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[davros]

If vampires are going to be randomly generated in the new version, does that mean that there's a chance of getting twilight-esque sparkly bastards?
Do not want.

[Angel Of Death]

I do want!

You know why? I can torture a Twilight vampire!

[freeformschooler]

I do want!

You know why? I can torture a Twilight vampire!

I just read "I do want" and already knew what I was about to scroll down to read...

...because I was thinking the same thing.

EDIT: Also we can mod in wooden stakes and now become Buffy.

[LordZorintrhox]

The twinkly part is unlikely.  However, the other aspects, those of near indestructibility, sun-proofing, super-strength, and agility are certainly possible and probably going to show up.  The more bizarre attributes, like somehow being colder that room temperature because they are not actually 'alive' while at the same time being not only capable of getting it up without a heartbeat but also apparently virile are probably not.

Having read some of Eclipse as a party activity, I can say that the books are expertly crafted bad fiction, like a soap opera.  Meyers knows it too, because that book has an extended, clearly self-referential conversation between Bella and Edward about how much their counterparts in Wurthering Heights suck as human beings and are essentially lost causes of pettiness and stupidity, existing in an unrealistic and fundamentally broken universe that serves only to give them something to complain about.  I believe they come to the conclusion that people like the book because they like reading good crap.

[G-Flex]

being colder that room temperature because they are not actually 'alive'

It's kind of hilarious when you think about the thermodynamic implications of this, although constant high temperature would be much more useful for preventing the heat death of the universe. Then again, we have the same problem with nether caps.

I believe they come to the conclusion that people like the book because they like reading good crap.

I wish I could believe you, but having known some people who like the books/movies... no, that's not the case. Well, it's the case for some people, but not all.

Also, from what little I've read of the first book, I disagree with your allegation that Stephenie Meyers can write competently, whether about trash or not.

[LordZorintrhox]

I said nothing of competently; Troll 2 is a trainwreck, but it is a perfectly conceived and executed bad film.  I'm saying more that Meyers has the innate ability to write crap properly, that is, crap that is entertainingly bad.  By "good crap" I mean "crap that hits a nerve", whether in those that do not like it, in which case they love to hate it, or those that do like it, in which case they love the mind-numbing experience of watching a bunch of teenagers whine about their lots in life when they alone are responsible for it.  And then watching Bella get raped ravished deflowered by Jacob in an incredibly unsexy rape love(?) scene.

The conclusion the characters come to is indeed along those lines, but I am paraphrasing and I don't have a copy handy.  The whole business is a joke in any case; Paterson has said he played the character like a stalker on purpose, and Meyers has (at least I was told) indicated that the whole thing is really one big sexual fantasy of her own design.  If she thinks succubi are sexy, she should try actually being haunted by one (or on the scientific angle, experience chronic sleep paralysis).  Being spiritually raped every night is not most people's idea of a satisfying sexual experience.

[G-Flex]

Meyers has (at least I was told) indicated that the whole thing is really one big sexual fantasy of her own design.

Yeah, people apparently think it's dead sexy for a 117-year-old man to be lounging around the high school cafeteria looking for fresh meat. Especially when he's also a naturally vicious predator who explicitly warns her that he's designed to draw her in against her will, and very well may kill her.

The hilarious part is that, at least judging by the movies (like hell I'm reading those books), Jacob is damn near the same thing when it comes to being emotionally dangerous as fuck.

Basically, yeah, it's a fantasy book about how glorious abusive relationships are; everything about Bella and Jacob says "run away, right now, and never look back" but the series promotes that sort of warped but all-too-common "it's okay, he's good on the inside and I can change him or learn to tame him" mentality.

[Montague]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fictionhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fiction

The idea is to take every one of these sorts of traits, and then throw them with a dice roll with every world gen.

Sparkly skin and pedophilia were ruled out for DF due to copyright issues. So don't worry about that. Think "Dracula" as the 1897 novel vs "Guns, Drugs and Monsters" as the 2002 novel, not so much, er, "True Blood" or "Twilight".

[Angel Of Death]

Twilight. The wonderful story of a girls choice of necrophillia or beastiality.

That's not my line, it's just too awesome not to say.

[Cruxador]

I certainly hope they have the potential to sparkle. There's no reason to cut that out merely because it's a thing that originates in poorly written romance.

EDIT: Also we can mod in wooden stakes and now become Buffy.

I suspect wooden stakes will be included in vanilla. All Toady needs to do is extend the knapping framework to also extend sharpening, and add sticks obtainable in the same way as rocks are.

