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Author Topic: League of Legends - Patch 7.22 - Runes Reforged  (Read 1270303 times)

Wiles

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9810 on: August 24, 2012, 09:51:07 am »

Diana's q base damage and ratio have been slightly nerfed on the PBE.

EDIT: Updated with numbers

Quote
Diana
Crescent Strike damage reduced to70/110/150/190/230 (+0.7*AP) from 80/125/170/215/260 (+0.8*AP).
Lunar Rush's cooldown increased to 25/20/15 seconds from 20/16/12 seconds.
Base HP/5 reduced to 6 from 9.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2012, 10:56:47 am by Wiles »
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Akhier the Dragon hearted

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9811 on: August 24, 2012, 10:16:48 am »

   Okay thanks, not quite what I was hoping for but I guess if the hardest part ends up being memorizing items I will be quite happy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrDT7r_dFbQ
   Cool, did not know Quill had LoL videos. Guess I have something else to watch on YouTube. Thanks for the link!
I didn't know neither that nor that Quill was known on Bay12.
   I don't know if he is known on Bay12 but I know him because of his Civ4 videos. Every once and a while I want to watch videos for a game and at one point it was Civ4 and he had some of the better ones out there. Though I do prefer TheMeInTeam's Civ4 videos more.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9812 on: August 24, 2012, 11:41:49 am »

Hecarim is just ridiculously strong. I can't get over it. His ganking is just so much stronger since the E and R changes, and he just has stupid amounts of damage.

Also I've now played with eight rengars. I still haven't seen one with less than 7 deaths. Apparently he has like a 35% win rate right now, which is pretty consistent across all elos. I'm looking forward to those buffs.
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Astral

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9813 on: August 24, 2012, 02:02:16 pm »

To put it into perspective: He's a new champion. People are still trying to figure out how to play him. Lee Sin was considered terrible until they got the hang of him, then he was overpowered and nerfed.

I think I've got him down for the most part, as a Swain who had the horror of laning against me top may attest. Jumping from bushes with an Empowered Q, which hit him for approximately 250-300 damage at level 1 of the skill, smacking him with another Q to nearly kill him, then Bola and W to finish him off. All in the course of about 3 seconds. If the jungle tries to gank without having some form of vision, saving your ultimate for escapes is immensely preferable to dying for no reason. I don't think I ever got wards when playing as him, though the Swain bought some invisibility revealing ones for ganks. Other than that, the ultimate does feel fairly lackluster, but it's great as an early warning system for teamfights, and a "I'm going to target you and there's nothing your team can do about it" ability for sneaking through the enemy team so you can single out the squishy while everyone's attention is focused elsewhere is nice.

His burst is godly, but his sustainable damage suffers from "How much CDR can I get without sacrificing survivability." I found that grabbing Merc Treads, Bonetooth Necklace, Frozen Mallet, Ghostblade, Atma's and Zeke's gives him a good balance of survivability and damage output, as well as some much needed CDR. With my current CDR blue's, I get the full 40% reduction with this build and 3 kills on the Necklace. With the current Reds, Quints and Masteries, base 31 Armor Penetration, +10 from his Necklace, and +20 from Ghostblade. It does feel a lot like I'm building Olaf minus one item, but he feels much less squishy when I do so. The fact that his Necklace also gives a base 10 AD + 2 per level means that for 800 gold you've got an item that scales almost to a BF sword at 18. It does feel a bit lackluster as well overall, though, at least until you start getting kills on it.

Trinity Force builds capitalize on his burst a lot more, but he falls apart when focused, which is not something you want to have happen as a melee bruiser. I may work on trying to work this into a build, but it may come at the cost of Frozen Mallet or possibly the Necklace... or just survivability in general. Warmogs/Mallet and Atma's should be core on his build, really, since he needs the health.

The buffs will definitely be welcomed, though. I do have minor issues depending on who I'm laning against top, in particular Teemo because fuck that fuzzy little boyscout. Other top laners will usually be melee and easier to position against, as well as abuse the 15% health heal on his Empowered W.

I have not been impressed by Rengar. Probably because I recently pwned one as the Taric half of a Taric/Ashe laning duo.

His main problem was that he isn't really meant to be laning with someone. He's great as a solo and as a jungle, but falls short in a duo lane due to being bursty and nothing else at low levels. If you have a way to counter that burst or stop him from performing it, then he's effectively useless. Taric having a heal and a reliable stun is pretty much a double counter for him, not counting the perma slow Ashe.
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RedKing

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9814 on: August 24, 2012, 02:32:35 pm »

I have not been impressed by Rengar. Probably because I recently pwned one as the Taric half of a Taric/Ashe laning duo.

His main problem was that he isn't really meant to be laning with someone. He's great as a solo and as a jungle, but falls short in a duo lane due to being bursty and nothing else at low levels. If you have a way to counter that burst or stop him from performing it, then he's effectively useless. Taric having a heal and a reliable stun is pretty much a double counter for him, not counting the perma slow Ashe.

Well and without ArPen early on, Taric can bulk up that armor and Rengar's pounce just kinda bounces off. That low CDR stun is brutal against most "pouncing" type melee champs in general, unless their pounce comes with a disable (damn Warwick ult...)
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Bordellimies

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9815 on: August 24, 2012, 02:39:11 pm »

To put it into perspective: He's a new champion.
Darius, Xin, etc. They were new once, but raped everything.
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Wiles

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9816 on: August 24, 2012, 02:52:38 pm »

To put it into perspective: He's a new champion.
Darius, Xin, etc. They were new once, but raped everything.

