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[IronyOwl]

Spoiler: Turn (click to show/hide)

Racial Stats:

+2 Research
+2 Production
+2 Special Projects

-2 Loyalty Recovery

175 environment

Civilian Transport Capacity: 6

Movement
------------------
(3,7)
   Fleet 1
      FF Count 3 (15/15)
      CO Transport 5 [L] (3/3)
      CO Transport 6 [L] (3/3)
      Hold position

(3,7)
   Fleet 1
      FF Count 1 (15/15)
      FF Count 2 (15/15)
      CO Transport 1 [L] (3/3)
      CO Transport 2 [L] (3/3)
      CO Transport 3 [L] (3/3)
      CO Transport 4 [L] (3/3)
      Assault (5,8) using traditional methods
------------------

Production
------------------
1 (10 , 100 , 175 , 100 , 8247 , 7746.6):
   p = 7746 * 10 * 1.2 (rac) * 1.46 (tec) = 135,709
   c = 7746 * 1.33 [tec] * 1(loyalty) = 10,302c
        t = 0

24 (3 , 96 , 271 , 100 , 59 , 56.8 ):
   p = 56 * 10 * 0.96 (q) * 1 (loy) * 1.2(rac) * 1.46 (tec) = 941
   c = 56 * 1.33 [tec] * 1 (loyalty) = 74c
        t = 0

34 (10 , 102 , 48 , 100 , 16 , 15.6):
   p = 15 * 10 * 1.02 (q) * 1 (loy) * 1.2(rac) * 1.46 (tec) = 268
   c = 15 * 1.33 [tec] * 1 (loyalty) = 19c
        t = 0
------------------

Consumption
------------------
1:
   Ships = 90,000 = 90,000/30,000 DD Trader = 3 DD Traders
   Manufactories = 6281p * 1.21 [tec] = 7600 = 76 manufactories
   Terraforming =  0
   Technology = 39,428p * 1.2 (rac) * 1.33 (tec) = 62,927
   Loyalty = 0c
   Environment Upkeep =  0c
   Total = 135,709p

24:
   Ships = 0
   Manufactories = 0p * 1.21 [tec] = 0 = 0 manufactories
   Terraforming = (941p + 8059c) * 1.33 [tec] = 11970 = 8% improvement next turn [1036/1500]
   Technology = 0
   Loyalty = 0
   Environment Upkeep =  96 (env dif) / 20 * 56.8 (pop) = 273c
   Total = 941p + 8332c

34:
   Ships = 0
   Manufactories = (268p + 228c) * 1.21 [tec] = 600 = 6 manufactories
   Terraforming =  (0p + 0c) * 1.33 [tec] = 0 = 0% improvement next turn [456/5000]
   Technology = 0
   Loyalty = 0
   Environment Upkeep =  127 (env dif) / 20 * 15.6 (pop) = 100c
   Total = 268p + 328c
   
------------------

Research
------------------
62,927 total
62,927 Production
------------------

Trade Routes
------------------
None

Treasury
------------------
Last turn balance: 3159c
Colonial Income: 10,395c
Consumption: -8,660c
Trade income: 0c
Fleet Upkeep: -4200c
Interest: 0c
Balance next turn: 694c
------------------

Growth
------------------
1 (10 , 100 , 175 , 100 , 8247 , 7746.6)
   Growth = ((0.05 * 1.46) [growth rate] - (0 [enviro_away_from_ideal] * .0005) ) * 7746.6 [pop] = 565.5
   Civilian Transport = -6
   Manufactory = 76
   Terraforming = 0
   Loyalty = 0
   (10 , 100 , 175 , 100 , 8247 , 8312.1)

24 (3 , 96 , 271 , 100 , 59 , 56.8 )
   Growth = ((0.05 * 1.46) [growth rate] * 1 [loy] - (96 [enviro_away_from_ideal] * .0005) ) * 56.8 [pop] = 1.4
   Manufactory = 0
   Terraforming = 8 [1036/1500]
   Loyalty = 0
   (3 , 96 , 263 , 100 , 59 , 58.2)

34 (10 , 102 , 48 , 100 , 16 , 15.6)
   Growth = ((0.05 * 1.46) [growth rate] * 1 [loy] - (127 [enviro_away_from_ideal] * .0005) ) * 15.6 [pop] = 0.1
   Civilian Transport = 6
   Manufactory = 6
   Terraforming = 0 [456/5000]
   Loyalty = 0
   (10 , 102 , 48 , 100 , 22 , 21.7)

Busy busy busy. Can trade production be applied anywhere or what? Do established trading vessels still require upkeep?

Also space eels.

[Nirur Torir]

Busy busy busy. Can trade production be applied anywhere or what? Do established trading vessels still require upkeep?

Trade routes only take place between two different-race planets. Only the two planets get the production boost. The two planets cannot be switched without destroying the route (and ship, which is given to civilians when the route is established).
Established trade routes do not require upkeep.

The starting tech of Trade Routes II only allows two trade routes. Of course, you may build as many trading ships as you want and send them on their way before then.