The twinkly part is unlikely.  However, the other aspects, those of near indestructibility, sun-proofing, super-strength, and agility are certainly possible and probably going to show up.  The more bizarre attributes, like somehow being colder that room temperature because they are not actually 'alive' while at the same time being not only capable of getting it up without a heartbeat but also apparently virile are probably not.

Both of those "bizarre" things would be very easy for Toady to implement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fiction

It works better if you have the url only once in the tag. Like so: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fiction

Sparkly skin and pedophilia were ruled out for DF due to copyright issues. So don't worry about that. Think "Dracula" as the 1897 novel vs "Guns, Drugs and Monsters" as the 2002 novel, not so much, er, "True Blood" or "Twilight".

Cite this claim, please. Because that is not how copyrights work. If it was then that Meyer girl wouldn't have been able to have vampires that suck blood, because Dracula did it before her.

[HollowClown]

I certainly hope they have the potential to sparkle. There's no reason to cut that out merely because it's a thing that originates in poorly written romance.

Agreed, especially coupled with the rest of the randomly-generated attributes.  "The vampire Edward McNightcreature has arrived.  He has six legs and his hair is made of vomit.  His eyes are red, his skin sparkles.  He has a weakness to silver and pig-tail fiber socks."

Cite this claim, please. Because that is not how copyrights work. If it was then that Meyer girl wouldn't have been able to have vampires that suck blood, because Dracula did it before her.

Toady mentioned this in DF Talk #14, while discussing the new vampire system.  He might have been joking;  then, again, perhaps not.

[Melagius]

The twinkly part is unlikely.  However, the other aspects, those of near indestructibility, sun-proofing, super-strength, and agility are certainly possible and probably going to show up.  The more bizarre attributes, like somehow being colder that room temperature because they are not actually 'alive' while at the same time being not only capable of getting it up without a heartbeat but also apparently virile are probably not.

Having read some of Eclipse as a party activity, I can say that the books are expertly crafted bad fiction, like a soap opera.  Meyers knows it too, because that book has an extended, clearly self-referential conversation between Bella and Edward about how much their counterparts in Wurthering Heights suck as human beings and are essentially lost causes of pettiness and stupidity, existing in an unrealistic and fundamentally broken universe that serves only to give them something to complain about.  I believe they come to the conclusion that people like the book because they like reading good crap.

At least Twilight fans know their book sucks, Harry Potter Fans are still somehow convinced J.K. Rowling is a good writer.

[Sunday]

Sparkly skin and pedophilia were ruled out for DF due to copyright issues. So don't worry about that. Think "Dracula" as the 1897 novel vs "Guns, Drugs and Monsters" as the 2002 novel, not so much, er, "True Blood" or "Twilight".

Cite this claim, please. Because that is not how copyrights work. If it was then that Meyer girl wouldn't have been able to have vampires that suck blood, because Dracula did it before her.

Dracula (as well as the concept of the vampire as a bloodsucker, which, IIRC, goes back at least to the early 1800s and the poem by Lord Byron), is plainly in the public domain (and has been for a long time), and is not protected by copyright.

That said, I don't think the idea of "sparkly skinned vampires" would probably be protected by copyright: copyright protects expression, not ideas. And it has been interpreted (at least in the US) to protect individual characters; but it probably doesn't protect characters on the level of generality Toady would be "copying."

That said, if Toady was threatened with legal action by Ms. Meyers, it probably doesn't matter whether he was in the right or not: hiring a copyright lawyer to contest it would probably cost a lot more than he can afford, and it's perfectly understandable if he just wants to avoid the whole thing.

[LordZorintrhox]

The twinkly part is unlikely.  However, the other aspects, those of near indestructibility, sun-proofing, super-strength, and agility are certainly possible and probably going to show up.  The more bizarre attributes, like somehow being colder that room temperature because they are not actually 'alive' while at the same time being not only capable of getting it up without a heartbeat but also apparently virile are probably not.

Both of those "bizarre" things would be very easy for Toady to implement.

I agree, however it seems like something low enough on the list of possibilities that he might not.  On the other hand, homeotherm is a simple attribute of all creatures, so it could be way easier than many other aspects.  Since hearts in DF don't beat int he first place, in retro spect the second point is even sillier to mention.  I guess I wanted to rail on the inherent unscientific 'science' of Meyers' vampires.

Also, just because it took me a few minutes to realize it, I think using a capital N for vampires is kinda clever (for Nosferatu, though apparantly the word isn't all its cracked up to be).

[Adamantine Fist]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fictionhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vampire_traits_in_folklore_and_fiction

The idea is to take every one of these sorts of traits, and then throw them with a dice roll with every world gen.
...

If one were to take every trait on that list, one could end up with muppet vampires and duck vampires. I'm hoping Toady stick to more reasonable characteristics on that one.