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Author Topic: Chill and Relaxed Progressive Irritation and Annoyance Thread  (Read 856694 times)

Leafsnail

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1335 on: July 08, 2011, 12:35:33 pm »

And yet with such huge prices of petrol it would suddenly become comparatively viable to create the infrastructure for mass transit to really work.  I mean that kind of price shift would make hydrogen fuel pretty cheap by comparison.
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Zrk2

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1336 on: July 08, 2011, 12:36:03 pm »

[sigh]

To a certain degree yes. However, this is a hostage situation and what they are holding hostage is the entire economy....

Oil is a vast input good, pretty much every area of commerce needs it. If food is what keeps humans going, then oil is what keeps economy going....

Also for those who might not know an inelastic demand curve is supposed to be this bullshit:
http://abbyseconblog.wordpress.com/2009/11/

Economists literally think the demand curve is a straight line.... This is bullshit and why the speculation on the NYSE and others continues. Every single demand curve has some slope. The idea that it is straight up and down, like I was taught in college, is crap. If tomorrow gas reached $20/gallon, demand would drop rapidly because people simply couldn't afford it (society itself would also go straight to hell). That's a slope and therefore the damn thing isn't a straight vertical line....

It seems to be a straight line within certain extremes, a piece-wise function if you will.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1337 on: July 08, 2011, 12:58:50 pm »

http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/venezuela

http://www.hrw.org/americas/venezuela


As I said, Chavez's record is not exactly spotless.


And as I said, Venezuela's score and list position are not the only puzzling parts of it. Lebanom's also raises eyebrows. And the group's stated methodology has some strange elements, too.
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Virex

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1338 on: July 08, 2011, 01:23:11 pm »

The fact that Lebanom rates so high in the list also adds to the "dubious points", as far as I'm concerned.
Lebanon is actually quite a decent democracy as far as the Middle East goes*, or it would have been if Syria would stop blowing up journalists and assassinating presidents...


*Though it must be said that pro-syrian officials may find it somewhat more difficult then normal to run for office. There's also some censorship, mostly aimed at works that are deemed "offensive to Christianity" such as the Da Vinci code (before you raise an objection to this, remember that Secretum was effectively banned in Italy for quite some time as well). Ignoring Syria's constant meddling for a moment I'd probably rank it at roughly the same level as Poland or Hungary.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 01:25:29 pm by Virex »
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Truean

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1339 on: July 08, 2011, 01:26:33 pm »

And yet with such huge prices of petrol it would suddenly become comparatively viable to create the infrastructure for mass transit to really work.  I mean that kind of price shift would make hydrogen fuel pretty cheap by comparison.

Clearly, that's "socialist" thinking and the "car culture" in the United States won't stand for it. [headdesk]

It seems to be a straight line within certain extremes, a piece-wise function if you will.

My money says it's a hetroskedasticity corrupted asymptote that could be shown in a white test.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asymptote

It's never vertical at all, but rather very very gradually slopping until it hits a wall so to speak (or rather gets infinitely close to that wall). This would humorously make the function go horizontal.... Cause at some price point, we actually would say fuck it and either do something else or straight out invade someplace with no pretenses whatsoever before the strategic oil reserve ran out. A la Japan invading French Indochina (Vietnam when we oil embargoed them in WWII). I vote we call the new place "New Screw You All We're Not Pretending It Isn't For Oil This Timeistan." Good luck fitting that on your protest signs....


« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 01:28:59 pm by Truean »
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Zrk2

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1340 on: July 08, 2011, 01:42:20 pm »

Can it be in Subsaharan Africa? I've already got a plan, all I need is some capital for the planes and mercenaries. Then it's all oil and diamonds for us (bitches).
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Truean

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1341 on: July 08, 2011, 02:11:26 pm »

Can it be in Subsaharan Africa? I've already got a plan, all I need is some capital for the planes and mercenaries. Then it's all oil and diamonds for us (bitches).

Why not, what's a 4th concurrent US war? Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Iran has been pissing us off, so has North Korea. We're kinda scared of China though, on account of them having nukes and being able to kick our asses without really caring (thankfully there's a large ocean between them and us).
Subsaharan Africa? Do they have good Bloody Marys down there? Also Oil? Great I'll take 2....

