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[Putnam]

Is dodging skillshots really "outplaying"? It seems more a twitch reflex thing than that.

[Arcvasti]

Eviscerated? They nerfed his burst slightly and gave him a one-person % damage amp on his R to compensate. From what I can see, this means Fizz is good at two things: Being a slippery bastard and instagibbing a single target if he lands his combo. That's all assassins should be good at. Having good sustainable damage and healing debuffs shouldn't be added to the mix.

Ranked woes: Got carried by an awesome Jax one game and won. Played against the same Jax the next game and he wrecked us, since our Pantheon fed him some kills early and then roamed around[Badly], letting him split push down to our inhibitor tower. Karma at its finest.

[UXLZ]

Is dodging skillshots really "outplaying"? It seems more a twitch reflex thing than that.

That's true enough, but with the current way the skill is, often you'll get clipped by some sort of CC as the channel finishes, which is really annoying.

[UXLZ]

Just played a game of support GP. It took WAAAAY longer than it should have.

http://matchhistory.oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/OC1/76641554/200168539/eog

The Rengar was challenger last season.

[Flying Dice]

OCE Challenger, so something like Bronze II EUW, right? 

--

Though you do seem to have missed the point I was making, considering that you repeated it back to me. My point was that if a champion has the ability to blow someone up, they need to have weaknesses. Take AP Tristana as she was; yes, she also had a reset on her jump, but that was counterbalanced by its long cooldown and vulnerability to CC. And yes, I'd call AP Ez an assassin. It's the closest you'll get to an accurate descriptor, since he doesn't waveclear, isn't an ADC when built AP, doesn't do sustained damage, doesn't build tanky, &c.... He does two things: Q poke, and jump onto a target to blow them up. Sometimes it's QWQER, sometimes it's QEWQR, but if you're not using your E in your combo you're doing it wrong (and you're also not going to kill anyone who doesn't suck).

That said, I wouldn't be adverse to seeing his E tweaked to include 'prioritizes enemy champions', but that'd necessitate a nerf to counterbalance that certainty of damage. The easy way to do it would be bumping the CD up a couple more seconds to increase the penalty if someone goes in without knowing they can kill. Though arguably the E unreliability is something of a skillcap, since it only affects people who faceroll rather than aiming the cursor. Really, man, the main thing keeping AP Ez from being securely in-meta is his lack of waveclear combined with the fact that he's just not quite as good at blowing people up as the top-tier assassins.

[UXLZ]

OCE Challenger, so something like Bronze II EUW, right? 

--

Though you do seem to have missed the point I was making, considering that you repeated it back to me. My point was that if a champion has the ability to blow someone up, they need to have weaknesses. Take AP Tristana as she was; yes, she also had a reset on her jump, but that was counterbalanced by its long cooldown and vulnerability to CC. And yes, I'd call AP Ez an assassin. It's the closest you'll get to an accurate descriptor, since he doesn't waveclear, isn't an ADC when built AP, doesn't do sustained damage, doesn't build tanky, &c.... He does two things: Q poke, and jump onto a target to blow them up. Sometimes it's QWQER, sometimes it's QEWQR, but if you're not using your E in your combo you're doing it wrong (and you're also not going to kill anyone who doesn't suck).

That said, I wouldn't be adverse to seeing his E tweaked to include 'prioritizes enemy champions', but that'd necessitate a nerf to counterbalance that certainty of damage. The easy way to do it would be bumping the CD up a couple more seconds to increase the penalty if someone goes in without knowing they can kill. Though arguably the E unreliability is something of a skillcap, since it only affects people who faceroll rather than aiming the cursor. Really, man, the main thing keeping AP Ez from being securely in-meta is his lack of waveclear combined with the fact that he's just not quite as good at blowing people up as the top-tier assassins.

No idea, he didn't really seem too amazing, but he was at least better than average.

"Seriously, this is weird. I'd wear someone keeps calling for me. Am I being summoned?"

My point was that if a champion has the ability to blow someone up, they need to have weaknesses.

Agreed. Except you've already mentioned his massive, enormous, huge weaknesses several times.

he doesn't waveclear

Also, don't forget that he has NO utility or CC outside of a pitiful attack speed boost attached to one of his important damage spells.
He also runs out of mana very quickly unless he builds a Tear (which is sub-optimal unless you're going Blue Build.)
Ezreal already has plenty of weaknesses.

but if you're not using your E in your combo you're doing it wrong (and you're also not going to kill anyone who doesn't suck).

I disagree, If you are using your E in your combo, unless you're certain you can kill them or get away with flash or something, or they're by themselves, you're doing it wrong.

That said, I wouldn't be adverse to seeing his E tweaked to include 'prioritizes enemy champions', but that'd necessitate a nerf to counterbalance that certainty of damage.

Yes, because I'll be damned if Ezreal's allowed to have one semi-reliable source of low to average damage without trading stuff away for it. *rolls eyes*

main thing keeping AP Ez from being securely in-meta is his lack of waveclear combined with the fact that he's just not quite as good at blowing people up as the top-tier assassins.

I don't want AP Ez to be securely in-meta, I want to be able to actually use his E to dodge stuff.
Yes, I'd say the thing keeping him out of being properly 'viable' is his lack of waveclear, CC, sticking power, and honestly a lot of times maneuverability. Compare him to someone like Zed or Khaz and he's just blown out of the water. They also have better sustained damage and 'tankiness' due to lifesteal.

I don't want a buff to his numbers, I just want the channel time on his E either reduced or removed so it's actually feasible to dodge crap with it. Either that or get rid of the weird hitbox lag it seems to have.

