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Author Topic: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea  (Read 5203 times)

Araph

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Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« on: May 22, 2011, 10:26:04 pm »

I got this idea from what happened in a D&D game I played in earlier today. Our group, through our bad skills at guarding caravans, acquired a wagon. Then we bought another wagon. We planned on using said wagons (and trade goods) to bait bandits into attacking us, as well as using them to make money trading. My idea for a campaign is that we expand on other parts of the game than just dungeoneering and questing, so maybe instead of fighting through hordes of mooks to get treasure, we try to set up a trade empire, or conquer somewhere, or ally with a nation, or try to reach godhood, etc. Something on a little larger scale, or maybe with a twist. We could be the bad guys, and the DM could send parties of hero's to fight us. We could play as monsters instead of PC's. This might sound like a dumb idea to most people, but it seems like it could be fun to me. Anyone interested?
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choobakka

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2011, 10:29:07 pm »

Look at my RTD, Roll to planejump. Observe Schilcote's mysterious posts about The Plan. Then look at our theories. Stuff like that.
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Araph

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2011, 10:32:30 pm »

I'm slightly confused. What does that have to do with this?
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choobakka

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2011, 10:46:50 pm »

And I quote:

"Becoming rulers of our own planes?"
"You mechanize everything and become ruler of the universe?"

Stuff like that. Sorry if I was unclear. Also, a suggestion of my own: become the BBEGs of the world. Start out by robbing convenience stores, work up to conquering nations.
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Criptfeind

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2011, 10:51:37 pm »

Aaaaanyway.

My answer to this is a huh?

I thought that all was pretty much what mid to high level DnD was about.
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mainiac

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2011, 10:58:38 pm »

Looking at the more economic side of a fantasy world has always been something that's interested me a bit.  It would be cool to have a world where you could be traders in more then the most abstracted sense.  I think we kinda went a little overboard in Jack's game however, he wasn't expecting so much.

The difficulty of such an idea lies in the fact that the economics of DnD are seriously, seriously nonsensical.  Your typical 1st level adventurer starts with more money then a level one commoner will ever have.  You can hire an untrained peasant for 1 sp a day, barely enough to feed their family on bread and water, let alone provide them with things like clothes!  The 300 or so gold that you start with is the equivalent of 10 years wages!  And that 300 gold isn't enough to afford fairly basic magical crafting that a somewhat low level wizard could make.  But PC money is supposed to be balanced towards combat and level appropriate loot while npc money is supposed to be minimal to keep it from being an annoyance.

I think such a project would need to completely overhaul prices (a not trivial task) and look at things from a more medieval standpoint and not put in our conceptions from a world where you can go to Walmart and see everything for a low, low price.
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Ancient Babylonian god of RAEG
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
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Araph

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2011, 11:13:05 pm »

Good point. And yeah, we went way overboard in Jack's game. I feel kinda bad about it now, since it went something like this.

Jack: Ok, so you just defeated the traitors in the warehouse, what do you do now?

Everyone else: Start a caravan! I'm gonna trade in silk, magic items, scrolls, love potions, linen, foodstuffs, gold, and badger cheese. What gets me the best prices?

Jack: . . .

Anyway, the costs of things would be a problem. I was thinking we could just comb over the lists of equipment and services in the SRD and set some basic prices, at which point the DM would wing it whenever we bought stuff. Just have a standard price and adjust it up and down based on the place you're buying it at and whatnot. Maybe we could have a list of multipliers for cost, like if the town is going through a shortage of a certain item, it's price is multiplied by 3 or you can't find it.

Then again, we could just steer the whole thing in a different direction. I like the idea of playing as monsters and having to fight off the PC races and stuff. It'd be like playing DF with the Kobold camp mod!
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mainiac

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2011, 11:23:24 pm »

Good point. And yeah, we went way overboard in Jack's game. I feel kinda bad about it now, since it went something like this.

Jack: Ok, so you just defeated the traitors in the warehouse, what do you do now?

Everyone else: Start a caravan! I'm gonna trade in silk, magic items, scrolls, love potions, linen, foodstuffs, gold, and badger cheese. What gets me the best prices?

Jack: . . .

Anyway, the costs of things would be a problem. I was thinking we could just comb over the lists of equipment and services in the SRD and set some basic prices, at which point the DM would wing it whenever we bought stuff. Just have a standard price and adjust it up and down based on the place you're buying it at and whatnot. Maybe we could have a list of multipliers for cost, like if the town is going through a shortage of a certain item, it's price is multiplied by 3 or you can't find it.