Some of the old people can screw off. We took away your right to drive when you started doing crazy shit and now we need to take away your right to vote.... You've screwed up enough, K'thx.
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2005/12/03/episode-630-reverence-for-the-elderly/

Also I like this one, because it's funny and says to take care of the professionals. Also Dwarves:
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2005/09/03/episode-594-bad-timing/

:P
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 02:16:13 pm by Truean »
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The kinda human wreckage that you love

Current Spare Time Fiction Project: (C) 2010 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=63660.0
Disclaimer: I never take cases online for ethical reasons. If you require an attorney; you need to find one licensed to practice in your jurisdiction. Never take anything online as legal advice, because each case is different and one size does not fit all. Wants nothing at all to do with law.

Please don't quote me.

Virex

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1342 on: July 08, 2011, 02:15:56 pm »

Can it be in Subsaharan Africa? I've already got a plan, all I need is some capital for the planes and mercenaries. Then it's all oil and diamonds for us (bitches).
As long as you're not copying these guys...
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freeformschooler

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1343 on: July 08, 2011, 02:29:19 pm »

Some of the old people can screw off. We took away your right to drive when you started doing crazy shit and now we need to take away your right to vote.... You've screwed up enough, K'thx.
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2005/12/03/episode-630-reverence-for-the-elderly/

Also I like this one, because it's funny and says to take care of the professionals. Also Dwarves:
http://www.nuklearpower.com/2005/09/03/episode-594-bad-timing/

I distinctly remember there being comments from the author and his buddies under a significant portion of the 8BT comics... did they go away?
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Truean

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1344 on: July 08, 2011, 02:32:11 pm »

Yeah, unfortunately, right about the time the comic ended....

Don't you love the arrow pointing up and saying "Your King," and the fact that it is necessary? :P
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 02:33:56 pm by Truean »
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The kinda human wreckage that you love

Current Spare Time Fiction Project: (C) 2010 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=63660.0
Disclaimer: I never take cases online for ethical reasons. If you require an attorney; you need to find one licensed to practice in your jurisdiction. Never take anything online as legal advice, because each case is different and one size does not fit all. Wants nothing at all to do with law.

Please don't quote me.

Reelyanoob

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1345 on: July 08, 2011, 11:59:52 pm »

http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/venezuela

http://www.hrw.org/americas/venezuela


As I said, Chavez's record is not exactly spotless.


And as I said, Venezuela's score and list position are not the only puzzling parts of it. Lebanom's also raises eyebrows. And the group's stated methodology has some strange elements, too.

Dude, the police are the "old venezuela" and actively have assasinated Chavez's supporters in the past. They WERE the snipers in the coup attempt against Chavez, watch the doco I linked to see how the Venezuelan police "deal" with socialist voters. They are also controlled by the state governors and municipal governments, NOT the federal government, most of the governors are OPPOSITION politicians.

The prison system there has also been notorious for many decades, but funny enough only warrants news articles in the west when prison riots happen while a socialist government is elected. Here's New York Times on the dysfunctional prison system there in 1998 (BEFORE CHAVEZ was even elected).
http://www.nytimes.com/1998/12/21/world/in-a-venezuelan-prison-every-cranny-holds-a-clan.html

The socialists are trying to phase those old State and Municipal police units out, and replace them with a better trained national police, which the British government is helping them with. (the new police, inaugurated 12 months ago are the first to be university-trained)

I'll link some articles so you can better understand the issue:

Police Structure of Venezuela:
http://www.think-venezuela.net/police.htm

Police reform process in Venezuela (since 2006)
http://www.insightcrime.org/insight-latest-news/item/732-venezuela-cracks-on-with-police-reform

Notorious Metro police disbanded
http://venezuelanalysis.com/news/6107

Quote
MP Caracas is known for its excessive use of force against the general population, and is widely accused of corruption and misuse of the public’s trust. Three former officers are currently serving 30-year sentences for their roles in the violent death of pro-government demonstrators during the April 2002 military coup against President Chávez.

The cops were shooting Pro-Chavez supporters. That's how they play. Watch the doco. It's on there. Hence why the socialists are trying to dismantle the police.

