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Author Topic: Chill and Relaxed Progressive Irritation and Annoyance Thread  (Read 872379 times)

RedKing

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #405 on: June 13, 2011, 06:26:00 am »

Yeah, they're pushing for changing the laws to allow fracking here in North Carolina. Apparently there are significant natural gas deposits in a few counties...notably, the ones near some of our largest cities.
This sounds like a fantastic idea! Let's mess with the geological stability and groundwater in the name of some profits for a handful of people who aren't even from here!
http://www.dcbureau.org/201106015216/natural-resources-news-service/north-carolina-moves-closer-to-fracking.html


In other news...
Something's going down this weekend (in the "Federal probe" sense not the technical "things are broken" sense), and I don't fully know what. This makes me uneasy. I dislike lawyers. I dislike them even more when they're shrouding everything they do and I'm expected to cater to their needs without being briefed on basics.

But you said that me linking to that wikileaks cable would be safe!

In seriousness, I hope it works out ok.
No worries, it's not me they're after. I posted about this a couple of months back. Still doesn't mean I have to enjoy it. Like I said back then, it was a decent plan that went horribly wrong. And while the situation warrants that some heads are going to roll, I'm cringing at the political response once the findings of the investigation are made public and the Republicans start screaming to cut ATF's funding or even dissolve the Bureau altogether.

And the shitstorm goes public. I'm neutral on the actual investigation. Mistakes were made, people will lose their jobs. I think it was a good faith effort that went bad, but even so that doesn't absolve the responsibility from those who authorized it.

What's making me sick to my stomach is the way this is already being politicized and made into a football. The gun lobby is jizzing their camos in glee, and the fringe right is trying to make this into a much bigger scandal than it already is. WorldNetDaily (everyone's favorite tinfoil-hat clearinghouse) already has an editorial up this morning trying to spin this into "an impeachable offense" by Obama, despite the fact that he was kept out of the loop on this entire thing.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2011, 06:52:00 am by RedKing »
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Remember, knowledge is power. The power to make other people feel stupid.
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Science is like an inoculation against charlatans who would have you believe whatever it is they tell you.

Truean

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #406 on: June 13, 2011, 06:53:48 am »

For a lawyer, I'm a little surprised you haven't heard about this sooner.  Especially since there was a pretty good movie about it.

I'm up to my neck in this stuff myself, now that the DFW metroplex has become a new front in the natural gas campaign.  Tarrant county, home of the private estate of the Bass Family known as "Fort Worth", is a-okay with gas drilling.  A lot of what used to be swampland and floodplains has been given over to natural gas storage and processing (because an area known for rare but major flooding is a great place to put tanks of natural gas), and there's drills popping up smack in the middle of neighborhoods, surrounded by 20 foot high "privacy walls" (or "non-disclosure walls", if you prefer), which do a crappy job of keeping out the noise and absolutely no job of keeping out the smell.  Dallas county, named for where all the cool people live, not only is totally not cool with gas drilling, but doesn't even trust their neighbors enough to rely on the local (shared) water table for our municipal water, choosing to treat the Hell out of it just in case.

Of course, we also have one of the most crooked real estate and development city-boards in the country, but at least they know the value of non-flammable tap water.

I confess, my nose is often in a book, lately reading the finer points of getting out of a DUI or recently bar study. *shrugs*. Basically if people aren't suing about it at work, I tend not to read about it. I'll add that movie to my list of things to see after this test though. Thanks.

I think it'd be funny to make CEOs consume the drinking water from the sites they do business in. I bet environmental quality would skyrocket then. :P

Quote
I dislike lawyers. I dislike them even more when they're shrouding everything they do and I'm expected to cater to their needs without being briefed on basics.

We ain't all bad. There end up being two tiers of lawyers. The ones that represent large businesses and those who represent average people. Guess who gets paid more as a rule and thus has more clout?
« Last Edit: June 13, 2011, 07:08:46 am by Truean »
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The kinda human wreckage that you love

Current Spare Time Fiction Project: (C) 2010 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=63660.0
Disclaimer: I never take cases online for ethical reasons. If you require an attorney; you need to find one licensed to practice in your jurisdiction. Never take anything online as legal advice, because each case is different and one size does not fit all. Wants nothing at all to do with law.

