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Raid a small village

3 (27.3%)

Act like highwaymen

1 (9.1%)

Attack a weak caravan

5 (45.5%)

Loiter at our tower

1 (9.1%)

Other (specify in post

1 (9.1%)

Total Members Voted: 11

[Grek]

Your character sheet is still set to private,  choobakka.
For the penalty for host dying thing, DC 15 Fort vs. losing 200 xp/level would be fine, given that I don't lose xp for volunterly switching host bodies. An alternative penalty could be DC 20 Will vs. Unconciousness for 1d4 hours.

My current plan to play a puppteteer bard who's bardic 'music' is a psionic drone that dulls the mind, drowns out fear and ensnares the senses with its monsterous monotones. I thought about playing a psion, but that would mean having to sort through the lists of psionic abilities to find things that fit my character concept. Which would take lots and lots of effort for something that I can do just as easily with a base class.

Here's my character sheet using the basic puppeteer stats until I get an answer with regards to who's stats I should roll for:
http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=300908

[choobakka]

Whoops. Clicked the check box instead of the eye. Fixed now. Also, do you know why we're in this cave and not killing each other? Maybe we should start the campaign a little before the "you meet in a tavernisolated cave in a forest".

[Hastur]

so why is psionics so popular? i dont get it. i dont see the appeal. are the rules for it cheatery or something?

[choobakka]

I think it's the "Wooo, I'm a psychic, bow to me, I can move shit with my mind!" factor.

[Heron TSG]

If that's the case, Chokers should be way more popular. "Woo, I'm a choker! Bow to me! I can choke shit with my hands!" Hard to use a mind without oxygen.

PS: Working on more chokertude.

[Heron TSG]

Yeah, most races have more abilities, like a Choker. 'Bolds tend to be sorta weak, other then the NA, shifters happen to not spend a bunch of time shifted (and they are not that great else wise), and I am unaware of the other races. The fact is, yeah you can optimize past it, but you can do that with anything, especially your choker. The question is not can I make a build that trivializes this, but rather can I make a build that trivializes this even better with it.

The fact is, most player races have a some moderate abilities or few moderate abilities and a good ability. You have a full five good abilities, with very very little bad things to cancel it out.

Normal chokers are cheap as hell. This choker is nerfed to hell. For one thing, little to no skills is a bad thing. They are damnably slow. They can't be buffed by many low level spells because they are not humanoid. Their natural weapons do no more damage than a punch. Quickness is now only as good as Rapid Shot. Even the gnoll accepted earlier had 1 NA. If you're talking about the climbing ability, Grippli get 20 climb speed and 30 land speed, +12 to climb checks, they can always take 10, and they cannot be knocked off of something they are climbing. Chokers climb like molasses in comparison to that 0 LA race.

(PS: Kobolds are by far the most broken race in the game.)

The choker is too overpowered. It'll work if you get rid of the Improved Initiative feat, Improved Grab, and Quickness.

Here, I'll nerf it more. However, I will make a counterproposal, moving certain things around. Tell me what you think.

Spoiler: Proposed Choker (click to show/hide)

      Choker

    * +2 Strength, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -4 Int, -2 Cha
    * Small size.
    * 10' Reach
    * A choker’s base land speed is 20 feet. A choker has a base climb speed of 10 feet.
    * Darkvision out to 60 feet.
    * Quickness (Limited to bonus attack or grapple.)
    * Chokers have a natural weapon in their tentacles. (1d3 damage)
    * Special Attacks: Improved Grab, Constrict (1d3 damage)
    * Racial Skills: Chokers have a +8 racial bonus to climb and can always take 10 on climb checks.
    * Racial Feats: None.
    * Automatic Languages: Common, Undercommon. Bonus Languages: Goblin, Drow Sign
    * Favored Class: Fighter.

I took out the natural armor and improved initiative. I edited the stats to be much less min-max-full while still retaining the fact that chokers are as dumb as rocks. Quickness isn't too bad, so I left that in for now. Seriously, a single extra attack/grapple isn't bad at all. Rapid shot does about the same thing.

FOR REFERENCE USAGE. My notes are added for comparison as I formulate what to do next if this proposal is rejected.

Spoiler: Gnoll Stats (click to show/hide)

Strength +2, Constitution +2, Intelligence -2, Charisma -2.
Size Medium.
A gnoll’s base land speed is 30 feet.
Darkvision out to 60 feet.
Racial Skills: A gnoll gains a +2 racial bonus on all Spot and Listen checks.
Racial Feats: A gnoll gains feats according to its class levels.
+1 natural armor bonus.
Automatic Languages: Gnoll. Bonus Languages: Common, Draconic, Elven, Goblin, Orc.
Favored Class: Ranger.

It's faster, it has natural armor, its stats balance out to the same number mine do, and it gets bonus skills that it actually needs (instead of a stat that is barely ever used because I already have a climb speed)

Spoiler: Puppeteer Stats (click to show/hide)

Worm: A puppeteer is a limbless worm and therefore cannot wield weapons or manipulate objects without a host body. Furthermore, it has a base strength of 1. Puppeteers are fine sized.

