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[Thundercraft]

Amazing developments!
With the introduction of these improvements on nightcreatures and undead, it sounds like we might get to see the beginnings of magic and (eventually) an expansion on syndromes.

Posting to watch thread.

[NSQuote]

Will we see non-human towns (such as mountain homes, goblin forts, and elf forest retreats) return sometime during the nine releases?

[PremierMeridian]

Posting to track....


GOOD WORK TOADY

[scriver]

Will we see non-human towns (such as mountain homes, goblin forts, and elf forest retreats) return sometime during the nine releases?

Toady has stated before that we shouldn't expect non-human settlements until the army arc comes around.

[Dradym]

i think these secrets and curses will end up(eventually) being "randomly" generated, like the gods, people, world currently does. so youll see a lot of wierd-ass things when it comes time to release this feature in full.

as for the good/evil-life/death thing, i could totally see a life priest raising the dead-seeing it as a form of continuing life-though not dominating it unless the life priest IS evil, or from a slavery-loving nation. oooo imagine a dwarf shop in fortress mode that raises the dead so they can be put back to work-though would contribute to unhappy thoughts among the living...

[NW_Kohaku]

as for the good/evil-life/death thing, i could totally see a life priest raising the dead-seeing it as a form of continuing life-though not dominating it unless the life priest IS evil, or from a slavery-loving nation.

I really can't...

Death is a part of the cycle of Life, no matter how you break it down.  Whether you see life as represented by nature (death is natural), or a "good god" with a "heaven" afterlife (you're stealing paradise from the goodly dead by bringing them back), or just the Ouroborus and its symbolic cycle of life and death, life means having to die and be replaced by other living things.

Besides, what's the point in having an "opposite of undead" that involves basically doing the same thing as raising the undead, but making them "look prettier" when you do it?  That takes away the whole point of someone being tempted into raising zombies while looking for eternal life in the first place.

If something is going to be "opposite" of, "I want to live forever, even if it means being a zombie to do it," then it should be, "I am fine with dying one day, as that is my place in life."

[Dae]

Obviously, you don't agree. Can you imagine some people think about it in a different way or are mad enough to not want to know any better ?

Imagine a priest can make the dead come back for a little time with their full mind so they can explain the circumstances of their death or say goodbye to their families, with the cost that his soul promptly leaves its body - again - and its corpse now tries to kill every living thing. Wouldn't that be interesting ? That's  a thing I love in DF : you never know what's going in next. I was totally taken aback by the whole "secrets" thing and it kicks randomization up one level. So much Fun to be had !

[Cruxador]

as for the good/evil-life/death thing, i could totally see a life priest raising the dead-seeing it as a form of continuing life-though not dominating it unless the life priest IS evil, or from a slavery-loving nation.

I really can't...

Death is a part of the cycle of Life, no matter how you break it down.  Whether you see life as represented by nature (death is natural), or a "good god" with a "heaven" afterlife (you're stealing paradise from the goodly dead by bringing them back), or just the Ouroborus and its symbolic cycle of life and death, life means having to die and be replaced by other living things.

Besides, what's the point in having an "opposite of undead" that involves basically doing the same thing as raising the undead, but making them "look prettier" when you do it?  That takes away the whole point of someone being tempted into raising zombies while looking for eternal life in the first place.

If something is going to be "opposite" of, "I want to live forever, even if it means being a zombie to do it," then it should be, "I am fine with dying one day, as that is my place in life."

Keep in mind the separation of soul and body in DF, and the possibilities of raising them separately or together, and the implications thereof.

[Thundercraft]

Obviously, you don't agree.

He's not the only one. I think if we did a poll for this, many more would disagree than agree.

It seems obvious that there's something not quite right about having a life priest - someone who worships and respects the natural life cycle - to use a curse or abuse the secrets of life and undeath - to trample on said cycle of life and death. Besides, there is a long-standing tradition in fantasy genres - almost without exception - that necromancy and life magic are complete opposites.

Imagine a priest can make the dead come back for a little time with their full mind so they can explain the circumstances of their death or say goodbye to their families.

...A big Maybe. But only in the form of a non-corporeal ghost that would naturally dissipate after those goodbyes are said and done. Even then, technically, that would be considered a form of necromancy or death magic. (Read the Wikipedia entry on necromancy for clarification on the term.)

...and its corpse now tries to kill every living thing.

Are you being serious?  A life priest raising the dead, knowing full well that it would go on a rampage and start killing everything in sight? That only makes sense if the life priest went completely insane.

[Willfor]

RE: Today's devlog:

Unlimited power can be ours. All we need to do is avoid crocs, mummies, and hell itself, and we can grab the brass slabs of the gods.

BY THE POWER OF SPOTHRIB

[tfaal]

Obviously, you don't agree.

He's not the only one. I think if we did a poll for this, many more would disagree than agree.

It seems obvious that there's something not quite right about having a life priest - someone who worships and respects the natural life cycle - to use a curse or abuse the secrets of life and undeath - to trample on said cycle of life and death. Besides, there is a long-standing tradition in fantasy genres - almost without exception - that necromancy and life magic are complete opposites.

Well, in Christian lore, Jesus was divine, and he raised the dead. And as for the fantasty tradition aspect, it's a matter of taste, but I always enjoy seeing those things subverted. Randomly generated content is great for that, since it has no expectations except the ones coded in. Also, bear in mind that it's an interaction. That's only a curse if it does curse-like things.

[Cthulhu]

The real question, though, is if adventurers will be able to use them.

Man, I can't wait for the adventurer skills arc.  Who cares about dorfs?  I want to take over the world as a necromancer in a big obsidian tower.

[Uristocrat]

I've heard a lot of talk about "secrets" lately.  Is the Dungeon Master's ability to tame exotic creatures also going to be one of these "secrets"?

[monk12]

Right now all you have to do is hit them with a shovel.

But... but... there are no shovels in the game! *panics*

Isn't it obvious?  Threetoe has betrayed his brother and has started playing Minecraft.

If he's beating zombies about the head with a shovel, he's playing Minecraft poorly.

Or awesomely. Come to think of it, those two things are not mutually exclusive.

[KillerClowns]

"Issha Goodpondered." What an ironic* name. He/she certainly got something to ponder, that's for sure. Personally, I look forward to finding these unholy relics in Legends mode, and hopefully taking their power for myself.

*Ironic: "both coincidental and contradictory in a humorous or poignant and extremely improbable way."