[Flying Dice]

There is this thing called 'prediction', you know. 

In case that wasn't clear enough, I'll outline the steps:

1. Using your eyes, find out what enemy champions are within the area.
2. Remember what their skills do, and the general ranges of the same.
3. Remember (or, if you don't know, guess) on what occasions they are likely to use those skills against you.
4. Play normally, positioning to avoid being threatened by enemy skills.
5. If the enemy makes a play or you find yourself out of position, refer to 2 and 3. Consider three situations:
   i. Enemy will not be able to take advantage of their play or your mistake. Walk clear and revert to 4.
   ii. Enemy will be able to take advantage of their play or your mistake. Continue to 6.
6. Given the enemy list of skills and their ranges and effects, estimate the likely positioning they will use. See subheadings:
   i. If your E directly away from the enemy will take you outside their effective range, do so.
   ii. If if will not, E laterally or diagonally (depending on terrain) in the direction you least expect the enemy to use their skill towards. Continue to 7.
   iii. If you are following ii. and there is a jumpable wall in your immediate area which would separate you from the enemy while also avoiding their skill, E over it. Continue to 7.
7. After using E laterally or diagonally, move away from enemy and/or towards teammates, or use your own skills against the enemy champion as the situation dictates.

Was that sufficient? Because sarcasm aside, the cast time isn't exactly a Fiddle ult. Take bot lane as an excellent example: unless you wait to E until that Blitz grab, Thresh Hook, Zenith Blade, Crescendo, &c. shows up on screen, you're fine. It's not the fault of the champion or the game if you play reactively rather than actively, responding to enemy skills rather than predicting when and where they're likely to be used.

[UXLZ]

Was that sufficient? Because sarcasm aside, the cast time isn't exactly a Fiddle ult. Take bot lane as an excellent example: unless you wait to E until that Blitz grab, Thresh Hook, Zenith Blade, Crescendo, &c. shows up on screen, you're fine. It's not the fault of the champion or the game if you play reactively rather than actively, responding to enemy skills rather than predicting when and where they're likely to be used.

The cast time isn't that long, but it's just enough to be clipped by things like Nid spears.

Generally that's the right way of playing... And the way you're 'outlining' it to me is honestly quite insulting to someone who has been playing the game for several years now... But if you try to just predict like that and you have good opponents who don't telegraph all their actions with big flashing signposts then you're just going to be wasting your E again... And again... And again... And again... And again (need I go on?). I mean, sure, sometimes it's super obvious, like if a Blitz tries to flash hook, but what's going to happen quite often is

1. The Blitz moves towards you and his team mate gets a bit more aggressive.
2. You think 'The Blitz is gonna hook!'
3. You E away thanks to your prediction.
4. The Blitz just sits there laughing at you.
5. i. You're zoned until your E is off cooldown.
    ii. You attempt to go in while your E is off cooldown and Blitz kills you.
6. Repeat ad nauseum.
 
Prediction is good, yes, but if you rely solely on prediction then you're just going to get baited into wasting your resources constantly.

[frostshotgg]

Ez's E is not a twitch dodge skill. It's one of the singular best positioning tools in the game. It's part of why you don't NEED to have a twitch dodge skill. It's a short uninterruptable cast time and to compensate he gets a huge dash on a tiny cooldown for relatively little mana cost.

Re: Fizz. It's definitely an evisceration. His W lost the exectute damage on the passive part, that's pretty huge. It means for him to be doing any sort of damage early game he has to activate W.

[Jiokuy]

As someone who isn't a huge fan of Ezreal as a whole, I think you might be exaggerating the power of his E all the same.

It's got a "long" CD for a main skill, although his q mechanic reduces that.

It's also the gold-standard for short range teleport. For comparison: Kassisdin's Ultimate, Zed's Shadow Clone swap max range, Tristana's Rocket Jump all vastly out-range this skill. An easy test of this, if a Fiora Q's you and you jump away, can she q you again? For Ez this is very much a yes.

In my experience of Ezreal, calling him an assassin is laughable. According to riot's recent post on why Zed is balanced, waveclear (to allow roaming) is
iconic to Assassins, along with a safe way of getting in and out of combat.

In my opinion, Ezreal is a variant of the poke/seige mage. He has a low cd (under 2s at max if it hits) med range poke that procs LB for a decent ap Reito. and He has a decent re-positioning and escape skill, that doubles as extra damage when kiting.

Also, imo, Ezreal's weakness are primarily that all of his skills are skillshots or autotargeting.

[UXLZ]

Ez's E is not a twitch dodge skill. It's one of the singular best positioning tools in the game. It's part of why you don't NEED to have a twitch dodge skill. It's a short uninterruptable cast time and to compensate he gets a huge dash on a tiny cooldown for relatively little mana cost.

Re: Fizz. It's definitely an evisceration. His W lost the exectute damage on the passive part, that's pretty huge. It means for him to be doing any sort of damage early game he has to activate W.

Wait, so you mean he has to use his abilities to do damage?

Shock and horror. xD

(I'm someone who quite firmly despises Fizz, by the way.)

[Putnam]

what nobody in this game does damage with right-clicks

[UXLZ]

Yeah, but they build AD.

[frostshotgg]

What's your defense of Teemo and Kayle then?

[Jiokuy]

What's your defense of Teemo and Kayle then?

Teemo and Kayle are not assassins. When built for right clicking they do sustained damage. Fizz's w passive added a lot of sustained damage and kill potential to an already very bursty assassin without significant deviation itemization,