[IronyOwl]

But in theory, and with enough Trade Route techs, every planet of mine could be connected to every single other non-me planet in the known galaxy?

And yes, I'm aware of the limit. I doubt it'll be an issue by the time it comes up.



Also, I don't think Vanigo's ship upkeep changed when his trader reached its destination, but I wouldn't know for sure.

[Neyvn]

Its odd...
For some reason I just can't seem to wrap my head around the math, I could at the start but now... Its all Greek to me...

[IronyOwl]

I'd suggest making a spreadsheet, if you're able.

What is it you can't wrap your head around, though? There must be some point at which it stops being "Oh that's a + sign, I know what that does" and starts being "...uh..."

[Neyvn]

I'd suggest making a spreadsheet, if you're able.

What is it you can't wrap your head around, though? There must be some point at which it stops being "Oh that's a + sign, I know what that does" and starts being "...uh..."

Mainly Population and that for the second planet...

[Nirur Torir]

I do like making math more complex then it needs to be.

Anyone mind if I delete loyalty entirely, though? It's bothersome to track, and is mostly just an annoyance.

But in theory, and with enough Trade Route techs, every planet of mine could be connected to every single other non-me planet in the known galaxy?

Technically, yes. However, there are diminishing returns for each extra route at a planet, and, with ramping tech costs, the total RP cost to get 32 trade routes each at 8 planets would be ... greater then the number of water molecules on Earth.

[IronyOwl]

Population is relatively simple, the main thing is weirdness with how environment works. The formula is:


(A - B) * C



A is growth rate, which is:

0.055 (base rate, higher than normal because of your racial bonus) * 1.21 (modifier from pop growth tech) * 0.6 (loyalty, which should have increased last turn from 50% to 60%, or higher if you bought them off) = 0.03993 for you this turn



B is environmental penalty, which varies by planet. The actual formula is:

(difference between ideal and current environments * 0.0005)

You can get the difference by subtracting your race's ideal environment from the planet's current one, or vice versa, and then making it positive. So Ideal 50 and Current 100 would be the same as Ideal 100 and Current 50, since it's 50 points from current situation to ideal situation either way.

In the case of Planet 3, the difference is 0, so the penalty is 0 * 0.0005, which is also 0, so no worries there. On Planet 15, the ideal is still 160, but the current environment is 50, so we get |50 - 160| or |160 - 50|, which gives us 110 either way. You could also just eyeball it and notice that they're 110 apart, but that gets messy for most numbers.

Thus, Planet 15's environmental penalty is (110 * 0.0005), or 0.055


Combining the (A - B) part of the equation gives us 0.03993 (your total growth rate) - 0.055 (your environmental penalty) = -0.01507, which is your total growth modifier. This is then multiplied by C, which is just your current population, in this case 5.8 (apparently your colonists arrived from last round).

Thus, we get a grand total of (-0.01507 * 5. = -0.087406, which unfortunately rounds the opposite way you'd prefer to -0.1





More generally speaking, your new colony has two differences from your main one- lower loyalty, and an imperfect environment.

Loyalty is applied as a modifier to production, taxes, and population growth, so a world with 50% loyalty will produce half as much production, pay half as many taxes, and grow slower (though not exactly half as slow, usually).

Environmental difference is applied as a penalty to population growth and helps determine environmental upkeep, which is 0 for a world with perfect environment.

Anyone mind if I delete loyalty entirely, though? It's bothersome to track, and is mostly just an annoyance.

I kind of like it, though I'm not sure if it's worth it or not. Also my racial penalty is to loyalty gain, so...

[Vanigo]

Anyone mind if I delete loyalty entirely, though? It's bothersome to track, and is mostly just an annoyance.

I'd need to get a different bonus in place of loyalty recovery...
It's a pretty significant concern for newly-conquered worlds. Ditching it would mean there's no reason to consider using the exterminate option (unless maybe you think someone else will conquer it soon). And a loyalty-reducing bombing campaign before an invasion is a perfectly legitimate strategy.

[IronyOwl]

Might wanna PM-prod evilcherry.

[Neyvn]

Seems my Mathbrain part has gone on holiday, I still can't seem to wrap me head around it. I am gonna have to pull sorry...
I get headaches when I look at all the numbers. Gah why!!!

[evilcherry]

uber, uber busy.

[Nirur Torir]

I don't feel comfortable GMing for a 'player' faction in a game with no transparency, and I don't think we're likely to get any more replacements. I don't particularly want to restart again. The game wasn't designed for three players, and I feel that the lack of diplomacy and warfare from only having three players is quite detrimental to the game overall. (Vanigo's also in a rather bad position for a three player game.)

Vote on what happens to the game. I'm inclined to just reveal the secret GM stuff and declare it dead, but am willing to continue GMing.

[IronyOwl]

I'm really not sure. I don't want the game to die, but I'm not sure we've got any good options for making it live.

[RulerOfNothing]

Is it still feasible for a new player to join?