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[Charmander]

I don't know how anyone can actually unwind playing League.

There are probably a few Bay12 teams going about. Team Pyramid in its various incarnations kinda suck, though.

[Chaoswizkid]

ARAM is pretty unwindable. SR is not. That's the case for me, anyway.

I'm up for a tournament.
Mid/Support/Top, in that order of preference. I can go ADC but someone else is likely a lot better, and I'm terribad at jungling because I never got into it.

[da dwarf lord]

Depends how you're playing, I'm usually with mates, so that's pretty cruisy, just mucking around and trolling (and still winning somehow )

[Flying Dice]

It really depends on your perspective. If you let yourself get angry every time someone does something stupid, sure, it'll be a constant exercise in frustration.

[sebcool]

I personally have had a pretty bad experience with SR, mainly because I don't know anyone to play with and am forced to play with complete strangers who always dc, feed, or are assholes. It's really infuriating playing with random people.

Playing with friends, now that's another thing.

[Wiles]

I don't know how anyone can actually unwind playing League.

It's all about how you approach the game really. A year or two ago I took the game fairly seriously when I played it and I'd get frustrated or angry when people made mistakes or played very poorly. Now I don't take it seriously at all and I have a lot more fun playing. When I say I don't take the game seriously I don't mean I'm mucking about, I just mean I don't really put the same value on actually winning as I did when I played before. I'm a lot more interested in having a positive and fun experience.

[Flying Dice]

I don't know how anyone can actually unwind playing League.

It's all about how you approach the game really. A year or two ago I took the game fairly seriously when I played it and I'd get frustrated or angry when people made mistakes or played very poorly. Now I don't take it seriously at all and I have a lot more fun playing. When I say I don't take the game seriously I don't mean I'm mucking about, I just mean I don't really put the same value on actually winning as I did when I played before. I'm a lot more interested in having a positive and fun experience.

This. A game where you try your hardest, fight a good fight, and lose terribly is still better than a game where your entire team rages, whines, feeds, and wins.

[SalmonGod]

This. A game where you try your hardest, fight a good fight, and lose terribly is still better than a game where your entire team rages, whines, feeds, and wins.

Main problem with this entire sentiment bolded, italicized, and underlined for good measure.

This is a problem with competitive games in general, but especially ones with snowball mechanics like this.  I'm quite happy to lose a good match.  The problem is when you spend the majority of a match feeling like you don't have a chance in hell, and you're just waiting for it to be over.  This is what happens when you make too many early mistakes or your teammates are just bad.  There's no fun when it doesn't feel like your efforts have any point.  The same goes for winning.  If your opponents are doing so badly that you could win without even trying, it's not very fun.  Sadly, this is what the majority of games on SR felt like for me.

In other words, these complaints aren't always about not winning.  They're about the game failing to deliver a challenge that is satisfying.  It's either frustrating and hopeless or just boring.

Oddly enough, I think ARAM is actually more balanced in this regard.  The majority of my ARAM games swing back and forth through the majority of the match and surprising outcomes are fairly common.  It also doesn't have the same pacing problems, where you often spend 3-4 minutes preparing for a fight that lasts 1.5 seconds, was based on an ambush that gave you or your opponent zero opportunity to fight back, and can result in the next 15-20 minutes feeling stupidly one-sided.

[Flying Dice]

Oh, I get that. It frustrates me to no end. I have my share of matches like that, but they're far and away not the majority. The key there is to literally stop caring once you get past a certain point--either surrender vote or concentrate on doing something that's funny even when you fail.

