wound in he's right side, and X said they were left handed, so it was them!', but rather I have shown a reason that a scum player would lie about their flavour (Because if they just told us all they were a witch they would be lynched) and pointed out that Urist was the most likely to have lied about he's flavour.
Do you see the difference?

You've pointed out that, assuming role PMs work like you've assumed they do, Urist is the closest match among people who responded at all. That's not as specific as something about books or what have you, but it shares a vital assumption, a sort of "must be one of them" approach, and a lack of any real way to go any further with it.

I mean, look at what you're doing with him now. Are you voting to pressure him, or lynch him? If it's pressure, pressure for what? What's he going to say that means he isn't scum anymore? If it's to lynch him, you'll be doing so solely because his role PM claim was too short. That doesn't seem incredibly weak to you?

Here's a question: Why does it matter? Unless we're swimming in cops also, I really don't see this being a big enough deal to focus a lot of time and energy on.

Why wouldn't it matter? Until we have some more to go off, everything matters.

For one thing, we're not talking about some offhand comment or idle speculation- this has been a major, major point of interest to you, including thinking way ahead to when we've got a lot of bodies to examine for it.

Secondly, your approach, as I've mentioned, does not seem conducive to getting more to go off.

And here. You're claiming to be encouraging everyone to play, but not doing it yourself. Why is that? You're not even throwing up a crackpot theory with it, you're just spouting pro-town jargon.

I would like for people to be a little more active, yourself included. No really, do you think you have done enough to say anybody else isn't playing? Hell, Panda has had a greater impact on the game so far! This wasn't just standard 'Go team!' dribble, this was 'Get your ass into gear and do something!'

I wouldn't really call getting attention for lurking but not dying "a greater impact," or at least not in a way I'm supposed to be ashamed of. Yes, I've been lurky, but I've been trying to do stuff while I have been here- a lot of more frequent posters, yourself included, haven't been much more productive for it.

On that note, it doesn't matter what flavor the dribble was supposed to be, because it still wasn't led by example. Unless you meant "Everyone get off your asses and make wild speculation!"

Sorry, nope. The game is about flavour, and I used that for finding scum.
*Sigh*

Do you think you succeeded?

That makes four, so that must mean at least one townie is voting for me, assuming there are three scum. Why do I get the feeling I'm up for lynch today?

Prior to that, what did you think the odds were that all three of your voters were scum?

It isn't about how much somebody gives or doesn't give, it is about how much somebody will chance their stance to try and fit into the town.

If this is the real reason, why is this the first time it's been mentioned?

[Max White]

You know what, fuck that, why are we lynching one of the only two people trying to enjoy this game?
It says on the front page that flavour text counts, and it is good to read it, so why not use it? Why are you all so scared to do something fun and try and figure things out from the flavour? Vector and myself are the only two who seem to get this game and are trying to get in on it's quirks, and some of you are making a scare tactic of it.

Enjoy playing a unique game the exact same way you play every other game, with nothing new, even when it is spoon fed to you. LNCP takes the effort to put clues in the flavour, and you decide it is worthless. It's like playing against bots.

PPE:

You've pointed out that, assuming role PMs work like you've assumed they do, Urist is the closest match among people who responded at all. That's not as specific as something about books or what have you, but it shares a vital assumption, a sort of "must be one of them" approach, and a lack of any real way to go any further with it.

I mean, look at what you're doing with him now. Are you voting to pressure him, or lynch him? If it's pressure, pressure for what? What's he going to say that means he isn't scum anymore? If it's to lynch him, you'll be doing so solely because his role PM claim was too short. That doesn't seem incredibly weak to you?

You didn't read what I said, did you? Not because he's role was too short, because he constantly changed he's stance to try and look like town. He bent over backwards contradicting himself to give me what he thought I wanted.

You've pointed out that, assuming role PMs work like you've assumed they do, Urist is the closest match among people who responded at all. That's not as specific as something about books or what have you, but it shares a vital assumption, a sort of "must be one of them" approach, and a lack of any real way to go any further with it.

I mean, look at what you're doing with him now. Are you voting to pressure him, or lynch him? If it's pressure, pressure for what? What's he going to say that means he isn't scum anymore? If it's to lynch him, you'll be doing so solely because his role PM claim was too short. That doesn't seem incredibly weak to you?

For one thing, we're not talking about some offhand comment or idle speculation- this has been a major, major point of interest to you, including thinking way ahead to when we've got a lot of bodies to examine for it.

Secondly, your approach, as I've mentioned, does not seem conducive to getting more to go off.

