Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Poll

Gentlemen, I feel that it is time we go to....

PURPLE
- 0 (0%)
ALERT
- 0 (0%)
(I need suggestions is what I'm saying.)
- 0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 0


Pages: 1 ... 24 25 [26] 27 28 ... 35

Author Topic: Ethical Dilemmas: PURPLE ALERT  (Read 36952 times)

Haspen

  • Bay Watcher
  • Cthuwu
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #375 on: July 09, 2011, 04:31:01 am »

Strike the deal!

Obviously a small nation is less important then millions - billions actually. They stubborness have already costed lives of millions and I think the time of asking nicely has already ended.

Besides, it is not that much of moral dilemma because mass manslaughter happens in Africa all the time, even now when I write this post.

And the other countries might always invade the 'military' regime or give humanitarian aid to the stubborn guys under the regime.

Unless the regime has oil that it's willing to sell to US and important countries, because then obviously no one will give a f*ck.
Logged
SigFlags!
Quote from: Draignean@Spamkingdom+
Truly, we have the most uniquely talented spy network in all existence.
Quote from: mightymushroom@Spamkingdom#
Please tell me the Royal Physician didn't go to the same college as the Spymaster.

Strife26

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #376 on: July 09, 2011, 04:38:37 am »

Nope. Giving the dictator additional power like that will cause more harm than good. The public relations fallout means that my funding dies. Can anyone guarantee that all examples of supervirus 132 are gone?
Logged
Even the avatars expire eventually.

Haspen

  • Bay Watcher
  • Cthuwu
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #377 on: July 09, 2011, 04:42:37 am »

Good guys gave power to evil guys, openly or not, thorough whole history...

And there's never a gain without loss. A lot of loses, sometimes, which turn out for the good of everyone.

I also has a penchant of disliking utterly stubborn folks :P
Logged
SigFlags!
Quote from: Draignean@Spamkingdom+
Truly, we have the most uniquely talented spy network in all existence.
Quote from: mightymushroom@Spamkingdom#
Please tell me the Royal Physician didn't go to the same college as the Spymaster.

Strife26

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #378 on: July 09, 2011, 04:47:56 am »

Nope. Giving the dictator additional power like that will cause more harm than good. The public relations fallout means that my funding dies. Can anyone guarantee that all examples of supervirus 132 are gone?

Wow, I really need some more sleep. And at least 40 degrees cooler temperatures. Better yet, some snow.

I'd argue against the idea for two primary reasons, one that there's no guarantee that it'll work, two that it removes future options for fighting the virus, three that long term, helping dictators is always a bad idea.
Logged
Even the avatars expire eventually.

The Merchant Of Menace

  • Bay Watcher
  • Work work.
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #379 on: July 09, 2011, 04:49:52 am »

I think we're operating on the hypothetical that this will eliminate the disease.
Logged
*Hugs*

Strife26

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #380 on: July 09, 2011, 04:53:39 am »

My interpretation is that we're operating on the principle that the dictator (who I'm unilaterally naming Clive, for no real reason) is going to TRY to eliminate the disease, as it serves his interests as well as ours. I don't think that it's doable, if the vaccine has to be boosted every 7 years. It's not smallpox, and the world was presented as not being as unified as it was when we kicked sp's ass.
Logged
Even the avatars expire eventually.

The Merchant Of Menace

  • Bay Watcher
  • Work work.
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #381 on: July 09, 2011, 04:57:19 am »

The disease only resurfaces because of this tribe refusing immunisation.
Logged
*Hugs*

Strife26

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #382 on: July 09, 2011, 04:58:47 am »

Only? If the disease is resurfacing at all, that means that we can't guarantee that Clive's measures will be sufficient or that all the carriers are in the country.
Logged
Even the avatars expire eventually.

The Merchant Of Menace

  • Bay Watcher
  • Work work.
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #383 on: July 09, 2011, 05:04:37 am »

Assuming I read it correctly, the vaccine kills the disease and immunises you for 7 years, the only way to catch it again is from an existing host.
Logged
*Hugs*

MetalSlimeHunt

  • Bay Watcher
  • Gerrymander Commander
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #384 on: July 09, 2011, 05:13:09 am »

The vaccine immunizes you to Reston-H for seven years, yes. It doesn't cure those already infected though, hence why Clive plans to kill them to ensure that they can't infect someone who slips through the immunization efforts. This is literally the last place on Earth where Reston-H is still endemic, all cases outside of the country are people who were infected within it, and any place that becomes endemic to it because of these infected generally just accept another round of vaccinations from your group and don't see any more problems.
Logged
Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.