There are also many documents dated from before and around the time Chavez was elected ahowing police problems have been around longer than Chavez:

2001
http://vmrz0183.vm.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/policeuseofforce/pdf/Accounts%20and%20Accountability.pdf

Human Rights Watch report from 1998 (published before Chavez even elelcted)
http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/country,COI,HRW,ANNUALREPORT,VEN,4562d94e2,3ae6a8b014,0.html

This article covers CHANGES wrought to the criminal code by Chavez when he was elected:
http://leftwingcriminologist.blogspot.com/2008/01/look-at-criminal-justice-in-venezuela.html
Quote
“Until 1999, criminal procedure was inquisitorial, formalist, and written (Venezuela, 1962). On July 1, 1999, a Criminal Procedure Code took effect which represented nothing short of a paradigm shift for the Venezuelan criminal justice system (Venezuela, 1998b). The inquisitorial system was replaced by an adversarial system, characteristic of common law countries, based on oral proceedings, the right to trial by jury, the possibility of pre-trial diversion, and a modest role for plea bargaining (Pérez, 1998). The Criminal Procedure Code also placed heavy restrictions on the detention of crime suspects by the police and on the use of preventive detention measures while adjudication proceeds.”
Quote
“These radical changes in criminal procedure met with considerable opposition from some groups, notably the police and some elected officials who argued that the Code was "soft" on criminals (Poleo, 2000). As a result, the Criminal Procedure Code has been partially modified, for example, by decreasing restrictions on preventive detention (Venezuela, 2000b), and further changes are proposed (Casas, 2001).”
« Last Edit: July 09, 2011, 12:31:03 am by Reelyanoob »
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Reelyanoob

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1346 on: July 09, 2011, 12:39:42 am »

Human Rights Watch is notoriously biased (stick with Amnesty International instead)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Rights_Watch#Criticism

Only the plight of the pro-US wealthy elite matter to Human Rights Watch:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
See, US based "human rights" groups turn a blind eye to people being killed, and prefer to list as "atrocities" beareaucratic red-tape applied to wealthy people who break the law.

Oh Yeah! And "Human Rights Watch" condemn Venezuela as cracking down on free-speech, while praising Colombia who do things like this:
(from Reporters without Borders at http://en.rsf.org/colombia.html)
"Manual teaches intelligence agency employees how to spy on problem journalists"
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Other classy Colombian headlines:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
According to Human Rights Watch, the above is done by the "good guys" of South America, or at least a "free society"

---

Also of interest is this BBC article on the claimed deaths caused by Colombian military 2002-2008 : 114,000 "terrorists" killed in 6 years.
Either the figures are lies, or the previous government is the biggest killer in colombian history.
(there are an estimated total of 30,000 rebels, so how you can kill 114,000 of them is a mystery)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7781991.stm

Also: 446 bodies found by UNHCR :
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: July 09, 2011, 01:17:41 am by Reelyanoob »
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Vector

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1347 on: July 09, 2011, 01:22:36 am »

You seem to have missed this:

Anyway, I really doubt Vector wants this to derail onto a major anarchy tangent.

Quoted for truth.
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Reelyanoob

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1348 on: July 09, 2011, 01:31:57 am »

What does what I wrote have to do with anarchism in the slightest? There's no anarchists in venezuela, only progressive socialists.

I'm talking about media bias here in favor of right-wing despots and against elected socialist governments.
That's a valid "proresssive rage" issue I'd think?

It's also quite relevant to US politics in that all the Anti-Chavez propaganda is identical to the anti-Obama propaganda (and the US is deeply embedded in the distortion of South American political reporting - Monroe Doctrine alive and well). The private media in Venezuela use the same tactics and tone as FOX News when attacking Chavez. Looking into detail at the anti-Chavez propaganda is enlightening in how they portray Obama as a communist/terrorist/muslim/Nazi, the same exact things they say about Chavez.

Unless only GOP vs Democrat progressivism in the USA is allowed to be discussed? You should update the thread title if that's the case.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2011, 01:43:25 am by Reelyanoob »
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Vector

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #1349 on: July 09, 2011, 01:42:38 am »

*sigh*

No, I just thought this was part of that gigantic anarchy argument that eventually turned into talking about South America with unknown relevance.  To be honest, I skimmed pretty much all of that.  I'm completely exhausted.

I apologize.
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

nonbinary/genderfluid/genderqueer renegade mathematician and mafia subforum limpet. please avoid quoting me.

pronouns: prefer neutral ones, others are fine. height: 5'3".
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