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[Fenrir]

I have a really hard time dealing emotionally with the fact that so many people just stood around watching this happen.  If those murderers weren't wearing badges, intervening would be considered the right thing to do.  I've already argued with one friend about this.  Most people's attitude seems to be that just because they are wearing badges, standing nearby and shaking your head is the acceptable response.  Really?  Does no one else have a problem with this?

I would not be so sure it was just the badges. It was two well-armed thugs with badges. I am not saying that doing nothing was the right thing, but the bystanders may simply not had the tactical strength needed to offer the murders anything resembling a fight.

[Powder Miner]

Meyaaaahhhh screwit I'll go on this thread when I feel like it, no need to make another I guess.

[kaijyuu]

Assisting someone resisting arrest can land you in jail. I'm not saying he was resisting, but that's the charge they undoubtedly would've come under had they confronted the officers.

Those badges give more than possibly undeserved respect.

[SalmonGod]

It probably wouldn't have taken much to save that man's life. They were obviously very focused on beating him instead of doing their jobs. A little intervention would have divided up the focus on him and pressured them to wrap things up instead of continuing with a beating. Might have saved him a few blows and maybe his life.

Edit:  Yeah you would get some pain and jail time for intervening, but I would consider that worth it to save a life.  I can't look at the pictures of that guy's face after his beating and believe that it wasn't obvious that it was a life and death situation.

[Vector]

I concur, SalmonGod.

Also, that bakesale turned out incredibly lulzy.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

The police are just another gang. No, really, they fit pretty much all the criteria.

-They have a gang uniform.
-They have a gang code.
-They act outside normal confines of the law.
-They kill people on a regular basis, sometimes for little to no reason.
-They do everything possible to protect one another from ever facing prosecution for their actions.
-They fight other gangs for territory.
-They even have a gang motto, although "Protect and Serve" is one of the most unenforced creeds I've ever seen.
-They had a racial basis in the US up until the 50's.
-They have a large number of thugs in their organization.
-They use their power to intimidate people into not reporting or recording their illicit actions.

The only real difference is that the cops have government endorsement.

[Bohandas]

The police are just another gang. No, really, they fit pretty much all the criteria.

-They have a gang uniform.
-They have a gang code.
-They act outside normal confines of the law.
-They kill people on a regular basis, sometimes for little to no reason.
-They do everything possible to protect one another from ever facing prosecution for their actions.
-They fight other gangs for territory.
-They even have a gang motto, although "Protect and Serve" is one of the most unenforced creeds I've ever seen.
-They had a racial basis in the US up until the 50's.
-They have a large number of thugs in their organization.
-They use their power to intimidate people into not reporting or recording their illicit actions.

The only real difference is that the cops have government endorsement.

And that's not even really much of a difference anyway. All a government is is an organization which has a monopoly on violence.

[kaijyuu]

That's pretty damn unfair to the officers who actually want to make a positive difference. There are plenty of officers who just want to be rambo beating up bad guys; I know that... but it's far from all of them.

Thin blue line that separates us from anarchy. I wouldn't be opposed to having more regulation on them, but decrying the entire thing? Please.

[Vector]

I guess the real question is if you can ever make a positive difference with violence.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

That's pretty damn unfair to the officers who actually want to make a positive difference.

After everything I've seen, I'm starting to doubt that people like that actually exist. I've never seen them.

Thin blue line that separates us from anarchy. I wouldn't be opposed to having more regulation on them, but decrying the entire thing? Please.

Until the police get regulation, they're a gang. And they don't have regulation when cops beat people to death and get away with it, every time.

[SalmonGod]

I accept the idea that there are good cops.  I do have a really really hard time understanding how they get along with their co-workers, turn a blind eye to their wrong doings, or even defend them.

You might say that it's because the bad cops are a minority.... but that I do not accept.... if that were the case, there wouldn't be so many cases of massive solidarity on their part when one of them is caught red-handed doing something obviously very wrong or in this case there wouldn't have been several cops participating in a murder that only two have been charged for (I saw 3 cars and how often does one car carry only one officer?).

[Duke 2.0]

I wouldn't be opposed to having more regulation on them, but decrying the entire thing? Please.

Pretty much. We really blow up tales of cops abusing their power because it's unnatural and out of line and not a thing they normally do. There are no stories about the thousands of good cops who just do their paperwork and protect and serve. Occasionally there will be a story on how one died in the line of duty or did something heroic, but it hardly lasts a day or two.

 I don't doubt that there are some corrupt officers out there and that we need a better system of regulating them and preventing some jurisdictions from trying to maintain a false image, but to decry the whole system for the faults of the decried few feels off. We gotta be more specific here if we want stuff to happen.

[kaijyuu]

I guess the real question is if you can ever make a positive difference with violence.

Depends how you look at it.


Can you use violence to avoid an even worse outcome? Of course; self defense is the most obvious example.
Can you use violence and achieve a better result if no violence at all was used (from any side)? No.

Applying it to police officers, they (are supposed to) carry those guns to protect themselves and others. Not for assault. I'm in no way supporting policy brutality, as should be obvious.

That's pretty damn unfair to the officers who actually want to make a positive difference.

After everything I've seen, I'm starting to doubt that people like that actually exist. I've never seen them.

Go to your local police station and ask one why they chose their profession.

[Bohandas]

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

[Duke 2.0]

That's pretty damn unfair to the officers who actually want to make a positive difference.

After everything I've seen, I'm starting to doubt that people like that actually exist. I've never seen them.

I'm sympathetic with your position buddy, but this is a pretty flimsy argument. I could mirror it without lying or being sarcastic and carry the same weight.

 And before statistics come firing up, I do wonder if somebody has statistics on how many officers are dishonorably discharged compared to how many assaults go unenforced.