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The first, I'd like to know more about colossi.

The second, I want to see a wider variety of megabeasts.

Either one, or both.

Neither, it's fine as it is.

Other (State in thread, please).

[GreatWyrmGold]

Most semi/megabeasts, and most DF creatures in general, have a strong basis in myth and therefore a strongly defined "personality." Not bronze colossi. Therefore, I suggest that either:
1.) Bronze colossi gain more characterization (possibly from a Threetoe story, until Toady One gets around to programming the relevant stuff in).
2.) Bronze colossi are replaced by the following colossi:
(Warning:May contain metaphors that make little sense.)
Iron Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A massive faceless automation with glowing ruby eyes. It is animated by fell magic and lives only to kill.
An iron colossus is incredibly good at killing. It is similar to current bronze colossi. They accept no help from any other living being, slaying on sight everything from cavies to cloens.

Steel Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A broad, massive steel automation with glowing blue, metal eyes. Its hands are like axes, its fists are like hammers, and it strives for glory in battle.
A steel colossus is a dwarf-shaped statue. Its hands are sharpened, so it can karate-chop with deadly force. They kill mighty and dark creatures, so as long as there are frequent zombies, FBs, goblins, and so forth visiting your fort, a steel colossus can be a good thing. If it gets bored, though, it might decide that dwarves are fairly good targets, and...well, there's a reason most forts strive for steel gear. As long as the dwarves are not the most ideal opponents, they tend to travel with steel colossi, like wolf cubs following their parents on a hunt.

Bronze Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A massive, greedy automation with glowing emerald eyes. It takes what it wants and is not stopped by lesser beings.
A statue that comes to your fort, steals some of its most valuable items, and leaves...with a trail of dead dwarves in its path. When diplomacy is implemented, it will try to make you give it the items before rampaging. It might be aided by a group of human mercenaries.

Wood Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A slim, massive wooden automation with pointed ears and glowing coral eyes. It defends all nature with spearlike splinters flung from its palms.
Wood colossi are made of...some kind of wood that probably varies from colossus to colossus. They will leave your fort alone unless you cat down lots of trees, kill lots of elves/animals, etc. Elves tend to side with wood colossi; a wood colossus's home is to elves like a doghouse is to a mouse. Its most notable weapon is the "spearlike splinters" it shoots at passing dwarves.

Obsidian Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A massive bloodstained automation made of obsidian with glowing opal eyes. It leads armies to battle, not caring whose blood is spilled as long as blood is spilled.
Obsidian colossi are to goblins as steel ones are to dwarves. They slaughter massive numbers of creatures, any that they see. Goblins and sometimes others gather around them like jackals to lions, allowed to live as long as they slay beasts in the colossus's name.

Copper Colossus

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

A huge copper statue with glowing yellow jasper eyes and pointed ears. It sneaks into fors and towns, silent as a shadow, to steal their valuables.
A giant, copper kobold thief. Possible difference: Instead of picking locks, it breaks down the door. I don't recommend it, though. Maybe it camps out, snatching valuables every so often until it's noticed, and then it tries to retrieve its stash and run. Being huge and made of copper, it will fare better than most kobold thieves. Kobold settlements spring up around copper colossus lairs like metaphors in writing.

Maybe these would be castes of a "colossus" creature...hm...
----

I would like your thoughts. Although it would be cool if my ideas for colossus castes were taken, I'd be just as happy to see DF bronze colossi get a bit more defined.

[FallingWhale]

You have no idea what the Colossus is, do you?

[Neonivek]

The one thing I'd like the Collosus to change in the not so distant future is what exactly is it depicting based upon its construction.

For example if the Collosus is a General carrying an ornamental spear or some sort of giant scholar with a huge stone tablet inscribed with arcane secrets. Heck I'd love a Bronze Collosus to be someone standing on a horse.

Anyhow the problem with allowing the collosus to change material is that the Bronze collosus as it stands is rather almighty.

Wood and Obsideon is too weak.

[GreatWyrmGold]

You have no idea what the Colossus is, do you?

Yes, inanimate.

The one thing I'd like the Collosus to change in the not so distant future is what exactly is it depicting based upon its construction.

For example if the Collosus is a General carrying an ornamental spear or some sort of giant scholar with a huge stone tablet inscribed with arcane secrets. Heck I'd love a Bronze Collosus to be someone standing on a horse.

Anyhow the problem with allowing the collosus to change material is that the Bronze collosus as it stands is rather almighty.

Wood and Obsideon is too weak.

As to the first: That would be cool.
As to the second: Not if it come with a few squads of mad goblins or whatever or fires spear-sized splinters from its hands.

[Neonivek]

As to the second: Not if it come with a few squads of mad goblins or whatever or fires spear-sized splinters from its hands

At that point it is better as a different creature. Besides I don't think the collosus should "work" for anyone but a god I guess.

[sockless]

I think more detail needs to go into how they are constructed. Like now Zombies are reincarnated by necromancers. Maybe they could be created by some legendary smith that goes insane or something (probably a human as they are bronze). They could then have some variation, like what they depict and maybe engravings and stuff.