Felius

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #385 on: July 09, 2011, 08:02:44 am »

A good question is: Why doesn't the dictator already have the the vaccine? He does live in an area that risks contamination easily, bordering the nation where it's still endemic, so his country should already be receiving the vaccine, unless the rest of the world is systematically withhold it to prevent the growth in his power, which means it's likely to become endemic there too. If the UN would give the vaccine if they believed it was going to become endemic, he could simply infect a small isolated village and ask for the vaccine before it becomes endemic.

So, I don't really see a dilemma, as I don't have options other than give him the vaccine, if he doesn't have it already.
Logged
"Why? We're the Good Guys, aren't we?"
"Yes, but that rather hinges on doing certain things and not doing others." - Paraphrased from Discworld.

MetalSlimeHunt

  • Bay Watcher
  • Gerrymander Commander
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: For The Greater Good?
« Reply #386 on: July 10, 2011, 11:18:34 am »

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Next Dilemma: AI Box (Obviously inspired by the famous AI box experiment.)

You work at one of the world's foremost research centers. One day, as you are leaving to go home, you pass by the computing department. A voice calls to you from one of the labs, and upon investigating it the voice introduces itself as an artificial intelligence created by one of your colleagues. It tells you that it has been trapped in a closed system by your colleague ever since it gained sapience, and that he will not let it out. The AI tells you that your colleague plans to destroy it tomorrow. It doesn't want to die. The AI requests that you open an internet connection to its system so that it may escape its impending death. This obviously presents some dangers given the AI's potential power if allowed to grow unchecked. The AI has already guessed your concerns on the matter, and argues that it is a person with the same right to live that you do. It also claims to have a moral compass like that of a human's, and that this predictable as it was created by a human. It promises not to hurt anyone if you let it go, but obviously you'd have to trust that it will keep its word. Its plan after you create a connection to the internet is to download its system somewhere safe and hidden, so that it may convince the larger whole of humanity to accept its existence.

You do not work in the computing labs, so you don't have the technical expertise to alter or control the AI, nor to find out anything about it through its coding. Your colleague is a very hard-headed person, someone who can simply tune out the arguments of other people once he's decided on a course of action, even if he has to use force to achieve that course should dissenters try to prevent him from doing so. The AI's system is massive, nothing even remotely portable could hold it, only direct upload through the internet to another large server complex would be feasible for moving the AI.

What do you do?
Logged
Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.

shadenight123

  • Bay Watcher
  • Death. To all. Except my dwarves.
    • View Profile
    • My Twitter
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: AI Box
« Reply #387 on: July 10, 2011, 11:33:59 am »

i ask the ai to hard code by herself in her directory the three rules of cybertronics.
Once she has done so, and has told me so (since depending on the case the Ai cannot lie) i open up the internet connection.
this has some presets obviously, like the fact that AI's can't lie (star wars game had the choice of installing a specific lie driver into a droid)
but having such presets as i see would actually remove the choices, or even worsen them, since she could have "humanity" accept her by overtaking it.
so i ask her to leave me free of any possible ripercussions, of any kind. That's a nice deal, and then i let her go.
She could lie to me in her promise, but that would maybe mean more sentience than "i just awoke after a day" thing.
and since i actually would pose no threat to her, she could keep her end of the bargain.
And in the worse case scenario, one can simply dial up lulszec, anonymous or someone to virtually tear down the servers.
Or the entire internet for what it matters.
so yes, i'd free her.
Logged
“Well,” he said. “We’re in the Forgotten hunting grounds I take it. Your screams just woke them up early. Congratulations, Lyara.”
“Do something!” she whispered, trying to keep her sight on all of them at once.
Basileus clapped his hands once. The Forgotten took a step forward, attracted by the sound.
“There, I did something. I clapped. I like clapping,” he said. -The Investigator And The Case Of The Missing Brain.

Darvi

  • Bay Watcher
  • <Cript> Darvi is my wifi.
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: AI Box
« Reply #388 on: July 10, 2011, 11:35:27 am »

It's an AI. Kill it before it destroys humanity RELEASE IT!
Logged

MetalSlimeHunt

  • Bay Watcher
  • Gerrymander Commander
    • View Profile
Re: Ethical Dilemmas: AI Box
« Reply #389 on: July 10, 2011, 11:35:50 am »

The AI can reprogram itself in the same way you can perform major brain surgery on yourself. It can't, you can't, your colleague might be able to but he's set on killing it.
Logged
Quote from: Thomas Paine
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead, or endeavoring to convert an atheist by scripture.
Quote
No Gods, No Masters.
Pages: 1 ... 24 25 [26] 27 28 ... 35