If I'm speculating as to what to do when we have more bodies, why does it matter until we have the bodies? It isn't a point of interest until it is confirmed. It depends on getting more to go off, more millers.

I wouldn't really call getting attention for lurking but not dying "a greater impact," or at least not in a way I'm supposed to be ashamed of. Yes, I've been lurky, but I've been trying to do stuff while I have been here- a lot of more frequent posters, yourself included, haven't been much more productive for it.

On that note, it doesn't matter what flavor the dribble was supposed to be, because it still wasn't led by example. Unless you meant "Everyone get off your asses and make wild speculation!"

My speculation is still more than your seven posts. Hell, even without the speculation I have more than you.

Do you think you succeeded?

Yes.

Prior to that, what did you think the odds were that all three of your voters were scum?

Not likely, Think seemed to be the most likely for mirroring your argument, and looking for a new lynch the very second Panda shows up.

If this is the real reason, why is this the first time it's been mentioned?

You really haven't read the thread, have you? Try to keep up, if you can;t contribute, you should make an effort to know what others have done.

I do a little. At first he insists that there is nothing more to he's role, but then when I point out a lack of detail he decides to inform us of the most interesting thing any bodies role has given yet, and then decides to keep quiet but insist he's role has all sorts of interesting things that he isn't telling us about.

If a player thinks it is best to keep flavour to themselves, well so be it, but Urist has been inconsistent with he's stance, and seemed to bend every time there was a little pressure on him.

There you have it. I have been there, done that.

[Pandarsenic]

Flavor to find scum: S'awwwriiight.
Flavor to find town power roles: lolwat? No. Just no.

[Max White]

So you want flavour for your scum hunting, but you don't want anybody to give it out? I'm not looking for power roles, and I don't think from what I have produced you can find them.

[Toaster]

LNCP:  At the time of that vote count, I was voting Pandar.  Not any more, though.

Unvote Pandar.

Max:

You know what, fuck that, why are we lynching one of the only two people trying to enjoy this game?
It says on the front page that flavour text counts, and it is good to read it, so why not use it? Why are you all so scared to do something fun and try and figure things out from the flavour? Vector and myself are the only two who seem to get this game and are trying to get in on it's quirks, and some of you are making a scare tactic of it.

This is you breaking, and I'm hard pressed to say it's you breaking town.

So you want flavour for your scum hunting, but you don't want anybody to give it out? I'm not looking for power roles, and I don't think from what I have produced you can find them.

What exactly are you looking for?  Scum?  I don't see how you intend to find it, even having read your posts.  Why are you not performing traditional scum-hunting while going about your flavor methods?

I would expect a power role to be less worried about constantly fitting in than the scum, and so refuse to give info, rather then lie to look like town.

Is this your revenge for the last two times I had something to do with your lynching Dariush?

Both refusing to provide info and lying are anti-town behaviors.  Would you force a PR to do either to avoid giving himself away?


Pandar:

Pandar:  If you were scum, which person here would you most fear as scum?  What about the reverse?

... Wut? If I was scum, I would most fear some derpist being scum because they might give me away... I guess? This question doesn't really make sense to me.

...Oops.  That was supposed to be town for the second scum.


Vector:  Have you found anything yet?


Ottofar:  Where did you go?  You haven't said anything for three days.

[lordnincompoop]

LNCP:  At the time of that vote count, I was voting Pandar.  Not any more, though.

Hnargh

[Toaster]

Pandar, not Dariush.

[Ottofar]

Unvote Pandar

I haven't posted due to having no real leads. And because I scumhunt terribadly. I'm usually better at knowing who's the scum.

I'm a bit in a hurry, but Simple seems scummy enough to vote.

[Max White]

This is you breaking, and I'm hard pressed to say it's you breaking town.

It is me annoyed because everybody was willing to just ride the Panda lynch to the days end, until he turns up, then decide to vote for the only person trying to do anything.
Jim is right, this is the most unproductive day ever because everybody is doing everything that can to do nothing. Even if every crazy idea I ever have is wrong, it is better than nothing.

What exactly are you looking for?  Scum?  I don't see how you intend to find it, even having read your posts.  Why are you not performing traditional scum-hunting while going about your flavor methods?

Why be traditional? Scum expect traditional, thus it is less effective. The more well known something is, the less effective it is, because people know how to react. Traditional is an excuse for not thinking.

Both refusing to provide info and lying are anti-town behaviors.  Would you force a PR to do either to avoid giving himself away?

You know that thing about reading the thread? You too.
I would force nothing. A power role could even lie about their flavour if they wanted, but I would not expect them to change their minds when I point out something scummy about their story.