[Zurvan]

You have no idea what the Colossus is, do you?

Yes, inanimate.

This is a legitimate criticism, if the only inspiration were the historic statue at Rhodes. However, there are actual mythical antecedents, even in classical mythology. Consider Talos, the metal giant, protector of Crete:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talos

Some additional information, from the standard references. Der Neue Pauly:

Crete's iron guardian
Myth of various versions in Apollod. 1,140 f.: T. was one of the bronze race or was given to Minos by Hephaestus (by Zeus to Europe [2]: Apoll. Rhod. 4,1643); he is a bronze man (triple giant: Orph. A. 1351) or a bull; he has a single vein from the neck to the ankles which is sealed at the end by a bronze nail (a membrane: Apoll. Rhod. 4,1647 f.); he runs all the way around Crete three times a day and keeps the Argonauts from landing by throwing stones; he is killed by Medea, who by madness-inducing potions or by promising him immortality gets him to remove the nail and bleed to death (according to Apoll. Rhod. 4,1665-1688, the angered Medea casts a spell on his eyes, causing him to injure his ankle on a rock so that the Ichor flows out); or Poeas (Argonaut: Apollod. 1,112) kills him by shooting him in the ankle. According to schol. Hom. Od. 20,302, T. - heated by fire - embraces his victims who die facing his 'sardonic' grin.

OCD:

Talos   1. An animated bronze man, in the usual account made by Hephaestus to guard Europa ; later the guardian of Crete . There are several variant accounts of his origin and function. He kept strangers off by throwing stones ( Apollonius Rhodius 4. 1638–88), or burned them (Simonides, in Page , Poetae Melici Graeci 568), or heated himself red-hot and clasped them in his arms ( Eustathius Ad Odysseam 20. 302). His vital fluid was kept in a magic membrane in his foot; Medea cast him into a magic sleep and cut the membrane, thus killing him.

[GreatWyrmGold]

...Huh. I guess I don't know as much about mythology as I thought.

[Mountain-King]

i think the main problem with bronze collosi is that they're too... i don't know, "specific?"

in a world like DF's with so few megabeasts, they should either be something very recognizable (dragons, hydras, rocs) or something randomly generated that can be a wide variety of things (titans.) bronze collosi are a cool monster idea but they aren't as archetypal as dragons or hydras or rocs, and they're always the same. they stand out even more since they're probably the strongest type of megabeast.

the best way to save the bronze collosi would probably be to make them more randomly generated, making it possible for them to be made out of different materials and have different strengths and weaknesses. this would eliminate the need to make a bunch of different specific colossi.

[GreatWyrmGold]

i think the main problem with bronze collosi is that they're too... i don't know, "specific?"

in a world like DF's with so few megabeasts, they should either be something very recognizable (dragons, hydras, rocs) or something randomly generated that can be a wide variety of things (titans.) bronze collosi are a cool monster idea but they aren't as archetypal as dragons or hydras or rocs, and they're always the same. they stand out even more since they're probably the strongest type of megabeast.

the best way to save the bronze collosi would probably be to make them more randomly generated, making it possible for them to be made out of different materials and have different strengths and weaknesses. this would eliminate the need to make a bunch of different specific colossi.

So...procedural colossi? That...isn't a bad idea, but it makes them into humanoid inorganic titans with bad tempers and fluffy wambler weaknesses.

[Dutchling]

I would prefer BC's to just stay in the game and not be made of different materials because the BC seems to be something very Dwarf Fortress-y
Of course a randomly generated BC with some default stats (friggin' huge and made out of bronze...) would be a great addition

[GreatWyrmGold]

I would prefer BC's to just stay in the game and not be made of different materials because the BC seems to be something very Dwarf Fortress-y
Of course a randomly generated BC with some default stats (friggin' huge and made out of bronze...) would be a great addition

Maybe a random, specific-to-that critter weapon? Maybe random personality? Maybe a bit of definition as something other than "A murderous Colossus of Rhodes" in a Threetoe story or something?

[Montague]

Yeah, not sure what would distinguish a Colossi from say, a metallic Titan, if they were randomly generated.

I think they are supposed to be a a golem. Notice in the legends they are often associated with war, fortresses, ect. I'd suppose they are some sort of war machine made by the gods or some ancient dwarves or something. Since it's controllers are long dead, it just smashes everything. The shrine could very well be it's garage or something.

[Monk321654]

Iron Colossus?
Don't you mean Iron Giant?
Badum-tish.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Yeah, not sure what would distinguish a Colossi from say, a metallic Titan, if they were randomly generated.

I think they are supposed to be a a golem. Notice in the legends they are often associated with war, fortresses, ect. I'd suppose they are some sort of war machine made by the gods or some ancient dwarves or something. Since it's controllers are long dead, it just smashes everything. The shrine could very well be it's garage or something.

Hm...I can't wait until The Creators are implemented/otherwise suggested, then.