Enthrall (Ex): If a puppeteer comes into physical contact with a person it has charmed, the subject acts as if dominated. So long as the puppeteer remains in contact with the victim, the domination remains in effect, even if a check would normally indicate that the effect is broken. While the  puppeteer is attached to a host body, it is treated as if it were grappling with the host body for the purposes of being attacked and as an attended magic item for the purposes of saving throws.

Psi-Like Abilities: 3/day - detect psionics, mental barrier, psionic charm (DC 13). Manifester level 1st. The save DCs are Charisma-based.

Blindsight (Ex): A puppeteer can ascertain creatures by nonvisual means within 60 feet.

Hide Mind (Su): A puppeteer cannot be identified as psionic by divination spells or clairsentience powers.

Telepathy (Su): A puppeteer can communicate telepathically with any creature within 20 feet that has a language.

This class gets +4 armor as an immediate action thrice per day. (How much more could it need?) It can charm an enemy thrice per day. It has 60' blindsight, not just Darkvision. It can bypass language barriers without spending horrendous amounts of skill points or casting a spell.

Spoiler: Tiefling Stats (click to show/hide)

      Tiefling

    * +2 Intelligence, –2 Charisma.
    * Medium size.
    * A tiefling’s base land speed is 30 feet.
    * Darkvision out to 60 feet.
    * Racial Skills: Tieflings have a +2 racial bonus on Bluff and Hide checks.
    * Racial Feats: A tiefling gains feats according to its class levels.
    * Automatic Languages: Common, Infernal. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, Halfling, Orc.
    * Favored Class: Rogue.

This race is pretty weak in comparison, it's in here for completion instead of comparison.

[Grek]

so why is psionics so popular? i dont get it. i dont see the appeal. are the rules for it cheatery or something?

They don't make brain worms in diet arcane flavour.

E:
Alternate Choker:

Choker
* +2 Strength, +2 Dex, +2 Con, -4 Int, -2 Cha
* Small size.
* 10' Reach
* A choker’s base land speed is 20 feet. A choker has a base climb speed of 10 feet.
* Darkvision out to 60 feet.
* Quickness: Chokers can make an extra move action per round, even when making a full round action.
* Choking: Chokers gain the Improved Grab and Constrict special attacks instead of a feat at their first level.
* Chokers have a natural weapon in their tentacles. (1d3 damage)
* Racial Skills: Chokers have a +8 racial bonus to climb and can always take 10 on climb checks.
* Automatic Languages: Common, Undercommon. Bonus Languages: Goblin, Drow Sign
* Favored Class: Fighter.

[choobakka]

I think the tiefling is so weak because it's a race that's actually human (or half-human), so there's not much to change. Also, can we have some background on the campaign? Or are you saving that for the first session? Because it would really help with the end part of my bio.

[Lord Braindead]

Di'rac has been summoned to this thread.
Currently he has 2HD like the template but that would put him at a theoretical level of 2 instead of 1 but reversing this is easy.
His rolled stats are noted under score, the temp score are his stats after applying the Lemure modifiers. Since this will change a lot due to the whole evolving process i thought it would be convenient to have the basics noted down.

I'm still on the fence regarding the whole Devil idea. They get some quite nice stuff with higher ranks that should, in theory, make them highly unbalanced, (Spiked Devil has 25 Dex witch would translate to a +15 Bonus for me. ) but i cant shake the feeling that there is something that will screw me over utterly.

Anyway, your thoughts so far?

[Heron TSG]

25 dex is only a +7 bonus. ((Stat-10)/2) round down, and all that.

Grek, that version is pretty neat-o, too. I guess I'll see what Araph says to both of them. The only comment I have is that a move action is generally more useful than an attack/grapple (not standard), but I'd be cool with either.

[Grek]

Dr 5/good or silver is a pretty sweet bonus as are the immunities, resistances and so forth, but given that you have no class skills, terrible attributes, lack of armour proficencies and other misc weaknesses, I think it balances out to average. Not 100% sure about starting with two HD. What does the Brand of the Nine Hells-Asmodeus feat do?

[Araph]

At a glance, I'm approving Bararossa's version of the choker. I didn't think as much of the actual merits of the bonuses, just the fact that their were bonuses. My bad.

Braindead, your DR is a bit too overpowered. Immunities I'll pass, but not DR. For higher tier devilry, it'll have to be homebrewed to not be insanely overpowered.

I think the tiefling is so weak because it's a race that's actually human (or half-human), so there's not much to change.

Actually, I took out abilities that I wanted the tiefling to have because I didn't want to seem like I was overpowering my character. Looking at the other stuff, what I wanted to have in doesn't seem that unbalancing, but I won't add it unless everyone else is fine with it.

