Kinda late, but about that bigotry as a choice tangent. I have to admit that I *do* feel kind of squicky about male homosexuality. To be fair, a lot of sexual acts, regardless of the genders involved, have a similar response, but for whatever reason the whole category of male homosexuality, even as simple as a kiss, makes me feel really uncomfortable. And hey, my own reaction of disgust DOES give me some rights. I mean, it gives me the right to not participate in a homosexual relationship. Actually, that's about it.
Because, really, that reaction is my failing. Not anybody else's. Nobody else needs to change to accommodate my flaws, and nobody, nobody, has the right to demand that another person bury himself (or herself; stupid English language) just because, "I'm offended". Sure, you've got a right not to be offended. That's fair. But that right is utterly and completely insignificant beside a person's right to be a person.
You've got two options; you can either change yourself so you're not offended anymore (which, to my shame, I've never yet been able to manage), or you can suck it up and accept that you're not the arbiter of all that is right and good in this world. I don't know what part of my background makes me dislike the concept, but it sure as hell wasn't Truean's fault, or Tyg13's, or any of the many, many other people who would be hurt if my instincts ran the world. So you know what, fuck those instincts. They're not helping anyone.
Might be a bit of a rant, but eh. I felt I needed to say it.
EDIT: HOLY SHIT GUYS, 21 NEW REPLIES. THERE'S GONNA BE LIKE 20 MORE BY THE TIME I'VE CAUGHT UP.
EDIT: Oh just one. Wow.
Bauglir, I would not call your distaste for homosexuality a “failing” or a flaw. You are under no obligation to be otherwise.
There is plenty of stuff that I do not like, and I am not ashamed of it. I also do not abuse people because they do stuff that I do not like, because I value personal freedom above those things that I regard with distaste.
Well, here's the thing. I get where you're coming from, but as far as I'm concerned it is a flaw. I am most definitely under an obligation to treat other people with the respect they deserve; my kneejerk reaction here is irrelevant to that, except that it makes it somewhat difficult and unpleasant for me to do so. I'd rather not have to deal with it at all, given that I can't let it affect how I treat others. For me, it's pointless irritation and mental dissonance, and that is definitely a flaw; but it's worth it to know that its consequences are constrained to me, as obnoxiously angsty as that sounds.
Holy shit, honesty, o mystery that seems to actually exist.... I respect you more for just admitting it and thinking about it instead of just the normal, "I think gay sucks and you suck for being gay."
Yeah though, that feeling that he's talking about is unfortunately all too common and hell if I know how to do shit about it. You have any idea how weird it is going on a date when you're gay knowing that people will be thinking this? Part of you doesn't want to offend anyone; part of you is offended that it offends people and still another part of you is scared you'll be beaten half to death. [shrugs].
I was lucky enough to have a serious boyfriend for over two years and he had no compunctions about holding hands (primarily because he was 6 ft 4 and no one ever knew he was gay/he was large enough to be a problem if you fought him). I on the other hand was terrified. We literally drove 4 towns over to go on a date and I still wasn't comfortable. Strangely, a girl friend of his helped me pass as a female and go out with him once like that. Apparently, I was convincing cause no one batted an eye at the PDA then. [sigh]
Summation: Its a tough thing determining how to incorporate homosexuality into a respectable place in civilized society when it was completely taboo for decades. Wish I knew how. How do I participate in a society where some people are entirely uncomfortable with me....?
True Askot, but then there's also Jesus saying that the Old Laws are cast down .
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.
Anyway, I came across an article that is somewhat relevant to the discussion at hand. You will likely find it shocking, and those of you who recognize the local news website will find it even more shocking.
Pastor and/or Cult Leader executes 4-year old on camera because of "exhibiting gay behavior" and murders his mother later.
I mean, what the fuck. This is crazy from start to finish. I've been to Durham many times, it's right next to my city. This isn't some crazy Deep South backwater, it's a small city in its own right! This sort of thing shouldn't happen there, but it did.
I am not at all shocked or surprised, that kind of thing is far more common than you know.
Unfortunately yes. Homosexuals in the US get assaulted, seriously injured and in some cases killed far more often than people think. The fact that it happened to a four year old is a little shocking but yeah.... Matthew Shepard wasn't especially shocking because they tortured and killed him, that was bad enough, but because they pretended to be gay, went to a gay bar, lured him outside and then did it.... Downright predatory.... I mean shit, if you can't be gay in a gay bar then where the crap can you be?
On Religion:This is a hard topic because a lot of backlash against gays comes from here and I've felt a crapton of it. It's hard not to be bitter. Shit I've been told I'm an abomination to God.... I once sobbingly came out to a therapist in a therapy session and her response was, in an all too comforting voice:
"You're such a nice boy, I'm so sorry, I really wish you weren't going to hell."
Keep in mind this was a trained psychiatrist at a university.... I just sorta walked out numb and didn't come back.
Still, I don't find insulting religion to be productive. Fact is, I know the bible better than most Christians do. I can point out Leviticus 18:22 and all the other anti gay passages. Its just more constructive to point out, "I thought we all were the children of God...." They tend to squirm when that one comes out.