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[Skyrunner]

My own calculations say that LW reaches peak efficiency at 124 armor, and falls off to either side.

Max damage is 10.7% extra.
http://codepad.org/HywAsRNY

[Sharp]

What do you mean by more effective against low armour champions? If a champ has low armour then your going to do more damage anyway, if they have high armour your going to do more damage with last whisper then without it. Your saying more effective but you have to consider the effect when LW is not applied.

However if a champion has low armour then Brutalizer will be more efficient and same for Black Cleaver or Yomuu's Ghostblade when compared with Last Whisper. However if your an AD carry then Last Whisper is really a required item because it becomes more effective then other solutions at around 70-100 armour (depending on how many Black Cleaver stacks are applied) and apart from other ad carries usually by midgame almost every other champ will have around that much armour.

Only adc who doesn't really need Last Whisper is vayne.

[Jopax]

So on a drunken whim I played a game of Quinn last night, now, I haven't played Quinn since last summer or somesuch, so I only new what her stuff does and that was about it.

But I carried so hard it wasn't even funny, despite some eariler trouble against the Jinx/Leona combo we got a few nice kills when they stupidly chose to ignore the fact that I have a fucking blind and peel and no matter how hard they jump on me, if I survive the initial CC then they really can't catch me, even their very fed GP had problems because after firing his Q he couldn't really do anything else to me, and I could easily burst him down while it was on CD. Really fun times with her, now I am seriously considering buying her, but I also want Vel'Koz, and I just bought Karthus the other day, I can't afford all this shit :C

[Skyrunner]

when is hexakill coming ;_;

[Skyrunner]

My own calculations say that LW reaches peak efficiency at 124 armor, and falls off to either side.

Max damage is 10.7% extra.
http://codepad.org/HywAsRNY

That's all? I never realised it was such a small increase. Makes me wonder when exactly LW is worth getting as opposed to another Bloodthirster or something else.

Oh, and I guess no one plays Cho? Never did get any replies to my question about how to build him in the jungle.

Yeah, it's surprisingly lackluster despite it being a core item on so many champions. But the 10% stacks up over multiple AAs.

[Sharp]

Oh, and I guess no one plays Cho? Never did get any replies to my question about how to build him in the jungle.

There are multiple ways, you can go AD, you can go AP, you can just go tank. Cho has quite good jungle clear and has some nice CC but unless you have a lot of AP your not going to be able to burst down enemies so when you gank you need to make sure your skillshots land and that the people in lane can do enough damage to kill the enemy.

It's probably best to build some tankiness as jungle cho to make it easier to tower-dive, it's probably better to go AD rather then AP because he has expensive abilities so you can't afford to use them to clear camps in the jungle and then have enough mana to to use all your abilities. Try and focus on Cooldown reduction items as it is important to be able to spam your abilities when you can.

It might sound odd but Zeke's Herald is quite nice on Jungle cho when ganking a lane with an AD champ with the increase in damage and lifesteal, it allows more damage to be done on the enemy and helps survival of team-mates.

Nice thing about Cho is that you can have a lot of choice in how you build him but imo as a jungler he needs to be tanky to help others get kills.

[Flying Dice]

when is hexakill coming ;_;

rioto pls

Might be getting held up by them dealing with the latest round of DDOS attacks. >.>


Unrelated: I recently bought Tristana and am now firmly in love. Not with her as an ADC, mind (though that might be biased because the one game I had doing that had 3 people who were constantly DCing and feeding), but with the AP build. Those AP ratios are just retarded, no other word for it. 150% on her ult is bad enough, but 100% on the E's DoT (plus a good base damage) isn't even funny. It's less obvious against AP casters with good CC, but I felt genuinely bad for what I did to a Kha'Zix and his Sion jungler, to the point where I gave them honors because they didn't rage in allchat. Every time he tried to gank I'd just instagib Kha and jump away as Sion stunned, then harass him with E until he ran away. o.0

[Skyrunner]

You... bought... TRISTANA?!

But you can get her and the Riot skin for free!

[Jopax]

Don't think that's possible anymore, Ali and his unchained still is but I think Trist got moved to the legacy vault a while ago. Besides, she's not that expensive.

[xaritscin]

but I also want Vel'Koz, I can't afford all this shit :C

i know that feel bro, i was closer to 5k IP as i was saving for the beholder, but getting better runes ate out all what i had saved......

[Sharp]

I think they should show LCS exhibition match of Hexakill

[penguinofhonor]

Maybe someone can tell me if I am missing something.

I did the math for how much extra damage you do with last whisper, and I kept getting fluctuations around 14% extra damage regardless of how much or how little armor the opponent has. Doesn't this make the last whisper more effective against low armor champions than high armor ones?

My own calculations say that LW reaches peak efficiency at 124 armor, and falls off to either side.

Max damage is 10.7% extra.
http://codepad.org/HywAsRNY

I felt like doing math too! And my results were different than either of yours! I'm not sure why. Physical damage mitigation is A/(A+100), where A is your armor.

Let's say I'm a Caitlyn with 200 AD attacking an enemy with 30 armor. Normally each autoattack is going to deal 153.8 damage. LW decreases their effective armor to 19.5 which increases your damage to 163.4 for a 6.2% increase in damage.

Now I'm attacking a mid-armor target. Let's say... 80? He's got a chain vest or something. Normally each autoattack is going to deal 111.1 damage. LW decreases their effective armor to 52, which increases your damage to 131.6 for a 19% increase in damage.

Now a high armor target! Let's do 150. Normally each autoattack is going to deal 80 damage. LW decreases their effective armor to 97.5, which increases your damage to 101.3 for a 27% increase in damage.

Next, a ridiculously armored target. 250 seems like a decent amount. You're a fed Caitlyn now and their Rammus has a couple high end armor items. Normally each attack is going to deal 57.1 damage. LW decreases their effective armor to 162.5, which increases your damage to 76.2 for a 33% increase in damage.

So my calculations show LW increasing in effectiveness as armor increases and never losing effectiveness. You get less of an increase per point of armor as the enemy stacks it higher (the damage boost decelerates, basically), but that's because armor mitigation decreases with every point of armor gained.

Only adc who doesn't really need Last Whisper is vayne.

I hope you're not skimping on armor pen on Vayne because of her W. I know nobody likes to talk about it, but she still deals vastly more physical damage than true damage.

[Flying Dice]

Don't think that's possible anymore, Ali and his unchained still is but I think Trist got moved to the legacy vault a while ago. Besides, she's not that expensive.

This. Also, it would require using facebook. I'm not going to do that for a skin that's basically just a hair recolor and a 1350IP champ; it'd take at least a 6800IP champ and new particle effects for me to forsake my integrity like that. 

[frostshotgg]

Only adc who doesn't really need Last Whisper is vayne.

Please for the love of god never say that again. Being bad is one thing, but actively trying to spread bad is another.

[Sharp]

1) I didn't say don't get LW on Vayne, im just saying out of all the AD carries LW is less of a necessity on her then on others.
2) Vayne doesn't need LW, other ADC's need LW vs an armour team, Vayne doesn't, a Bloodthirster/Phantom Dancer can easily replace LW and still kill Tanks just as easily.

To be honest I prefer getting a Trinity Force instead of LW to make kiting so much easier and the distance you can run while invisible after tumble is hilarious, doesn't mean that LW is bad on Vayne though, it's quite useful as it does make tumble hits much more effective, but then again a Trinity Force tumble proc also does a lot of damage. Overall I prefer doing slightly less damage for increased survivability.