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A) Open Warfare: Shoot them as soon as we can.

15 (48.4%)

B) Cold War: Establish borders, and try to out-grow them.

16 (51.6%)

C) No War: Let's share the solar system.... For now.

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 31

[a1s]

Hell, with sufficient missile tech upgrade, we could build mega-missiles with the range to strike from Titan directly to Mercury. Think super-ICBMs.

So yeah...investments in detection and AMS is worthwhile.

Or build mini-missiles.

Operation 1000 cuts:
We make them short range (5-10 Mkm, thus some 2-5% of mass) and do 2 points of damage (50-66% mass, depending on tech). We outfit gunboats with lots of small (box, or 100x) size 1 launchers*, then we get close enough to launch them, and send mercury into the stone age (because, come on, no matter what defenses the infidels have, they can't shoot down several hundred missiles). If we manage to do 2-2.5k damage- mercury will pretty much go extinct overnight, but even if it's only 500, their industry will be deceased by 10% basically forever.

The defense against a similar attack from them is a very powerful early detection system (we need to detect 500 ton ships 10Mkm away).

*Think about it: a 1000 ton vessel can carry 50 M100s, so if we rush small launchers and throw most of our yards into building these, we could have a strike-force with over 1k missiles by year 4.

[Bremen]

We sent a message last turn, lets wait and see their response this year.

As for a gunboat launch on Mercury, don't forget passive sensors. Our Hufufs have a thermal signature of 63, so even a single deep space tracking station with basic tech would detect them at 15.75 million km. That could be reduced by a low speed approach, but that can only help so much.

Which goes back to what I've been saying; deep space tracking stations are going to be the key to controlling the system. If we can see their fleet on passives, we can have our ships run silent and launch a sneak attack (particularly lethal if we go with missile armed gunboats). With 6 stations, we'd be able to detect one of our freighters in orbit of Mercury, which would be great for determining where the infidels are colonizing and why. With 10-11, we could see the equivalent of our carrier. And those are just offensive uses; imagine the defensive advantages of seeing the enemy coming weeks in advance.

[Daltesh]

I signed up just for this thread, so feel special, Sheb. After having just finished reading Bremen's LP I'm glad to see someone running a Multiplayer Aurora. It can be quite a fun game, even more so when you aren't the one having to play it.

After writing up a rather extensive ramble on just why we should all do what I say, I decided to condense my suggestions down to the following orders:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Space Orders:
People seem to have a good idea of what's going on here. Keep our forces around Titan, send surveyors off to survey. I also recommend against sending any gunboats to scout Mercury: Our Hufuf (Attack FAC) doesn't have a sensor and our Mersin (scout FAC) is in limited supply and can't be easily replaced without retooling and curbing Hufuf production.
Industrial Orders:
We have 240 mines to 120 construction factories, so we should really focus on making more construction factories.
Assign 90% of industry to Construction Factories, and 10% to Deep Space Tracking Stations.
Research Orders:
Stop researching Jump Theory. Now. What do you guys want to do, flee the holy land and leave it to the heathens?
Allocate 35 labs to our C/P scientist and finish Research Rate 280, then Construction Rate 12. Once that is finished assign our C/P scientist to Gas Powered Reactor, and if it finishes before the turn is out start research on Ion Drives.
Assign the five free labs to research Planetary Sensor Strength 300 with best available scientist.

Since this is really looking to be a knife fight, and we're unlikely to spend too much time at peace (how boring would that be?) I really don't see the need to research Jump Theory. It's a very long term investment that isn't too big of a deal unless we start running low on minerals. If we're lucky the other side might even build jump gates that we could use.

That said, I'm definitely looking forward to see how this progresses!

[Boksi]

We're not abandoning the Holy Land, we're just finding more of it!

There are some reasons for researching jump point theory. First off, Titan is a rather crappy place to live. Secondly, and more importantly, it's far easier to defend a jump point than a colony, especially since our main armament will be mesons which will cripple even heavily armored ships.