RE: ARAM. I don't know. If things fall out right and the team comps are balanced, it can be fun, but an unbalanced comp completely ruins the match, and too many are roflstomps where one team has a clear advantage, presses all the way to inhib, is briefly beaten back and wiped when they get cocky, and then comes back for the win. The obvious upsides of ARAM are that you get a lot more action without having to worry about CS, and that you get experience across a wider range of champs.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy it, but I like standard SR more for a couple reasons, the greatest of which is that ARAM doesn't really offer much opportunity for thought or planning. It's literally just basic teamfight tactics: Don't focus the tank, kill the carries and nukers first, don't be a moron. There's no potential for anything akin to roaming, ganking, stealing buffs or objectives, split-pushing, etc., which is admittedly by design. The closest I've had is passive-stealthing as Teemo, waiting for the enemy team to pass me by, and then grabbing a bunch of kills when they retreat after barely winning a teamfight.

That, and instead of there being a complex relationship of interactions between champs, you've got a handful who are godly in ARAM because of the nature of the map, a handful who are godly because they've got heals/natural sustain, a bunch who are mediocre, and some who are practically useless because their playstyles don't match ARAM. I will admit, though, that this week has made ARAM markedly more frustrating because half the matches are full of hookers. Er, Thresh and Naut, that is. :|

[Frumple]

... yeah, I admit. I kinda' want to see what an ARAM game looks like with a maxed CDR thresh in it. How's it go again? Q ends up with a CD of 7.2 seconds, with 3 of those shaved off if it hits something. That's gotta' be beautiful to observe. From a distance. All hook, all the time.

[Flying Dice]

It's really, really painful to play against if you're squishy. Though I've got to admit, I really like playing Nautilus in ARAM S'sorta a guilty pleasure, abusing his CC in tight quarters like that. Nearly as painful as his gloriously shitastic run animation with mobi boots.

[lemon10]

((I am aware that my response is pretty late, sorry about that))

How many EUW LoL players are there, by the wayż Haven't seen many in this thread...

You will never get nearly enough IP to play properly without: buying RP's, using a single hero role (eventually you can play a few more, but that takes quite a while), or not using proper runes for your role.

That's just wrong. Without ever paying anything I currently own 9 rune pages (from free RP + special offers) and have 230000 IP left (which would also easily buy me those pages if needed). Those 9 have so far sufficed for several roles, and would especially suffice for all but the most extreme cases if I would focus on just a single role. I haven't even played that many games (~2500 in total, I think), every serious player probably played way more. With that IP I could buy essentially all missing heroes fitting into one of the five roles and some more runes.

I am not saying that you can't get everything in the game eventually.
It isn't even a massive problem, as far as P2P goes its actually rather mild. But it is a constant and ongoing annoyance (at least until you play thousands of games).

Now, it isn't a huge problem. But if there is a choice between a LoL and another equal quality game (DOTA) without having to spend hundreds of hours unlocking all the content, then LoL loses every time.

If the runes and such *actually* made the game more fun, then I would be fine with them. But as it is, all it adds is pointless grinding.

Now, that isn't my only problem with LoL, but it is one of the largest problems.

[Chaoswizkid]

I am not saying that you can't get everything in the game eventually.

Uhh...

You will never get nearly enough IP to play properly without: buying RP's, using a single hero role (eventually you can play a few more, but that takes quite a while), or not using proper runes for your role.

Yes you are/were, at least about unlocking things for free.

If the runes and such *actually* made the game more fun, then I would be fine with them. But as it is, all it adds is pointless grinding.

How do they not make the game more fun? It allows further customization, in a mechanical sense, to benefit your playstyle rather than just rely on a playstyle difference. Considering that, it's not really pointless grinding.

[Skyrunner]

Well, if they made the runes work like masteries, where you can get them all for free, it would eliminate the grinding.

[Cthulhu]

So with barrier, flash, and easy lifesteal itemization for ranged champs, does anyone still really think ADC is a hard role?

I'm thinking the best argument we can make against League of AD Carries is the classic reductio ad oryzum:

Kayle top.  Morgana mid.  Nautilus Jungle.  Vayne and Sona bot.  Keep Vayne alive at all costs while she passively farms 400cs and then flattens the enemy team