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[scriver]

Hi there Hugo, and welcome to our little community. Don't worry, your improvements are planned for the future; however, implementation will take the time it takes and they might not be included among the features of the next planned releases. There's always feature creep I guess (just look at what was planned for Release 1 and what it has become), so you could always have some hope for that.

However, while at least I and I'm sure others enjoyed your well thought-out post, this thread was not intended as a suggestion thread as we already have a forum for that, and any future suggestions would be more fit to go there. This thread is more for asking questions to Toady about the current development as well as discussion of, well, the current development.

Also I'm sorry for sounding so overly formal. It always happens when I try to write posts like this.

[Greiger]

Toady rolled his ankle in a parking lot!   Clearly we are failing our bodyguard duties.  Where was the agent with futuresight to protect the ankle?  Where was the instant teleporting ankle brace that is supposed to teleport into position at the exact moment it is needed to prevent injury?  Where is the level 85 druid to spam lifeblooms and regrowths to hasten the healing?

We must protect the Toady and the Threetoe!  We're looking as disorganized and ineffectual as those silly Free Masons here for Armok's sake!

P.S. Get better soon!

[Neonivek]

I actually don't know what "Rolling over your ankle" even is. Is it like what I do sometimes and step on my ankle? I admit after doing it 3 or 4 times in a row it certainly felt sprained.

[Cruxador]

I actually don't know what "Rolling over your ankle" even is. Is it like what I do sometimes and step on my ankle? I admit after doing it 3 or 4 times in a row it certainly felt sprained.

I assume it means he stepped wrong such that weight wasn't distributed on his ankle in the way that it's designed for, and the ankle was thus damaged.

[Footkerchief]

How extensive are you planning on making magic be? Will it simply be useful in combat or for necromancing up minions? Or will you be able to do more complex things, like enchanting objects or using spells that affect other people's actions?

In this version, just the former plus some vampire-type stuff, although modders may discover interesting possibilities.  Enchanted objects, allegiance changes etc. would ideally be covered by a complete magic system, but won't be possible with the next update.

Ok heres one from me: Do you intend to, any time soon, ad and actual world goal mechanism. By that I mean, will the worldgen also make give the world a specific reason or something that it has to do. For instance- Before time There was a spirit that rebelled against the rest of the spirits and it sought to destroy the world that they had all made(Thats a sort of bad vs good) or something like three dudes who made the world now at war with each other or maybe even nothing at all. What are your thoughts on that?

This has been covered recently:

Ideas where different manifestations of magic have underlying structural connections with the world are good.  We're probably going to be adding different metaphysical systems along the lines of how a creation story using a pantheon might generate pre-world-gen events, and it'd answer all the big questions like "what happens when you die?", "what happens when you dream?", "why do we exist?", "is there a purpose to existence?", "what are emotions?" etc. etc., and gods, planes of existence, magical systems and whatever else can provide answers to these questions that further manifest themselves as part of a magic system (or the world could be utterly mundane as desired).  When we do this, we'll be in a position where we are using our own ideas and continuing to look through suggestions and just using the best and easiest stuff at first, and that'll be how magic manifests itself.

Look the only point that in Dwarf Fortress Evil seems to be a force. Curses exist, cursed lands exist (as well as their mechanics to become cursed), and even creatures who are evil exist. Yet good is fanciful and just as destructive and dangerous to all life. There is no benevolence only malevolence.

which is what is essentially the question

Where is the Benevolence?

Tranquil, constructive, balance-seeking entities come up in ThreeToe's stories as forest spirits etc.

I've gotta ask, will there ever be ways to just... do stuff? Like, if I wanted to do a dance on the corpse of a hydra I could go into a menu and select 'dance' from a list while standing on the hydra? Maybe do stuff like yelling at enemies during battle, or taunts?

A generic "do stuff" system is the holy grail of videogames -- because it's impossibly hard and basically implies AI and supercomputers.  Those examples could be implemented individually, but due to finite resources, that'll only happen if they're pertinent to the setting/gameplay.

Now that we have books, secrets can still be find on slabs? There other places people can learn secrets?

Do apprentices learn the secrets directly from their masters or by using books/slabs found on their towers?

Only necromancers can have apprentices or the system will also allow other historical figures to have apprentices?

I see no reason to think books have made slabs obselete.

Since apprenticeships only occur in world gen, it's probably abstracted out.

If the system had been extended to other types of historical figures, we'd have heard about it.

According to the latest devblog, the layout of towers were generated on arriving in an area, rather than during worldgen. Is this true of all worldgen locations?

I think so.  I don't know of any low-level, fully fleshed-out maps that are created during world generation.

Is crafting (or perhaps paying others to craft for you, putting those lazy human weaponsmiths/armorsmiths/clothiers to good use!), planned for an official DF Adventurer mode update?

All kinds of stuff under "Basic Adventure Mode Skills".

Will the combat system ever support blowing holes through someone if a projectile is shot with enough force? Right now it just propells the target creature back.

I know Toady discussed exit wounds in an older FotF thread, but I can't find the post

[monk12]

Toady rolled his ankle in a parking lot!   Clearly we are failing our bodyguard duties.  Where was the agent with futuresight to protect the ankle?  Where was the instant teleporting ankle brace that is supposed to teleport into position at the exact moment it is needed to prevent injury?  Where is the level 85 druid to spam lifeblooms and regrowths to hasten the healing?