[Bremen]

Yes, I am totally against abandoning the search for jump points. If nothing else, if this were just an LP of a war it would be over really quick.

And if anything, the holy land is Earth; we have no real reason to want Mercury.

Edit: Lastly, I think that deciding to dedicate us to total war and then not researching weapons is a bad idea.

[Daltesh]

My point is more that spending 25% of our research on stuff that won't actually help us for five years or so, when we might be invaded next year, isn't that great of an idea to me. I don't encourage total war though, since we don't really have any feasible way to keep mercury even if we capture it right now. Their combined fleet and PDC defences could likely cause a nice dent in our fleet (or wipe it out if they have missiles) while it's a safe bet they have around as many troops as we do.

Instead I'd propose a strategy of interdiction and fixed defense. The enemy likely has a much higher concentration of resources in the inner system barring SM modifications, and our gunboats are admittedly disposable. We could feasibly send groups of 9 or so hufuf and one mersin to the inner system just to harass any shipping they might have, while still (hopefully) being able to detect and retreat from the enemy fleet should they approach. And as for fixed defense, since we have mesons our PDCs are automatically awesome. We should get more.

...Of course that all assumes open hostilities. I assumed from the back story and tech choice that Sheb would like us to try and get stabby pretty quick. Plus since we're playing against humans it's entirely possible for us to get in over our heads and offer a peace settlement... and then back stab them.

[Boksi]

Yeah, we're kind of assuming it's a mutually cold war right now. And you know why it's cold? Because we don't know what the other faction can do and therefore it's quite possible that they can annihilate us, even if we annihilate them as well. Mutually Assured Destruction. The sooner we explore other systems, the sooner we can have a stronghold, a fallback position.

[a1s]

Yeah, we're kind of assuming it's a mutually cold war right now. And you know why it's cold? Because we don't know what the other faction can do and therefore it's quite possible that they can annihilate us, even if we annihilate them as well. Mutually Assured Destruction. The sooner we explore other systems, the sooner we can have a stronghold, a fallback position.

That seems to point to 2 things:
a)We need more sensors if we are to know the infidels' actions
b)We need more nukes or it will be a Unilaterally Assured Destruction instead.

Jump points can take a back seat, as long as we keep the Lagrange belt (or whatever it's called in our universe) free of Christians.

P.S. Did we recieve a message from the heathens last turn? I can't seem to find it.

[Bremen]

Yeah, we're kind of assuming it's a mutually cold war right now. And you know why it's cold? Because we don't know what the other faction can do and therefore it's quite possible that they can annihilate us, even if we annihilate them as well. Mutually Assured Destruction. The sooner we explore other systems, the sooner we can have a stronghold, a fallback position.

That seems to point to 2 things:
a)We need more sensors if we are to know the infidels' actions
b)We need more nukes or it will be a Unilaterally Assured Destruction instead.

Jump points can take a back seat, as long as we keep the Lagrange belt (or whatever it's called in our universe) free of Christians.

P.S. Did we recieve a message from the heathens last turn? I can't seem to find it.

No message as far as I can tell, though if they received ours they may send something this turn.

The problem is, we didn't start with any missile tech, or any missile scientists. So developing the tech is a long term goal. Meanwhile we can keep producing Hufufs to ensure we have military forces if attacked.

Even if they beat us to missile armed ships, it will take time to produce and equip them. If they started with missile tech we're probably screwed if they attack us, but we were probably screwed from the beginning; missiles are king in Aurora, and we didn't start with any practical PD. Meanwhile we're building construction factories and developing faster construction with our best scientist, as soon as we develop good missile tech we can begin production of missile and antimissile PDCs at a high rate. Our current strategy isn't to run away with our tail between our legs, but to ensure that when a war does happen we have the advantageous position. As the Sun-Tzu quote goes, "Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win."