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Africa

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #407 on: June 13, 2011, 11:19:00 am »

Tom Ridge, who's now a "I'm-not-a-lobbyist" for natural gas, was just on Colbert insisting that fracking is absolutely harmless and nobody should worry about it. That made me think I should be really, really worried about it.
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RedKing

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #408 on: June 13, 2011, 11:52:31 am »

Quote
I dislike lawyers. I dislike them even more when they're shrouding everything they do and I'm expected to cater to their needs without being briefed on basics.

We ain't all bad. There end up being two tiers of lawyers. The ones that represent large businesses and those who represent average people. Guess who gets paid more as a rule and thus has more clout?

I know. A dear friend of mine is an incredibly sharp lawyer who's now a Deputy Attorney General for State of California. She could logic my ass into the dust without breaking a sweat.

Still doesn't modify my distaste for the profession in general. I have a thing against lawyers, salespeople and marketers, and I think I realize now why--they're all professions that are concerned primarily with cajoling people into doing something that those people originally had no desire to do. I guess I think of all three as advanced subtypes of the "trickster" class. I have a modicum of respect for lawyers because they're operating at a much higher level of arcane trickery.


Tom Ridge, who's now a "I'm-not-a-lobbyist" for natural gas, was just on Colbert insisting that fracking is absolutely harmless and nobody should worry about it. That made me think I should be really, really worried about it.
Did he advise everyone to just wrap their drinking water in duct tape?
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Remember, knowledge is power. The power to make other people feel stupid.
Quote from: Neil DeGrasse Tyson
Science is like an inoculation against charlatans who would have you believe whatever it is they tell you.

ETV

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #409 on: June 13, 2011, 12:14:03 pm »

I'm a proponent of "Do what you want to do, unless what you want hurts people or interferes with their pursuit of what they want"

Just spent a day reading this thread and various others and I'm stopping at this point (even though I know it's not even half way into the thread) it pretty much strikes me as the conclusion to almost anything.

"Do what ye will, so long as it harm no other".

The problem is that there is so many people who want to do exactly what they want for their own satisfaction with as minimal concern for other people as possible, or at the least this is a problem is you're a progressive, decent human being that likes the idea of change and a better tomorrow.
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Criptfeind

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #410 on: June 13, 2011, 12:47:06 pm »

Also the fact that different people have different ideas about what is harm.
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Aqizzar

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #411 on: June 13, 2011, 01:07:50 pm »

So that this post isn't just me ragging on Truean, the Governor of Texas who may well be running for President soon (possibily on the Holier Than Everyone ticket) believes the current economic crisis is a gift from God, to wean the American people off of their enslaving reliance on the Pharaoh.  Also, tax breaks for buying yachts.  I am way too exhausted to add to this.

Quote
I dislike lawyers. I dislike them even more when they're shrouding everything they do and I'm expected to cater to their needs without being briefed on basics.

We ain't all bad. There end up being two tiers of lawyers. The ones that represent large businesses and those who represent average people. Guess who gets paid more as a rule and thus has more clout?

You want to represent the average people and get a better rep?  Stop considering $300 an hour a cheap price.  There's due compensation for education and ability, and there's just plain gouging.  I have never met a lawyer, no matter how low-key they thought of themselves, who had an asking price I would consider anywhere near in line with the finances of his supposed client base.  In one instance, the cheapest guy I could find wanted $3500 up front to represent me in a misdemeanor case, and when I asked him about a weird letter I got from the other party, he charged me an extra $150 to place a five minute phonecall on my behalf.
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And here is where my beef pops up like a looming awkward boner.
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Truean

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #412 on: June 13, 2011, 01:34:51 pm »

So that this post isn't just me ragging on Truean, the Governor of Texas who may well be running for President soon (possibily on the Holier Than Everyone ticket) believes the current economic crisis is a gift from God, to wean the American people off of their enslaving reliance on the Pharaoh.  Also, tax breaks for buying yachts.  I am way too exhausted to add to this.

Quote
I dislike lawyers. I dislike them even more when they're shrouding everything they do and I'm expected to cater to their needs without being briefed on basics.

We ain't all bad. There end up being two tiers of lawyers. The ones that represent large businesses and those who represent average people. Guess who gets paid more as a rule and thus has more clout?