Spoiler:  Slightly Overpowered Tiefling (click to show/hide)

      Tiefling -- Slightly Overpowered Version
    * +2 Intelligence, –2 Charisma.
    * Medium size.
    * A tiefling’s base land speed is 30 feet.
    * Darkvision out to 60 feet.
    * Special Qualities: Resistance to fire 5.
    * Racial Abilities: Shadowstep -- A tiefling can step through a shadow and exit another shadow up to 5 feet per class level away. He can do this once more per day at levels 1, 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20.
    * Racial Skills: Tieflings have a +2 racial bonus on Bluff and Hide checks.
    * Racial Feats: A tiefling gains feats according to its class levels.
    * Automatic Languages: Common, Infernal. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, Halfling, Orc.
    * Favored Class: Rogue.

If everyone is ok with it, I'll use this version instead of the original version. Shadowstep is an ability tieflings have in 4e, but I liked the idea of it. Plus it fits with their favored class.

As for info on the campaign...

Though the world itself is dangerous, the more powerful of the city-states throughout the countryside are at peace. Though smaller factions wage war, few wars are on a great enough scale to affect the caravan routes criss-crossing the land. All of the cities marked at the edge of the oceans are thriving due to trade. The dwarven mountainhomes (the city's embedded in the sides of the mountains) are powerful militarily and have great wealth, though they rarely send caravans to other cities. The cities to the south-east of the map are far poorer, surrounded by infertile deserts and few oasis'. They're unmarked because of their small size, but there are cities there; not just small towns and villages. The plains in the center of the map are rural areas and untamed wilderness. Bandits infest the land there, and caravans through that area are heavily armed. Even so, small pockets of civilization dot the landscape. The city in the center of the map is the most populous city, with nearly all major caravan routes from the east to the west passing through it. Any area you choose will have smaller villages thrown in for flavor.

As for the group's background... I have no idea. Maybe we were working for a fiend or something. Maybe we were all in a dungeon. I dunno.

EDIT: Oh, yeah. For the puppeteer, use the basic stats for the worm, roll for your thrall's stats. You'll pretty much only interact with stuff through your lackey, right?

DOUBLE EDIT: Also, vote for a location. If you've already voted, please repost. And if I've approved of someone's character sheet, could you please remind me who I approved of? I seem to have forgotten.

TRIPLE EDIT: And please hurry with voting. I have a town to draw in Maptool, but I can't do that until the town has been chosen.

QUADRUPLE EDIT: Actually, could everyone who's character sheet I'm going to approve repost it as well? Thanks.

[choobakka]

Hreeka the Striped. Still not completely finished. Also, I would say near a hamlet in the forest southwest of the northeasternmost town.

My sheet and vote.

[Araph]

I believe you have too many skill points spent.

Actually, I believe your class skills are wrong. Click the button at the top of the skills list that says 'Update CC'.

[Lord Braindead]

Braindead, your DR is a bit too overpowered. Immunities I'll pass, but not DR. For higher tier devilry, it'll have to be homebrewed to not be insanely overpowered.

Both accepted, took out the DR but i hope i can get it back at higher levels. I'm also quite content with the homebrewed stuff since i wanted to go more in the direction of a deceiver then that of a brute fighter that make up most of the higher tier devils. I have the connections, abilities and lack of morals needed to deal in souls so why the hells should i smash someone into paste when i can forge gear from them and earn brownie points in the nine hells? 

Dr 5/good or silver is a pretty sweet bonus as are the immunities, resistances and so forth, but given that you have no class skills, terrible attributes, lack of armour proficencies and other misc weaknesses, I think it balances out to average. Not 100% sure about starting with two HD. What does the Brand of the Nine Hells-Asmodeus feat do?

Well, the DR is out but the immunities are still very nice. Most of the low tier spells my wizard in an other DnD group uses would be utterly useless against Di'rac and i think i can take on fighters quite well without the DR. My suspicion mainly arose because of the insane stuff high-tier devils gets but with that taken care off by homebrew content i look forward to serve my terrible masters back at home.
The Brand of the Nine Hells feat just means that i have sworn loyalty to an archduke, in this case Asmodeus, and i get a bit of power in return. The Asmodeus variant allows me to use Command as a swift action three times a day as a spell like ability. Very nice for crowd control, keeping our squishier allies safe and provoking AoO.

But wait, there is more! It also enables an other feat, Mark of Nessus.
When ever someone wants to attack someone with the Mark or target him with Spells, spell like abilities, divine powers, etc., he must make a DC(10+1/2HD+CHA modifier) willsave. If he fails, he cant do that action and must chose another target or an other actions. Once he succeeds he can target the mark bearer as usual and cant be effected again by the mark for 24h.
Additionally it allows me to enhance a natural attack with 1d6 hellfire once per round but this pales in comparison to the cant-touch-this aura.

Location Vote: Roughly the central area. Preferably close to at least minor mountains for our dungeon.
Background Vote: What Glowcat said sounds good for me. We would have a (somewhat) safe home and a reason for the freakshow that we are.

My only other suggestion for a backstory would be that we are escaped "rarities" from the collection of an exceptionally weird wizard. However, unlike normal DnD groups we cant just rest in an Inn and buy supplies at the market. Our first goal would probably be to find a shelter anyway and we can bypass that by starting directly in a dungeon. We will still need to take it over but i don't fancy the idea to spend our first round with the frantic search for a howel to keep our heads (or similar anatomy) dry.