Orders:
Space Orders:
When the new Mosul finishes it should join its friend in surveying the Oort Cloud. If an infidel ship approaches Saturn it should be first warned off and then destroyed by Hufufs with sensor support.
Industrial Orders:
Assign 80% of industry to Construction Factories, and 20% to 4 Deep Space Tracking Stations. (This should ensure we finish one during the year)
Research Orders:
Continue current projects. Once Research Rate 280 finishes, research construction rate 12, mining rate 12, construction rate 14, then work on Magazine Ejection system 70% chance, Magazine Feed System Efficiency 75%, Gun-type fission warhead (strength 2), then improved missile drives up to nuclear pulse. If all that finishes, work on Mining Rate 14.
Our other scientist should work on Jump point theory and then gravitational sensors. If he finishes that, Planetary Sensor Strength 300.
Other Orders:
If we finish grav sensors develop a Grav survey version of the Mosul and build one. This will be a military ship, so add engineering spaces as needed.

[MonkeyHead]

Posting to follow.

[a1s]

The problem is, we didn't start with any missile tech, or any missile scientists.

Neither did we stat with any Propulsion talent. Suleiman can continue with his pet project if he wants, but he should do his professional duty first- we can build better attack crafts if we have miniaturized components. Failing that, we should allocate the full 35 labs to Al-Azred, and Suleiman can have leftovers to pursue these "jumpgates" of his.
Also seeing as how we are losing 75% (well actually only 37.5%, if you count from the top) of RP when Al-Azred is not researching CP, so he should research the bare minimum towards giving us a prototype missile.

Orders:
Space Orders:
When the new Mosul finishes it should join its friend in surveying the Oort Cloud. If an infidel ship approaches Saturn it should be first warned off and then destroyed by Hufufs with sensor support.
Industrial Orders:
Assign 63% of industry to Construction Factories, and 37% to 4 Deep Space Tracking Stations. (This should ensure we finish two during the year)
Research Orders:
Continue current projects. Once Research Rate 280 finishes, research construction rate 12, mining rate 12, construction rate 14, then work on Gun-type fission warhead (strength 2), then improved missile drives up to nuclear pulse, If all that finishes, work on Mining Rate 14.
Our other scientist should work on small crew quarters, and fuel storage, then work on launchers
Other Orders:
If we finish grav sensors develop a Grav survey version of the Mosul and build one. This will be a military ship, so add engineering spaces as needed.

[Bremen]

I'm not going to play tug of war with the orders, but is there a reason everyone is so opposed to jump tech? Do you really want the game to be over in 5 updates?

Also, box launchers are a huge RP sink, so I think if we switch to a missile based force gunboats are going to be obsolete for awhile.

[Ehndras]

What is an Oort Cloud, anyway? I used to know but for some reason I'm drawing a complete blank. Something gravitational I think. *shrug*

What's the point of checking out the Oort Cloud in-game?

[a1s]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oort_cloud .

he Oort cloud is a hypothesized spherical cloud of comets which may lie roughly 50,000 AU, or nearly a light-year, from the Sun.

Actually I think it refers to the outer asteroid belt in this case.

Do you really want the game to be over in 5 updates?

We won't even have explored 1 extra-solar system by turn 5. And the game will be over quickly if we will neglect defense of the realm.

Also, I'm not sure of the utility of this (it would currently take over a year at 100% production), but if we lack the required specialists, we might want to build an academy and hope for a sensor/propulsion expert?

[Bremen]

Do you really want the game to be over in 5 updates?

We won't even have explored 1 extra-solar system by turn 5. And the game will be over quickly if we will neglect defense of the realm.

That's kind of my point. If we focus on expanding outward while conducting a cold or limited war, the LP will last. If we focus on military buildup, the game will be over within 5 turns when one of us nukes the other.

"Defense of the realm" is a nice concept, but it's not going to happen if we're both in the same system. If a war happens with missile armed ships, one or both planets are going to die.