Then again, we could just steer the whole thing in a different direction. I like the idea of playing as monsters and having to fight off the PC races and stuff. It'd be like playing DF with the Kobold camp mod!

The SRD is a pretty bad place to start.  I looked into this a couple years back.  It seemed to me at the time that some of the SRD prices (the stuff npc's use) are loosely based on 13th century england (although it might have just been a coincidence).  But a lot of the other stuff was complete ass-pull and doesn't even make sense when you stop to think about it.  A big problem is that the only historical reference we have is based on a serf economy while DnD does not appear to be based on a world where 90% of people are farmers.

To give an example of the inconsistencies in the SRD.  In order to make really humble clothes, you'd need a least a couple yards of cloth.  The cheapest cloth available would be linen (really crappy linen, not the stuff you would have seen.)  The price for two yards of linen in the SRD is 8 GP.  The price of a peasants outfit is 1 SP.  The only way that would make sense is if the peasants were wearing less then four square inches of cloth...
« Last Edit: May 22, 2011, 11:39:31 pm by mainiac »
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Ancient Babylonian god of RAEG
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"Don't tell me what you value. Show me your budget and I will tell you what you value"
« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
mainiac is always a little sarcastic, at least.

Grek

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2011, 11:41:02 pm »

      Just thought I'd drop off this essay:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Criptfeind

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2011, 11:45:31 pm »

Yeah. That guy is pretty good, if a bit elitist in some ways, but you should credit him when you post his stuff.
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Grek

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2011, 11:58:37 pm »

Frank has repeatedly stated that he does not care if you credit him or not. So I don't bother.
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mainiac

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2011, 12:04:29 am »

Entertaining read, where's it from?
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Ancient Babylonian god of RAEG
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[CAN_INTERNET]
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"Don't tell me what you value. Show me your budget and I will tell you what you value"
« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
mainiac is always a little sarcastic, at least.

Grek

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2011, 12:22:26 am »

Frank Trollman's dungeonomicon series of essays, available here.
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Frelock

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2011, 12:37:32 am »

Very interesting read.

But yea, economics in D&D are horribly broken.  Adventurers basically have prices inflated far beyond what anyone working as a normal laborer can afford(a normal laborer would have to work 3 days just to afford a 1 day stay at a poor inn with poor food).  Heck for the price of 1 day of poor food, you can get 5 loaves of bread; far more than anyone could eat in a single day.  If your stableboy is a trained laborer, the feed that he gives each horse is worth 1/6 of his day's wages.  It's all just hand-waved away so you can get back to crawling through your dungeons and saving the world.

Take this examples from a recent campaign I was in.  We were a bunch of plucky lvl 4 adventurers, off following some strange group of golems that had sacked a nearby village.  Followed them, finished them off, then found where they were going; a bronze city.  Though our DM subtly warned us not to go there, we went anyway and encounters a giant scorpion-like golem.  We were supposed to run away, a challenge that we shouldn't have been able to defeat, but we were able to beat it (sacrificing my character in the process).  Now we come to the key point; our DM had us face a golem made of adamantine.  An astute player in our party noticed this, and we took our little donkey and hauled back a single claw.  With just that claw, we were able to buy out our entire home village.  Any sort of an economy that was going on there was instantly ruined.  And even with that large influx of adamantine, the price of it didn't drop at all.  Adamatine weapons were still worth the same, even though cold iron would probably have been more rare at the time.  Supply and demand are completely ignored; the only restriction is "does this place have what I'm looking for."

The campaign idea you have sounds like fun though, even if a D&D system might not be suitable for the task.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2011, 12:40:21 am by Frelock »
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mainiac

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Re: Gauging interest for a Weird D&D 3.5 Campaign Idea
« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2011, 12:43:50 am »

Not necessarily.  The adamantium would get exported.  Sure, there would be a huge influx of wealth, but there would be a huge influx of imported goods on which that wealth would be sent.  It would be like if you took a random town in California and found gold in it.  Sure, prices went up a bit, but it's not like all economic life stopped.
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Ancient Babylonian god of RAEG
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[CAN_INTERNET]
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"Don't tell me what you value. Show me your budget and I will tell you what you value"
« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
mainiac is always a little sarcastic, at least.
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