We must protect the Toady and the Threetoe!  We're looking as disorganized and ineffectual as those silly Free Masons here for Armok's sake!

P.S. Get better soon!

Monk12 uses Future Sight! It's not very effective...

[Neonivek]

Tranquil, constructive, balance-seeking entities come up in ThreeToe's stories as forest spirits etc

Oddly enough these have been Antagonistic and malevolent as well. These very same creatures already exist in the game and they as destructive as their violent, destructive, and chaotic brothers.

Also Tranquil, Constructive, and Balance Seeking are not benevolent. It is why I used that word and not "good" or "Nice" or "peaceful".

Also I was hardly asking for a Threetoe Non-canon summation of my question. They are Threetoe writing whatever he likes while Toady thinks about it in terms of possible features.

Because I know the implication of Footkerchief answering one of your questions. I'll actually respond to it in full later.

[Rose]

ah, but you see, Threetoe is canon.

Him and Toady work together on the stories to flesh out what they want to happen in the game. If it's in one of his stories, it's canon, and odds are, given infinite time, it'll be in the game.

[DG]

Toady rolled his ankle in a parking lot!   Clearly we are failing our bodyguard duties.  Where was the agent with futuresight to protect the ankle?  Where was the instant teleporting ankle brace that is supposed to teleport into position at the exact moment it is needed to prevent injury?  Where is the level 85 druid to spam lifeblooms and regrowths to hasten the healing?

We must protect the Toady and the Threetoe!  We're looking as disorganized and ineffectual as those silly Free Masons here for Armok's sake!

P.S. Get better soon!

Monk12 uses Future Sight! It's not very effective...

You need to organise a squad of ten to carry a sedan chair. Only four members should be active at once to prevent bad thoughts from overly long duty time.

[Neonivek]

ah, but you see, Threetoe is canon.

Within the context of his own stories. Read the features section and you will see why it is often... to say the least tenuious (if that is the correct word)

[Footkerchief]

Oddly enough these have been Antagonistic and malevolent as well. These very same creatures already exist in the game and they as destructive as their violent, destructive, and chaotic brothers.

If you mean the forest titans etc, I don't think those are meant to be exactly the same as forest spirits.

Also Tranquil, Constructive, and Balance Seeking are not benevolent. It is why I used that word and not "good" or "Nice" or "peaceful".

What sort of actions would be associated with a benevolent force?

Because I know the implication of Footkerchief answering one of your questions. I'll actually respond to it in full later.

I wasn't answering that question so much as bringing up a point of discussion.

[Neonivek]

What sort of actions would be associated with a benevolent force?

I wasn't answering that question so much as bringing up a point of discussion.

Really? Whee! I was worried my question was outright negated >_> (which always stinks when it happens)

Anyhow a benevolent force is giving, nuturing, and generally a "benefit" (so to speak).

The reason why "good" or even "peace" isn't nessisarily benevolent is because for the sake of peace one can slaughter a nation, to purge the world of evil one can plunge the world into death.

A Benevolent force whos prime goal is the benefit of all around it. A Restless Spirit of a great doctor who cures the sick, a Tree that gives of its own fruits, or a great water spirit who gives those dying in the desert live giving water and who do so for no benefit of their own (no alterior motives).

The "Good lands" is possibly the best example of a good as malevolent, though probably through no fault of its own. Sure it looks like a magical wonderland, but just like the real wonderland it is brimming with danger and the average being of good is antagonistic towards those that are not simply because to those bathed in nothing but good, the minds of one who is not is vile evil.

My question is with a world filled with dangerous and evil forces who want nothing but to rip you to shreds, who use people to their own ends, who don the cloak of good and stab those around them. Where is the benevolent forces? Supernatural Beings whos goal is the genuin good, lands that actively benefit those that reside in them, and heck even Altruism in the culture themself.

Mind you I am not blind to the fact that benevolent forces can in essence be harmful in that they can help the wrong kind of people. A Spirit Doctor could only heal bandits, being once one himself.

[monk12]

Come to think of it, I recall being attacked by a monster that "radiated an aura of peace and friendship" or some shit like that- from what I recall, it was pretty much the same as any other Titan, nothing special.


Found it!
"it emanates an aura of giving and kindness"

Towards the bottom of the Worldgen strings, in with the other randomly generated pieces. Also of note are "it bears a look of unbelievable peace," "joy marks its every movement," and "it moves its will in accordance with the truth of things."

So yes, it appears that altruistic creatures are planned. The likely reason they aren't in yet is because it is much more interesting and immediate, from a gameplay perspective, to have random creatures make life worse for you than have them make it better. Making it Better is what your adventurer is supposed to be doing, after all, and if Random Acts of Good counteract the Random Acts of Evil, then your hero's to-do list gets markedly shorter.

Lest my position be misunderstood, I am fully in favor of truly benevolent critters and look forward to Good Fairies, Shoe-making Elves, Friendly Oracles and whatever all else is bound to make it in- it's just fairly inevitable that Evil gets in before Good (using those terms loosely, anyway.)

[Neonivek]

"it emanates an aura of giving and kindness"

It gives pain and you end up Kinda in peices.

[NobodyPro]

"it emanates an aura of giving and kindness"

IIRC, Toady said that this happens when a titan comes from a 'good' area. They can't be any kind of carrion animal and have that description despite their murderous tendencies.