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[woose1]

So, wait, if I'm getting this straight, Darius was basically an objectively better Garen, so Riot responded to this by nerfing the crap out of Garen?

Can someone correct me on this?

-snip- shit that I don't understand -snip-

Alright, cool. Thanks for explaining that to me. I don't agree totally with Garen becoming a tank, he always seemed more of a counter-jungler/dps/offtank-type character to me but I've probably been playing him wrong. Sucks about judgement though. 

[Bordellimies]

Don't hate on jungle karth. That fucker is as fast as Olaf.

Not hating on him, but if you ward his blue and steal it at lvl 1, he can't do jack for a while.

[Jelle]

Yeah those Garen changes are really sad.
Never been a fan of the examplar of demacia myself but I can't help but feel sorry for him. Especially with Rengar coming out giving him a run for his money when it comes to bush ambushes Garen used to be so good at.

I just don't understand these reworks though, Riot always manages to nerf the champions in the process, whilst the champions they are reworking are the UP ones that need buffs/changes to become viable.
After a while you'd start to dread the thought of riot reworking a champion that needs it. Eh this champion is no longer viable in todays lineup? Well here comes riot to finish the job and make them definite trasH :s
That's what I got from Eve and Twitch atleast, Xin is an exception I guess. So far it doesn't look good for Garen and Kat though.

[woose1]

Yeah, apparently Eve got a buff or something, but she seems even worse now. Great mobility and a good champion for map awareness, but complete trash in combat.

[Bordellimies]

Yeah, apparently Eve got a buff or something, but she seems even worse now. Great mobility and a good champion for map awareness, but complete trash in combat.

Didn't she have those exact traits before the rework?

[woose1]

Yeah, apparently Eve got a buff or something, but she seems even worse now. Great mobility and a good champion for map awareness, but complete trash in combat.

Didn't she have those exact traits before the rework?

Well that's exactly my point.

[Sonlirain]

I read the garen changes again.

What they did was basically strip the key features from his Judgement and give them to DS and Courage.

Windmill no longer removes/shortens slows but now DS removes them while courage shortens them.
On top of that courage works longer whan Judgement so you recieve shorter slows for longer than with just Judgement.
And you can start spinning to pass a minion wave when trying to run away.

Kinda handy.

[Exerosp]

I honestly don't know where you guys are going with Eve nerfs and Xin buffs. Xin gets a Darius Build, and Eve buttrapes 1v1. It's like facing a Olaf, only a good one can 1v2.

[penguinofhonor]

Also note that since Judgment scales on total AD rather than bonus, it now crits off total AD instead of just bonus. Basically, build crits and armor pen on your Garen. They're way better on him now.

I just don't understand these reworks though, Riot always manages to nerf the champions in the process, whilst the champions they are reworking are the UP ones that need buffs/changes to become viable.
After a while you'd start to dread the thought of riot reworking a champion that needs it. Eh this champion is no longer viable in todays lineup? Well here comes riot to finish the job and make them definite trasH :s
That's what I got from Eve and Twitch atleast, Xin is an exception I guess. So far it doesn't look good for Garen and Kat though.

The goal of a rework is not to make a champion viable. They'd just buff them otherwise.

edit: New champion being previewed at Gamescom! Syndra, the something or other!

[webadict]

I honestly don't know where you guys are going with Eve nerfs and Xin buffs. Xin gets a Darius Build, and Eve buttrapes 1v1. It's like facing a Olaf, only a good one can 1v2.

Eve doesn't do anything. That's all there is to say. It's like, "Oh? A lone [input any role]? USE ALL MY SKI-*dead*". She doesn't do any damage, and it's laughable to think she does.

[Sonlirain]

I honestly don't know where you guys are going with Eve nerfs and Xin buffs. Xin gets a Darius Build, and Eve buttrapes 1v1. It's like facing a Olaf, only a good one can 1v2.

Eve doesn't do anything. That's all there is to say. It's like, "Oh? A lone [input any role]? USE ALL MY SKI-*dead*". She doesn't do any damage, and it's laughable to think she does.

Eve can be deadly... one thing... she has to be fed. And to become fed she has to kill several people (preferably with the soulstealer).
Is she manages that then woe upon the enemy team because she will buttrape everyone.
If not... well you have a invisible scout... and not much else.
A character purely for pubstomping/gambling.

[frostshotgg]

The forums have quieted down other than QQ about reworks, which is to be expected. Only red (Aside from the standard non-game related topics like "Which reds have you not seen in a while") really talking right now is Xeph.

As usual, he's a goldmine of reasonable design discussion.
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2477640
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2477845

[Sharp]

Ugh I hate it when ranked queue is down. Went for a newish jungle Amumu build with Phil Stone>Boots of Mob>Sunfire Cape>Aegis of Legion>Will of the Ancients, and was going to then go Rylai's but game ended without me finishing it, was so much fun just having W on and feeling like I was invincible but the other team was terribad and I was getting fed like crazy to afford the WotA early but the sheer power of tanking everything and just regenning it all in a 5vs1 fight (ty Despair for working through CC's).

God it makes me want to use it on ranked but I know it will all end in tears because ranked queue will by resistance, and won't have a jungler playing support because two people called top and I won't be fed like a total boss, but the power of the WotA is calling to me... I pity my next ranked team...

[KaelGotDwarves]

Drunken ARAM session is GOOOOOOO!

Add KaelGotRice on NA

[penguinofhonor]

Ugh I hate it when ranked queue is down. Went for a newish jungle Amumu build with Phil Stone>Boots of Mob>Sunfire Cape>Aegis of Legion>Will of the Ancients, and was going to then go Rylai's but game ended without me finishing it, was so much fun just having W on and feeling like I was invincible but the other team was terribad and I was getting fed like crazy to afford the WotA early but the sheer power of tanking everything and just regenning it all in a 5vs1 fight (ty Despair for working through CC's).

God it makes me want to use it on ranked but I know it will all end in tears because ranked queue will by resistance, and won't have a jungler playing support because two people called top and I won't be fed like a total boss, but the power of the WotA is calling to me... I pity my next ranked team...

Not gonna lie, you really shouldn't have your build planned out pregame. Builds should be reactive.

edit: why did i pick mundo, i'm terrible at mundo