Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[SmokedRWA]

I'm assuming that that is the appropriate nomenclature for this particular trap.

Anyways I'm working on building a Moria-esque style bridge that ramps downwards towards my fort and I wanted to incorporate a dodge-fall trap into the bridge for sieges. Currently I don't think I want the fall to kill all of them but I do want it to horribly cripple most of them and then have some sort of horrible beastie (or megabeastie) finish them off. What is the appropriate height to maim/cripple and sometimes kill gobbos and orcs? Does the type/size of the creature have any sort of impact on the damage it takes from a fall?

[Angel Of Death]

I believe about 6 or 7 levels should be a large enough fall to maim them, sometimes even kill them.

[Girlinhat]

Size is the factor of damage from falls.  Crundles are nigh-immune, while a giant will likely die from 2 level falls.  Preferred dodging material is wood, particularly featherwood spears but any will suffice.  Large Silver Disks are also a good choice, as they don't cut very well and still cause 3 hits per item.  Repeating spikes may be preferred because they never jam up.

For goblins, 4-5 is considered the lethal limit, 20 is usually an available overkill, 10 if you don't mind the extremely rare survivor.  I'd go for 4, with military stationed on bottom.  Keep in mind that enemies can fall onto an upright spike trap.

Also, it's generally called a Dodge-Me Trap, but names aren't that important.

[Psieye]

For goblins, ~4 z-levels should leave most crippled though you'll get the rare unlucky guy who dies to head concussion.

[Carnes]

I'm a big fan of dodge traps.  The only thing you have to worry about with a deep pit is breaching the caverns.  I usually shoot for 10 or more z-level drops.  But even still there will be survivors.  Oh, another thing you have to worry about.  Do not send melee dwarves across your dodge-bridge if there are targets on or near it.  Your guys will dodge their attacks and fall to their deaths.  Use Xbows to clear out wounded targets.

[khearn]

Also be aware that a falling goblin (or anything else) that lands on a living creature is only stunned, not damaged at all. So if a bunch of them come running across, the early ones will hit the ground and break bones, but the second wave may land on the survivors of the first wave and end up unharmed, just stunned for a few moments. So be prepared for some fully functional goblins down there.

[612DwarfAvenue]

Also be aware that a falling goblin (or anything else) that lands on a living creature is only stunned, not damaged at all. So if a bunch of them come running across, the early ones will hit the ground and break bones, but the second wave may land on the survivors of the first wave and end up unharmed, just stunned for a few moments. So be prepared for some fully functional goblins down there.

Put lots of Weapon Traps down the bottom, to deal with those early ones.

[khearn]

Just make it deep enough to kill 'em all and there won't be anyone alive to land on. Plus, they splash nicely. I had a 10 z-level deep trap that seemed to be 100% effective. Every goblin or troll (or dwarf  ) that fell in it was smashed into a torso, a head, two arms and two legs. It was interesting watching it in slow motion and seeing heads, arms & legs fly up 3 or so z-levels above the bottom of the pit after impact. 

Just make sure you lock the access door so you don't have dwarves streaming in to collect bits and pieces (and socks!!!) from the first wave when the second wave is landing, or they'll make wonderful cushions for the second wave to land safely upon.

Also put a refuse pile nearby, because there will be a lot of trips to carry all those bits and pieces away.

[Girlinhat]

As OP said, he wants some survivors.  Likely for caging and training, perhaps for zoos.  Doesn't matter, we need a nearly-lethal trap.

[Deus Machina]

I'm now a fan of 2 or 3 z-level drops with military stationed enarby. Great training!

I think my next fortress will have a 2 or 3 level drop, with small pits on level lower scattered in,for more free training. Pit and concuss gobbos in one step!

[Akura]

Also be aware that a falling goblin (or anything else) that lands on a living creature is only stunned, not damaged at all. So if a bunch of them come running across, the early ones will hit the ground and break bones, but the second wave may land on the survivors of the first wave and end up unharmed, just stunned for a few moments. So be prepared for some fully functional goblins down there.

Put lots of Weapon Traps down the bottom, to deal with those early ones.

Upright spikes work, too. And don't even need mechanisms!

[612DwarfAvenue]

Also be aware that a falling goblin (or anything else) that lands on a living creature is only stunned, not damaged at all. So if a bunch of them come running across, the early ones will hit the ground and break bones, but the second wave may land on the survivors of the first wave and end up unharmed, just stunned for a few moments. So be prepared for some fully functional goblins down there.

Put lots of Weapon Traps down the bottom, to deal with those early ones.

Upright spikes work, too. And don't even need mechanisms!

Actually, they do. Upright spears need to be linked to a lever so they can be raised, and even then it only works if the enemy's already on the tile IIRC, so you can't just have them fall on it.

[Greiger]

I've been using 6 z levels with a copper spike at the bottom.  It has been showing to be mostly non lethal to goblins but still crippling.  Though It may actually not be the best design all around.

In a 2 or 3 z-level fall armor actually manages to block the fall damage quite often.  The fall is still quite damaging to goblins who come wearing only head and body armor, disabling the limbs which are generally the things you wanna disable anyway.  But it may be safer for your own soldiers who are likely fully protected allowing their armor a chance to nullify all the fall damage.

In a previous fort I had some of my own fully armored soldiers fall into my own "Dodge This!" traps, 2 out of 3 times the armor completely nullified all the damage from the fall(ignoring the spike) and of the one that did take damage from the fall the armor nullified 3 of the 'hits' from the fall damage.  While goblins who fell in on the other hand, had too many unprotected bits and still ended up crippled and unconscious in the pit roughly 90% of the time.


tl;dr 6 z levels seems to do great, 3 might be safer for your own fully armored and protected soldiers while still being enough to disable less armored enemies.

Actually, they do. Upright spears need to be linked to a lever so they can be raised, and even then it only works if the enemy's already on the tile IIRC, so you can't just have them fall on it.

False, they are built in the upright position, and falling on them triggers them.  People believed that they had no effect for basically forever, and nobody ever bothered to actually test it.  Anything over a 1 z fall will trigger upright spikes automatically.  Been that way since the beginning of the 3D version it seems, despite what was believed.

EDIT: Sorry if that seems a bit much 612, I was always thinking it increased fall damage in some way, but my testing during the early days of 3D was ignored because it was 'common knowledge' that spikes did nothing in falls, and there were no combat logs stating otherwise in those versions for proof.   And I tend to get overly bothered by it.

[Girlinhat]

The entire purpose of the upright spear is to toss people onto it.  Having it piston up and down is a secondary joy, though a very nice one.

[612DwarfAvenue]

Actually, they do. Upright spears need to be linked to a lever so they can be raised, and even then it only works if the enemy's already on the tile IIRC, so you can't just have them fall on it.

False, they are built in the upright position, and falling on them triggers them.  People believed that they had no effect for basically forever, and nobody ever bothered to actually test it.  Anything over a 1 z fall will trigger upright spikes automatically.  Been that way since the beginning of the 3D version it seems, despite what was believed.

WHAAAA?