You want to represent the average people and get a better rep?  Stop considering $300 an hour a cheap price.  There's due compensation for education and ability, and there's just plain gouging.  I have never met a lawyer, no matter how low-key they thought of themselves, who had an asking price I would consider anywhere near in line with the finances of his supposed client base.  In one instance, the cheapest guy I could find wanted $3500 up front to represent me in a misdemeanor case, and when I asked him about a weird letter I got from the other party, he charged me an extra $150 to place a five minute phonecall on my behalf.

Funny you should say that. I plan to charge flat rates or $200 an hour. Significantly less both in hourly and actual price billed.

Entirely justified price rant and my idea of a free structure as it would stand currently:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

See post above for specifics to Aquizzar's issue.

Our society sucks at finding reasonable ways to pay for lawyer's fees. If people wanted to purchase a sort of "insurance policy" where I'd represent you for almost anything. I could do that for $25/month. That way I could hire one lawyer for every 600 people.... I'd get like 10 lawyers serving 6000 people that way and have a kick ass law firm complete with a CPA and about 3 or 4 secretaries to handle all the paperwork/bookkeeping in your life and do your taxes for you. (25*12*600=1.8Million a year. I could finally focus on doing the casework people needed.)

Unfortunately, "that's stupid." So no one will do it.

There is one downside to this plan though, conflict of interest. If the plan covers your whole family, then I can't represent you in divorce, because husband and wife are opposing parties. Same thing if your neighbor has it. I'm sure we could work something out, especially if there were two "insurance law firms" like this, that could trade clients to resolve conflicts of interest like this (that way you get a lawyer from one firm, and your spouse gets one from the other. Poof, no conflict).

Of course, taxes could pay for attorneys who would be required to to a certain (presumably heavy) amount of casework each year, but tax seems to be a bad word, even for expenditures on justice. (and I just demonstrated how affordable it could be)

Summation in re Aqizzar's post:
Gladly, long as I can pay my bills and make a living, I'd love to charge less. If I knew people would pay me instead of just saying they will, I'd even offer monthly payment plans. However, I am a professional and screw all, do deserve a lot of money for the years of studying and practical experience I have.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2011, 01:48:04 pm by Truean »
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The kinda human wreckage that you love

Current Spare Time Fiction Project: (C) 2010 http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=63660.0
Disclaimer: I never take cases online for ethical reasons. If you require an attorney; you need to find one licensed to practice in your jurisdiction. Never take anything online as legal advice, because each case is different and one size does not fit all. Wants nothing at all to do with law.

Please don't quote me.

olemars

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #413 on: June 13, 2011, 02:15:29 pm »

I possess three qualities that will guarantee failure in law: I'm honest, I'm not a bastard. That last one counts twice.
You forgot sense of humour and imagination. Are you sure you chose the right career?
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The Doctor

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #414 on: June 13, 2011, 05:51:43 pm »

Should have been a scientist. :I
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Cthulhu

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #415 on: June 13, 2011, 06:02:14 pm »

Also, tax breaks for buying yachts.  I am way too exhausted to add to this.

Is this a fucking joke?  Did I somehow get transported into a parody dimension?
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Shoes...

Siquo

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #416 on: June 13, 2011, 06:11:35 pm »

I'll just put one here in a drunk state and know I'll regret it later:

Abortions should be legal until the foetus is fully grown.


That's around 21 years.  :-\
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This one thread is mine. MIIIIINE!!! And it will remain a happy, friendly, encouraging place, whether you lot like it or not. 
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Vector

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #417 on: June 13, 2011, 06:13:08 pm »

I'll just put one here in a drunk state and know I'll regret it later:

Abortions should be legal until the foetus is fully grown.


That's around 21 years.  :-\

I hate to say this, but I laughed on, er, both counts.  Oh, maaaaaan...
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

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mainiac

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #418 on: June 13, 2011, 06:15:39 pm »

Doctors don't charge $200/hr, not even anesthesiologists. Anesthesiologists have more training, financial overhead and far more exposure to risk then lawyers do.  Bully to you for moving the curve, but it's still an absurdly expensive starting point.
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Darvi

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Re: Vector's Progressive Rage Thread
« Reply #419 on: June 13, 2011, 06:16:21 pm »

I'll just put one here in a drunk state and know I'll regret it later:

Abortions should be legal until the foetus is fully grown.


That's around 21 years.  :-\
Phew, I'm safe now then.
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