I don't know if Xin is a good example, he was blatantly overpowered on release. Darius is pretty strong as well.

That being said I do think Rengar needs some tweaks. Chasing your enemy through brush can be a nightmare when you keep stopping to jump instead of auto-attacking. 
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Bordellimies

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9817 on: August 24, 2012, 04:08:32 pm »

To put it into perspective: He's a new champion.
Darius, Xin, etc. They were new once, but raped everything.

I don't know if Xin is a good example, he was blatantly overpowered on release. Darius is pretty strong as well.

That being said I do think Rengar needs some tweaks. Chasing your enemy through brush can be a nightmare when you keep stopping to jump instead of auto-attacking.
Isn't that the point? Some champions are underpowered or balanced during release, which often means they aren't palyed much and people beg for buffs. Champs still get released quite often overpowered though.
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webadict

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9818 on: August 24, 2012, 10:09:27 pm »

ARAM?
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Frumple

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9819 on: August 24, 2012, 11:48:10 pm »

Totes would have been down if it'd been about... two-three hours before your post :-\

Darn inconsistent actual!computer access.
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Astral

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9820 on: August 25, 2012, 12:00:06 am »

To put it into perspective: He's a new champion.
Darius, Xin, etc. They were new once, but raped everything.

I don't know if Xin is a good example, he was blatantly overpowered on release. Darius is pretty strong as well.

That being said I do think Rengar needs some tweaks. Chasing your enemy through brush can be a nightmare when you keep stopping to jump instead of auto-attacking.
Isn't that the point? Some champions are underpowered or balanced during release, which often means they aren't palyed much and people beg for buffs. Champs still get released quite often overpowered though.

[tinfoil]
I think they get released overpowered so that Riot gets more sales off of new champions and skins released for them at the time. That way people abuse them in their time of being overpowered, they get nerfed to be more or less in line with other champions later down the road, and then Riot already has their money.

I bet sales of Xin soared after his remake.
[/tinfoil]
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webadict

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9821 on: August 25, 2012, 01:31:37 am »

So, I played Diana a bit and I think I figured why she's so strong.

Look at her skills:

Passive: She gains 20% AS and extra AoE damage every third attack based on her AP.
This passive by itself is not too strong. HOWEVER, this damage procs on tower attacks, making her a very strong tower pusher. Not only that, but the damage is pretty significant for the scaling.

Q: Crescent attack plus some aoe at the end.
This is her most overpowered skill. It has a low cooldown, low mana cost, and does massive damage. It scales well and has high base damage (More powerful than her ult!) It also isn't that hard to aim.

W: Shield plus 3 damage orbs that might add more shield
This is her second overpowered ability. Combine this skill with her ult and E and you have a lot of survivability plus a lot of damage and no way to escape. This skill wouldn't be so bad by itself, but with the ult to make it a really good initiation plus a low cooldown and mana cost, this skill is amazing.

E: mini aoe pull and slow
This skill is fine. It does no damage, but it totally could if they tone down the other skills.

R: Akali's ult
This skill isn't even bad! The problem is that it combines with the Q, which is the overpowered skill. So, you get to double proc this skill on someone. Plus, if you miss your Q, this skill has such a low cooldown that it doesn't matter if you use it. It isn't the nuking spell. That's your Q and W. You can still use W, but it won't be as strong without Q.

Her skills favor her Q heavily. If she misses her Q, she has to wait a little bit, but otherwise, she gets no serious repercussions. Otherwise, everything just scales too well, as well.

I can see they're trying to balance out the fact she's a melee AP jungler, but they really overdid it in a lot of parts. She's meant to stay on par with junglers, so she got jungle speed (Q + R, Passive, W, low cooldowns), Sustain (Low mana costs, W), CC (E), and a fair amount of base tankiness. But, she also got burst (Q + R + R + W) and a lot of it is fairly AoE (not reliably, though) along with low cooldowns, so she can sustain the burst. Combine this last part with low mana costs, and she can just keep swinging Qs until she hits. If you harass back, she can shield. You will run out of mana before she does.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9822 on: August 25, 2012, 02:28:01 pm »

I'm glad they're nerfing her Q. I feel like it's the part of her kit that least deserves having a ton of damage loaded onto it.
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V-Norrec

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9823 on: August 25, 2012, 03:48:44 pm »

As I've been maining jungle Diana since she came out, this makes me sad.  Any numbers out yet and a list of full notes, since I usually don't keep up with the patches and just roll with whatever comes my way.

frostshotgg

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Re: League of Legends Updated! - Rengar, the Pridestalker - 1.0.0.145
« Reply #9824 on: August 25, 2012, 04:03:15 pm »

Her Q should be a spell you use so you can get more damage from R. Take a lot of damage off Q (50 or more), add it to R, and increase R's cooldown to something like 40. Now Diana is about using Q into R to harass (Which places her in melee range, a bad place to be for harass), and if she screws up the combo, she's actually punished instead of having a cooldown that's barely 6 seconds more than Q anyways.
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